The Blame Game

[RedSoxRally]

Off to a 4-10 start, Red Sox Nation (myself included) are almost at a loss for words. After today's 9-0 lead turned into a 15-9 loss to the Yankees, reading the posts on where the blame is placed has been worthy of a good read. Boston's 2012 start is consequently is nothing more than a continuation of the the way the 2011 season ended....only with a new manager and GM. Valentine isn't doing himself any favors at all with his public comments about his players. This is a team whose trust is scrambled and uncertain. Ellsbury's separated shoulder hurts a ton and Crawford's injury setback thins out the outfield depth to where it's outfield by committee. Honestly, once last season was underway, I got the impression Crawford really didn't want to be in Boston.

 

The front office has had their chances to make offseason moves and failed to do so. Francona's departure, Paplebon not resigned, Scutaro gone to Colorado, Redick in Oakland, Varitek retiring has left the Red Sox depleted. With key pieces gone, somewhere the organization has to dig deep and move on.

 

Yes Francona lost his player in the clubhouse, but Valentine has questioned and called out select players only hurt this continuation of last season. The batting lineup can go toe to toe with any team in the majors as far as offense is concerned, but unfortunately when winning henges on how far starting pitching can go. When starting pitching can barely last 5 to 6 innings, a bullpen who couldn't play their way out of a wet paper bag have done their best to drown the team. Once the bullpen takes over, it's hard not to cringe on every pitch. Today, Valentine pulled Doubront after allowing a homerun to Texieria in the 6th inning. No wonder many are upset with the current manager, he doesn't know when to allow his pitchers to carry on.

 

Today was hard to watch. At one point I had to ask myself if I was really seeing this. I've never seen a Red Sox team with no leadership from anywhere. When that happens, lack of leadership leads to mistrust. Ultimately as the season goes on, the players will be responsible for future outcomes. Playing in the American League East is a rough gauntlet where sleepwalking starts can have a team canned by the All-Star Break. This isn't

2011 where a 2-12 start is a laugh and giggle gesture. Making a habit of digging deep holes and expecting to come out on top all the time will bit a team later on. Well the biting has started and if things don't turn around soon, we'll be watching consecutive postseasons that don't include the Boston Red Sox.

[RedSoxNC84]

Funny how Valentine seems to be on a kneejerk hook, or he lets the 7 run rule play into effect.

 

I mean yeah the bullpen sucks, I'm surprised that half of the guys in there aren't also named Mark Melancon. Cherington thought he was making some good moves this winter, and thought he had gotten some good bargains.

 

s*** happens. Blame Melancon.

[SoxSport]

The problem is they have key injuries--and the replacements suck. The bullpen is in disarray because they haven't fixed the closer hole due to Bailey's badly timed injury. They also continue to overuse the bullpen --as a matter of policy. Today was a typical example. Dubront goes another inning, they probably win the game.

 

Coddling your starters and overusing a mediocre bullpen is a recipe for disaster.

[SoxSport]

Funny how Valentine seems to be on a kneejerk hook, or he lets the 7 run rule play into effect.

 

I mean yeah the bullpen sucks, I'm surprised that half of the guys in there aren't also named Mark Melancon. Cherington thought he was making some good moves this winter, and thought he had gotten some good bargains.

 

s*** happens. Blame Melancon.

 

Yeah. Seems like there's no difference so far between V and Tito in the handling of pitching.

They seem locked in at 100 pitches for the starter and then to the crappy bullpen. That policy is bound to make a crappy bullpen even crappier.

 

The pitching policy looks like it's dictated by the front office. Always had the feeling that Tito was just a mouthpiece.

[Spitball]

I direct a great deal of blame at Epstein. This team has deeper problems than just the wrong manager, a rotation with an ERA over 5.00, and a pathetic bullpen. Because of poor signings by Theo, the Sox are handcuffed by the money wasted on Lackey, Crawford, Matzusaka, et al.

[Elktonnick]

The problem is they have key injuries--and the replacements suck. The bullpen is in disarray because they haven't fixed the closer hole due to Bailey's badly timed injury. They also continue to overuse the bullpen --as a matter of policy. Today was a typical example. Dubront goes another inning, they probably win the game.

 

Coddling your starters and overusing a mediocre bullpen is a recipe for disaster.

 

Thed bull pen gave up 7 runs in back to back innings. Whether Dubrount pitched the 7 or not is unimportant. The fact a bull pen should be able to hold an 8 run lead with 9 outs left. Aceves, Padilla and Albers hadn't pitched in days they weren't over used. The problem is the bull pen sucks. Cherrington went and got crap over the winter.

[NativeBostonian]

I don't know how anyone can blame Valentine. He isn't the one throwing like a girl. Can only do so much with the team that he is given. If you want someone to blame, it's Ben Charington. He's the one who put this sorry team together.

[TutGadol]

The problem is they have key injuries--and the replacements suck. The bullpen is in disarray because they haven't fixed the closer hole due to Bailey's badly timed injury. They also continue to overuse the bullpen --as a matter of policy. Today was a typical example. Dubront goes another inning, they probably win the game.

 

Coddling your starters and overusing a mediocre bullpen is a recipe for disaster.

 

I'm not sure I agree about our replacements. If you look at the Rangers (The best offensive team in baseball) their bench is Snyder, Toreallba, Gentry and Alberto Gonzalez. I'd take Ross, Punto, Shopach and McDonald over that. Injuries are really tough on us. There are 9 guys who were supposed to be in the Majors right now who are injured (Bailey, Crawford, Jacoby, Hill, Lackey, Daiskue, Miller, Jenks and Kalish).

Rough estimate? that's about 3 Red Sox injuries for any regular team injury. I think that with a good 'pen, from looking on the schedule, we'd be 7-7, which isn't bad considering the rough start and the tough schedule.

[kapsis21]

I don't know how anyone can blame Valentine. He isn't the one throwing like a girl. Can only do so much with the team that he is given. If you want someone to blame' date=' it's Ben Charington. He's the one who put this sorry team together.[/quote']

 

I agree completely bobby Valentine cannot be blamed with this bullpen that is throwing like they belong in class A. The bullpen completely blows. BV cannot be blamed for this

[Elktonnick]

This game was lost in October when they promoted Cherrington and decided to go dumpster diving for bull pen help.

 

They had ample opportunity to pick up a ML ready starter at reasonable cost for short term and didn't. They let Weaver get away. They decided to have Bard start without having any replacement stopper in the pen. They placed all their money on an injury prone closer and guess what they found out he was prone to injury. The guy hurt himself jumping in place for crying out loud. The went after Melancon as the 8th inning guy and found out he couldn't get anyone out.

 

Now everyone is blaming BV becaue he took out his starter with an 8 run lead with 9 outs left.

 

Now if you are BV or any manager currently or formerly in MLB the question is who do trust in that bullpen to hold a lead? The answer is no one

[Bellhorn04]

After today it's clear to me that the bullpen is easily the biggest problem with this team. It's a disaster of epic proportions.

[Elktonnick]

After today it's clear to me that the bullpen is easily the biggest problem with this team. It's a disaster of epic proportions.

 

I know everyone is looking at BV's role in this mess but he wasn't allowed to hire his own pitching coach. Some of us questioned the hiring of McClure when he was annouced. What is his role in this disaster that is Red Sox pitching.

[Bellhorn04]

I know everyone is looking at BV's role in this mess but he wasn't allowed to hire his own pitching coach. Some of us questioned the hiring of McClure when he was annouced. What is he role in this disaster that is Red Sox pitching.

 

I think Saltalamacchia may have a role too. I don't think it's a coincidence guys keep getting lit up with Salty behind the plate.

[Elktonnick]

I think Saltalamacchia may have a role too. I don't think it's a coincidence guys keep getting lit up with Salty behind the plate.

 

I agree. Baseball ops has wanted this guy for years but defensively Shoppach is a better catcher. Salty seems to have a lot of passed balls too. I don't see that Lavarnway as that much worse defensively than Salty from what we saw in the spring. Besides if Lavarnway was so lacking why did he play key games in September over Salty.

[SCM33]

After today it's clear to me that the bullpen is easily the biggest problem with this team. It's a disaster of epic proportions.

 

We knew this going in.

 

Theo and LL f***ed this team. They dont want to spend past the luxury tax yet this team has more holes in it than a colander.

[Elktonnick]

We knew this going in.

 

Theo and LL f***ed this team. They dont want to spend past the luxury tax yet this team has more holes in it than a colander.

 

Henry and Cherrington are equally responsible.

[Gringo]

I blame Kenny Dalglish

[RedSoxRally]

I have to agree with one person who mentioned there are probably deeper issues within this organization, but on the field, the bullpen is has zero idea about pitching with a lead. This has been a reoccurring theme during their 7-20 stretch to end the season on and actually before that. It's one thing for a team to go on a big run to steal a lead in a game....normally those runs happen on a basketball court which is much faster pace. Today Boston exploded out to a 9-0 lead which was pretty damn good against the Yankees. However the Yankees went on a 15-0 run in route to a laugher late. For major league pitchers, that kind of performance won't escape anybody's memory anytime soon....and that's not a compliment. Bobby V. wears a uniform but it's not him who has to physically compete. Yes he pull Doubront, as many have pointed out, too early. He can't bat, pitch or play the field and help his guys do their jobs. It's a good thing the season is 162 games. We're down to 148 left and ample time to make a move, but blowing 8 run leads with 3 innings left in games won't allow the Red Sox make a serious push for a postseason birth. Injuries have hurt Boston up to this point but this team is going to have to figure something out.

 

Speaking of bullpen issues, remember Boston's run from 2004-2007? The beautiful noise of the Red Sox relievers as they carefully orchestrated their own band for Fenway and TV viewers to hear gave the impression the players then were up for action at anytime. These guys aren't walking back through that door anytime soon or ever but it is fun to think about.

[Whatsinaname]

I blame Andrew Dimetriou and his falafel fixation.

[Gringo]

I look back at some of the guys who jumped ship, like Jason Bay and Victor Martinez...they probably had enough of the dysfunction and wanted out. It's only a matter of time until Ellsbury jumps too.You look at Epstein's RIDICULOUS signings....John Lackey.....had we waited a year, we could have signed Cliff Lee.

 

DiceK.....$50M just for the HONOR to sign him.

 

Crawford...the rotating SS scenario....

 

It's clear Cherington is just LL's water boy, so I can't blame Ben for anything.

 

But the light needs to be shone on Mr. Larry Lucchino, who is not the astute baseball man he seems to think he is.

 

And John Henry is just out to lunch, I can't take the guy seriously. He's just a nerd with a lot of money.

 

What does Werner do, other than sound like a kazoo when he speaks?

 

I almost feel bad for Valentine, he's walked into a situation that is beyond his ability to fix. The rot is too deep. The dysfunction too profound.

 

Nobody seems to have a plan in place, signings are done willy-nilly, money is either thrown around carelessly, or reeled in when we actually need to spend. The whole thing is upside down.

 

I can't recall things being this grim around here in a long time.

[example1]

Cliff Lee didn't choose NY and the piles of money the Yankees offered him. Do you really think that between TX, NYY and PHI Lee was just waiting for the Sox so he could choose them? C'mon man.

[Gringo]

Cliff Lee didn't choose NY and the piles of money the Yankees offered him. Do you really think that between TX' date=' NYY and PHI Lee was just waiting for the Sox so he could choose them? C'mon man.[/quote']

 

Ok, subtract Lee from the equation and add ANYBODY BUT LACKEY and you've still done a better job....

 

The point is, it was a horrible signing, and this ball club cannot afford to keep f*cking up with these signings

[Elktonnick]

"Blame Valentine all you want. But it's not like he's ignoring obvious choices who could do better. A manager is only as good as the players he manages. The Red Sox have a bunch of players who simply don't belong on the roster."

 

Peter Abraham Boston Globe

[Gabriel]

And also, I don't understand their choice of bullpen pitchers. Had Tazawa benn put into the game right after dubront, and the sox would've won for sure

[Elktonnick]

And also' date=' I don't understand their choice of bullpen pitchers. Had Tazawa benn put into the game right after dubront, and the sox would've won for sure[/quote']

 

Hindsight. 8 run lead 9 outs. Padilla was supposed to be the 7th inning guy, Fans blasted Bobby for not keeping Padilla in a previous game. The fact as Abraham says this bullpen sucks.

[Spudboy]

The problem is they have key injuries--and the replacements suck. The bullpen is in disarray because they haven't fixed the closer hole due to Bailey's badly timed injury. They also continue to overuse the bullpen --as a matter of policy. Today was a typical example. Dubront goes another inning, they probably win the game.

 

Coddling your starters and overusing a mediocre bullpen is a recipe for disaster.

 

This sums it up quite well, actually.

[Spudboy]

Hindsight. 8 run lead 9 outs. Padilla was supposed to be the 7th inning guy' date=' Fans blasted Bobby for not keeping Padilla in a previous game. The fact as Abraham says this bullpen sucks.[/quote']

 

Yeah. Padilla should have done his job. There is no way of knowing if Tazawa would have done as well and continued to do well if he had entered earlier in the game.

 

Still, I am encouraged by his brief outing.

[Spudboy]

I really wonder if they will have the balls to tell Bard to go back to the pen if or when Cook is brought up.

 

Also, how do they make room for cook on the roster? Repko will be put on a DL to make room for Byrd.

 

Who goes next?

[Elktonnick]

This sums it up quite well' date=' actually.[/quote']

 

I think both Steve Buckley and Peter Abraham pretty much rebutted that. Padilla et al weren't over used. They just suck. It is perfectly understandable why you take out a starter after 99 pitches to start a new inning with an 8 run lead. Doubront wasn't going to pitch a complete game. He was going to come out eventually.

Cherrington put together a crappy team especially relef pitching. Most of us with clear vision saw that all winter. Yesterday was a case of Cherrington's chickens coming home to roost

[Elktonnick]

Yeah. Padilla should have done his job. There is no way of knowing if Tazawa would have done as well and continued to do well if he had entered earlier in the game.

 

Still, I am encouraged by his brief outing.

 

Right now Tazaawa is the only one out in the pen who hasn't sucked. The big question is can you trust anyone out there now. Cherrington doesn't want to move Bard to the pen. You have got to wonder whether Ben is "stuck on stupid"