a700hitter

I don't see Selig as having enough guts to put together a trade for Garza. That is probably beyond his authority.

Garza makes more than they have been offering Oswalt and Jackson, plus he has put in for a big award in arbitration. I can't see there being a deal for Garza until the arbitration issue is settled.

This doesn't make a lot of sense.

He threw off a mound?

He's not even invited to Spring Training and I doubt that he can hold down a spot on AAA Pawtucket. They shouldn't even waste their time with guys like this. In the time they spend paying attention to wastes like this maybe they are diverting their attention away from more important matters like the fact that Wheeler would sign for $900 k or that Sergio Santos was available.

I voted that we will get neither. Unless all the reports are posturing for the negotiations, it doesn't seem like they are very motivated to get either of these guys.

Other than length, one contract has an average annual value of $22 million and the other $22.5 Million. I am still not seeing the big difference. As far as your comment about prospects, I do think the highest and best use of prospects is to trade them for stars, but if you can get the same star for the same $ without throwing in the prospects, I would rather just pay the money and keep the prospects to trade for some one else. Is that so hard for you to understand?

I've changed philosophies? You are rambling and making no sense other than trying to provoke me. We don't run the team. We are fans. We don't know their finances. This off season they have maintained that they would be willing to go over the LT cap, but they have acted otherwise, and we are hearing that they are already over the cap. None of us knows about their finances or what considerations enter into their budgets. All we know is what moves they make. That's what we discuss. Philosophy? I don't even know what you mean. Changing philosophy? I really don't have a clue what the hell you are talking about. You want to call me out for Carl Crawford? He's played one year of his contract. Let's take the E1 approach and wait and see. I still think he will earn his money if injury doesn't interfere. Again, his contract wasn't the problem this offseason. The problem is the $29 million that they will have to flush down the toilet for Dice K, Lackey and Jenks who will contribute nothing in 2012. There is also the $3 - $7 million that will be overpaid for Ortiz. You want to call me out on Crawford? Go right ahead. If I end up being wrong about him, I didn't have a gun to Theo's head. If he ends up being a mistake, it's still a FO mistake, not a fan mistake. BTW: You want to talk about being consistent? You compared AGon to Tex and when I told you how I viewed the comparison, you change the comparison to Tex and Dice K? I think that is what some would call a strawman. You need to be consistent. Are we comparing AGon and Tex? If you want to turn this into a "grease fire" as you said, go ahead. I have no interest in going down this road. I am here to talk baseball not about what you think of me. Frankly, I could care less about that. I just wanted to know if you thought we would get Oswalt, Jackson, both or neither and possibly the reasons for you opinion. Go blow with the rest of this stuff.

I should learn from my mistakes? You are a hoot. The fact that the Red Sox spent like drunken sailors like they had a bottomless pit of money had nothing to do with me. What organization spends itself to the brink fiscally on luxuries and then does a 180 degree about face and institutes an austerity program. An organization that goes from one extreme to the other is an organization that lacks discipline and it is certainly symptomatic of organizational dysfunction. It's not the fault of fans that want to see the best performers, unless you are delusional. Again, Crawford's contract may have been the final straw for the owners, but he is a great talent, and he will play just fine. The reason why there is no flexibility this offseason is because they have $15 million and $8 million tied up in slugs like Lackey and Dice K. They have another $6 million tied up with a useless pig like Jenks. Add to that mix that the Sox will be overpaying Ortiz this up coming season by $3 to $7 million depending on the arbitration. That's a total of $32 million to $36 million. That would have given them a ton of flexibility. Yeah, it's my fault... a fan! Theo screwed things up royally, and Crawford's contract by far is not his biggest mistake. With regard to your Texeira - AGon comment, their contracts are not a lot different and Tex did not cost the Yankees their top pitching and hitting prospect. Oh and Tex helped the yanks win a World Series. AGon choked his way to the finish line in his first season. I'll take your entire post above as sarcasm, because the only other alternative is that you are insane. I do love this ridiculous "appease the fans" arguments that some of you have. Where are the angry mobs of fans threatening the franchise?

I heard that Theo submitted a full list of the big money free agent acquisitions that he made with Boston to prove that he is worthless.

I don't think I made any Carl Crawford polls last season... did I?

I'm incredible?:lol: I'm to blame?:lol: Theo isn't to blame? I would think he probably had a bit more information about team finances than I did. At let me say this, Carl Crawford is far from his biggest mistake. There is a long line of total big money busts that put us in this position. I know that I have self-appointed myself as the King of TalkSox-- a purely cermonial title with no authority, but surely you realize that I have no authority with the Red Sox. Thank goodness I pick up on your sarcasm. Lastly, this off season has been a terrible bore. It's been long and boring.

It looks like another boring day in an interminably boring Hot Stove season. So, I am going to post another poll out of total boredom. Tomorrow is February 1st and pitchers and catchers will report in 2 weeks. Some of us are still waiting and hopeful of the Sox making a significant roster move or two. Others have given up hope of that prospect. Some think we are just fine the way we are. Oswalt and Jackson are still out there, and there have been contradictory reports about them for a couple of weeks. The FO raised everybody's hopes with the salary dump of Scutaro, because it was reported that the move was meant to clear payroll to obtain a pitcher. We anticipated that a pitching move would be coming soon, but we still don't have a pitcher. This will be a 2-day poll. Just a snapshot of what we are thinking at this moment. No 20-20 hindsight for this poll as circumstances change. P.S. E1, you never vote in these polls. At least you never comment in the threads. We won't hold it against you if you are wrong.

Not highly improbable at all. However, the competition has gotten better, so our guys will have to perform better just to keep pace.

I swear to god that sometimes we debate and argue about nothing. Check out the what I have bolded in your post above and check out the quote from my post that started this whole discussion: I think we are saying the same thing, unless you think they will be significantly better. I don't think they will be significantly better or worse. I think we need to significantly improve to keep pace with and surpass the competition. I just don't think we have done enough to be significantly better.

I think you are right on about this. The only area of significant change and upgrade is with the coaching staff and other management functions. If we do materially better with this current roster, it will be due to those changes, because the roster has not improved at all.

The 2011 Red Sox didn't massively under perform. We led the league in runs. Our offense was a powerhouse. Ellsbury had a breakout season and Ortiz was consistently excellent from beginning to end against lefties and righties. Scutaro had one of his best offensive seasons and Salty performed better than most expected. Beckett had one of his best seasons in a while and Lester was a little off, but not by a lot. We performed very well in the pen in the 8th and 9th innings, and Aceves was a huge shot in the arm. I don't know where you are seeing this massive underperformance. It just wasn't so. The portions that underperformed like the back end of the starting pitching has not been significantly upgraded. I am looking at talent coming in and talent going out and that looks like a net decrease or about the same as last year. You accuse others of engaging in conjecture, but it is you that is engaging in conjecture, and I don't think you have a solid basis for it at all.

If fat Miggy Cabrera can play full time at 3B, it can't be too physically demanding. Youk needs to come in 20 lbs lighter to take the pressure off his back.

Looking at Ben & Cherries first off season at the helm and acknowledging that the off season is not finished, at this point, IMO there has been a net decrease in talent on this squad. At best, it is the same.

I am not really conjecturing about anything. I'm not predicting injury or good health or under or over performance. I am simply looking at the talent added and lost since last season. At best, we come out even after looking at the personnel changes. I think that we are a slightly less talented squad, because our infield depth is not good and we don't have a true every day SS. If we didn't improve, I don't know how much better we can expect to perform. How can we project that a team with slightly less talent than the squad that finished 2011 will improve to 95-96 wins? I just don't know how anyone gets there. Add to that the fact that the Yankees and Angels have improved, the Rays have kept their young staff together and they have one young kid poised to break out. The Rangers look strong again and the Tigers have made significant improvements too. It doesn't add up to me that we should expect a better outcome than last season-- without conjecturing about performance or injury.