Expectations for Saltalamacchia?

[The Boomer]

Perhaps not' date=' but I was brought up to admit that when I am wrong I am wrong instead of running away from the truth. But it will be the last time that is brought up because it is a good point you raised. It shouldn't be brought up here, especially since we have so much other Red Sox stuff to discuss.[/quote']

 

But of course you feel free to bring it up and then wonder why it was brought up. Classic.

[The Boomer]

But of course you feel free to bring it up and then wonder why it was brought up. Classic.

 

No it doesn't Boomer and you should be smart enough to know that. Most of the Triple A players at Pawtucket never make it to the Red Sox and many of them flop' date=' including former "standouts" like Lars Anderson. Remember him? Let's me honest about it....You know damn well that I have talked up Ryan Lavarnway for the past two plus years. You read the posts on Sawxheads before you fled. If Ryan flops there will be egg on my face, but I believe he has the goods to become a solid RH power hitter for us and I will stand on that prediction. Notice I don't say the same f or Will Middlebrooks even though he is now rated our No. 1 prospect. I don't know that much about him and from the film I've seen on him it looks like he might have a hole in his swing, and boy there is one example of which I hope I'm all wet on. We may need him sooner than we think.[/quote']

 

I would expect that we can agree that Lars did not develop. Which puts him squarely in your sweet spot.

[seabeachfred]

I am not going to get into it' date=' but suffice to say your behavior has been deplorable.[/quote']

 

It's over and done Boomer and I'm through going through it again. This is a new season and let's see if we can find a thing or two to agree on. It will never be mentioned again.

[SCM33]

I can see that "The Boomer" wont have a very long stay here.

[Emmz]

Boomer is just fine, he's been a pretty good contributor thus far.

[SCM33]

Boomer is just fine' date=' he's been a pretty good contributor thus far.[/quote']

 

As long as he doesnt bring those "other" guys into conversation......

[Emmz]

Fred brought up the other site.

[SCM33]

disregard haha.

[The Boomer]

It's over and done Boomer and I'm through going through it again. This is a new season and let's see if we can find a thing or two to agree on. It will never be mentioned again.

 

Fair enough.

[Dojji]

Salty from Opening Day to August 31: .781 OPS

 

Salty in September: .542 OPS

 

Hope you worked on your conditioning, kid.

[Emmz]

Ain't you forgetting that his first couple of months were pretty crappy as well, and that number from Open to September is mostly due to 3 months of hitting for around .900 OPS? I don't think it was conditioning that hurt him, he just couldn't keep hitting like that. It would be one thing if he was largely consistent with one outlier month in there and then he just tailed off in September.

[Dojji]

Oh, and amusing to note this: Jason Varitek's age 26 season was worse than Saltalamacchia's. He scored a .716 OPS good for an 83 OPS+ and was a below replacement level defender. He also threw out 28% of baserunners to Salty's 31%.

 

Nor was Tek exactly that good a receiver in his early days. Game caller and pitcher handler sure, but he was good for double digit passed balls every year until 2001 and led the league in passed balls twice. Sounds eerily familiar to me.

 

People like to give up on Salty because he's been in the big leagues for so long but he was promoted WAAAAAAY earlier than Tek was. Tek's rookie year was his age 26 campaign. Tek got a lot of time to work on what Salty's still working on now, in college and in the minors.

 

Now I'm not saying anything more than exactly what I'm saying. No implications stated or implied. But it's worth thinking about isn't it? It's way too early to give up on Jarrod Saltalamacchia.

[a700hitter]

Salty from Opening Day to August 31: .781 OPS

 

Salty in September: .542 OPS

 

Hope you worked on your conditioning, kid.

I think he was exposed in the weakened lineup in September. I don't think it was about conditioning.

[Dojji]

Ain't you forgetting that his first couple of months were pretty crappy as well' date=' and that number from Open to September is mostly due to 3 months of hitting for around .900 OPS? I don't think it was conditioning that hurt him, he just couldn't keep hitting like that. It would be one thing if he was largely consistent with one outlier month in there and then he just tailed off in September.[/quote']

 

April was bad sure, but Salty is still a young catcher trying to learn the ropes. It was reasonable to expect April to be bad and I said so at the time. By the end of May, he was in rhythm and he didn't really fall out of that rhythm until September.

 

April was part of that .781 OPS he carried into September though. Take that out of the equation and the numbers look even better.

[seabeachfred]

I'm not wishing Satalamacchia anything but glad tidings but by now everyone around here knows what a big fan I am of Ryan Lavarnway, and I just believe in my bones that this young man is going to be an outstanding player for us. The balls jump off his bat, he has great power and might also hit for a decent average and he has a good arm. He threw out, what over 30% of those who tried to swipe on him last season in the minors? I hope Bobby gives him enough work this ST so his development as a receiver accelerates so we can see him sooner than expected. Again it is only my opinion but I think I'm looking at a guy who can hit 30 or more homers on a consistent basis and be the first solid RH power hitter we've developed in a long time. Whether it is as a DH or catcher, the sooner I see this guy in our lineup the happier I will be. I just love this player.

[jung]

Kinda' funny how Salty found his way to "average". When he was hot he was hot and when he was not he was waayyyyyyyy not. In fact, if we was actually average for longer stretches of time we would probably be happier with him.

 

It seemed to me that his fielding and his hitting sort went up and down in sympathy with each other. Not the most unusual thing in the world for a baseball player but seemed most evident in his case.

 

In all likelihood we are not going to be to supportive when he is going well but will be hell on wheels when is going poorly if he repeats that kind of performance this year.

[Dojji]

I'll defend him if he's worth defending. Not the first time I've stood alone against the tide of the short-tempered.

[Dojji]

I'm not wishing Satalamacchia anything but glad tidings but by now everyone around here knows what a big fan I am of Ryan Lavarnway' date=' and I just believe in my bones that this young man is going to be an outstanding player for us. The balls jump off his bat, he has great power and might also hit for a decent average and he has a good arm. He threw out, what over 30% of those who tried to swipe on him last season in the minors? I hope Bobby gives him enough work this ST so his development as a receiver accelerates so we can see him sooner than expected. Again it is only my opinion but I think I'm looking at a guy who can hit 30 or more homers on a consistent basis and be the first solid RH power hitter we've developed in a long time. Whether it is as a DH or catcher, the sooner I see this guy in our lineup the happier I will be. I just love this player.[/quote']

 

I don't think Salty and Lavs are mutually exclusive. 2 good catchers can coexist on a roster, especially if one or both can DH.

[SCM33]

I don't think Salty and Lavs are mutually exclusive. 2 good catchers can coexist on a roster' date=' especially if one or both can DH.[/quote']

 

Yeah, but the Redsox should first concern themselves with finding 1 "good" starting catcher.

 

We have a GREAT backup catcher. Salty all day long for backup.

[Palodios]

I don't think Salty and Lavs are mutually exclusive. 2 good catchers can coexist on a roster' date=' especially if one or both can DH.[/quote']

 

The problem is that Shoppach can do something that neither of those two guys can. Throw out runners.

[Dojji]

Salty threw out 31% last year.

 

Sure they ran on him a lot because people don't respect his arm, but 31% is good enough that they'll start respecting it a bit more.

 

What we don't have is a guy with great catcher's tools. Both Salty and Lavs are "maybe good enough on a great day" just like like Tek and V-Mart before them. (and don't give me guff about bringing Tek into it -- he was as good defensively as he was because he was smart, not because he had a great defensive toolset, that's just the truth)

 

Not surprising. The absolutely unreasonable offensive standards we demand of our catchers means that that's the type the GM is going to bring in. I'm not sure we're even trying to promote the real catch and throw types.

[mvp 78]

The problem is that Shoppach can do something that neither of those two guys can. Throw out runners.

 

Shoppach had 61% of Salty's ab's. Taking his adjusted total bases less an adjusted CSB gives 110 bases (which is unlikely as that number is inflated by LH pitchers, which he wouldn't be likely to see). Shoppach hit .115 against RH pitchers. He's nothing more than a platoon player. Full-time, he'd be brutal.

 

Salty was at 102. He also had to catch Wake.

 

The best option is to play Salty against RH pitchers and Shoppach against LH pitchers.

[mvp 78]

The 31% is basically average for C who played 80 games.

His OPS is average.

Also, his OPS and CS% is better than RuMart.

[Dojji]

You got some facts to back up that 31%-is-average thing? There's a lot of catchers that routinely throw out 20-25% of baserunners.

[a700hitter]

We can live with these 2 guys at catcher. If one of them flops or gets injured, Lavarnway is waiting in the wings. The biggest issue for this team wll be the way the pitching falls into place.

[mvp 78]

You got some facts to back up that 31%-is-average thing? There's a lot of catchers that routinely throw out 20-25% of baserunners.

 

There are only 6 full time catchers that throw out less than 25%. You got some facts to back up that 6 is a lot?

[a700hitter]

There are only 6 full time catchers that throw out less than 25%. You got some facts to back up that 6 is a lot?

Salty's footwork looked better on Sunday than I remember. Little tweaks like that can make a big difference. Bobby V is great at picking up stuff like that. There's not much they can do about the fact that he doesn't catch the ball well.

[SoxSport]

The Red Sox don't have anybody good enough to beat Salty. It's his job to lose.

 

Shoppach can't hit his weight. Lavarnway? Maybe. But he's still greener than Salty.

 

My guess is Salty improves this year--especially defensively. That would be enough.

His hitting stats looked good until he faded from fatigue in September. One of the few who had a good reason.

[The Boomer]

Salty threw out 31% last year.

 

Sure they ran on him a lot because people don't respect his arm, but 31% is good enough that they'll start respecting it a bit more.

 

What we don't have is a guy with great catcher's tools. Both Salty and Lavs are "maybe good enough on a great day" just like like Tek and V-Mart before them. (and don't give me guff about bringing Tek into it -- he was as good defensively as he was because he was smart, not because he had a great defensive toolset, that's just the truth)

 

Not surprising. The absolutely unreasonable offensive standards we demand of our catchers means that that's the type the GM is going to bring in. I'm not sure we're even trying to promote the real catch and throw types.

 

Salty also caught Wake last year; just doing that will drive your CS% down no matter your defensive skills.

[a700hitter]

Salty also caught Wake last year; just doing that will drive your CS% down no matter your defensive skills.

I looked at the stats one time. The proposition that the CS percentage being lower with Wake on the mound was not true historically. That's my recollection.