John Farrell Blue Jays Red Sox Article

[onlybereaved]

I am not allowed to post links yet as I am a newb to the forum...

 

sited from sportsnet.ca

 

Thoughts?

[Palodios]

The clubhouse problems with the pitching started under his watch in 2010. Why bring him back?

[onlybereaved]

Yeah, I am not sure whether or not this has been validated or confirmed to be true in terms of whether the Red Sox are even interested in the idea and on how serious of a scale etc.

 

I have only seen this specific article on the topic and was wondering if I missed the memo and if you guys knew anything further...

[Elktonnick]

The clubhouse problems with the pitching started under his watch in 2010. Why bring him back?

 

Excellent point! Time to move on.

[User Name]

I like the idea of Bud Black. He was known as a stiff-arm Pitching coach wit the Angels who got the best out of Horse-Face (Lackey) before heading off West. He's also a good in-game tactician as well as very knowledgeable about pitching issues from his days as a pitching coach. He's also supposedly pretty tough, unlike Francona, who was pretty vanilla.

[Cask N Flagon 76]

I like the idea of Bud Black. He was known as a stiff-arm Pitching coach wit the Angels who got the best out of Horse-Face (Lackey) before heading off West. He's also a good in-game tactician as well as very knowledgeable about pitching issues from his days as a pitching coach. He's also supposedly pretty tough' date=' unlike Francona, who was pretty vanilla.[/quote']

 

 

I would say Francona being vanilla brought us 2 titles but who cares right?. Fact is

he lost the clubhouse but you can't sit there and say Francona had a HUGE part in

changing the culture in that clubhouse all those years.

[User Name]

Francona's legacy is well appreciated but it is time for a change. The fact that he lost the clubhouse, as you say yourself, is a testament to the fact that his style wasn't working anymore. Change is needed.

[sleepyhollow]

I don't think the problem started in 2010.....Farrell was still on the job and doing what seemed to be ok. I did notice that Francona and Farrell did not see eye/eye. Buchholz has stated that Young was laid back and Farrell had more control over the pitchers. The Jays advised in one of the Boston papers today that they would not deny Farrell from interviewing for the Boston position.

[Palodios]

I don't think the problem started in 2010.....Farrell was still on the job and doing what seemed to be ok. I did notice that Francona and Farrell did not see eye/eye. Buchholz has stated that Young was laid back and Farrell had more control over the pitchers. The Jays advised in one of the Boston papers today that they would not deny Farrell from interviewing for the Boston position.

 

The reports all claimed that most of this garbage started in 2010.

[SoxSport]

Cafardo today says Farrell might require compensation, but regardless, I think they should pass.

They need a break from the past with this team--too many issues. A manager and coaches from the outside.

 

I'm a little concerned about keeping the FO intact. Baseball is full of bright young sabermetrics types these days--easy to get. I think they have to get away from the Yankeeball thing--throwing big money at free agents--and get more efficient about developing their own. Buy low, sell high. That's why I favor letting Pap go, and moving homebred, cheaper Bard to closer. Closers are not hard to develop. Look at Madsen last year, plus a few others in the big leagues. They can get a couple of draft picks for Pap, plus save a lot of money.And they have a great option ready to step in with Bard. He faded last year from overuse.

 

I also hope they let Papi walk. They can get a couple of draft picks for him, too. And use the money to sign Cuddyer, who is a few years younger and can play the OF.

 

Get those draft picks!

[jung]

In any other year I would be fully on board with letting Pap go and moving on to Bard. That may still be the right thing to do. In fact if I can rationalize in my own mind what happened to Bard (and so far I have not been able to do that) then I can come to terms with letting Pap go and going with Bard. Yes Bard's mechanics went to hell and maybe Bard was just another guy Young was unable to help. Imagine if Bards mechanics go to hell and he is the closer? Uuuuuugly!

 

On the opposite end of the pole I don't expect Paps to be at all interested in the oft hoped for Home Town Discount either. If anything it will be a Home Town Surcharge and maybe that is the killer for keeping Pap. He will just be too costly. Maybe the money gets crazy for Paps early and makes the decision easier for the Sox.

 

Given all the s*** that hit the fan I have sorta' gotten used to the idea that having three good starters and a very good and proven closer in Paps and then the everyday players that the Sox have that are solid would be a good place to start to prepare for 2012. I can say that I buy the idea of not resigning Paps easier than seeing either Beckett or Lester or Buckholtz go.

 

I guess in truth it will be their job to make sure that Bard is ready to take the reins and if in fact they are, then by all means, resigning Paps at the absolute max number he is ever going to command in his career makes no sense. Bard does not have to be exactly the same closer as Paps. He just needs to be able to be the closer.

 

It does sort of make you appreciate Rivera for what he has accomplished. The Yanks have gotten away with a lotta' ******** over the years by knowing they just needed to get to the 9th inning. Being able to perform as a pitcher as well as Rivera has at a time in the game when the opposition hitters are for the most part as focused as they are ever going to be is pretty amazing.

[SoxSport]

The James Bible says don't overvalue closers, and the Red Sox pretty much adhere to his principles.

I wonder, with Bard the logical cheap successor, if they will just let Pap go. Closers are one inning /one pitch guys.They aren't worth top dollar. Pap had the typical contract year, and you wonder if he will get up that high again after a big contract. I like the two draft picks, with Bard waiting to close. It's his time. Plus they can save the $$ to sign another FA starter.Bard trailed off in September from overuse. He did come back in the end to pitch effectively--at least one outing. He had a long streak of scoreless innings mid-season.

 

I'd do the same with Papi--another popular re-sign. Two draft picks. Papi has a big ego, and I think he'll be surprised to find what an ageing DH is worth on the market. Look at VGuerrero. Big year in Texas two years ago, and couldn't get dork the next year. Stats declined in Baltimore. Use the Papi money to sign Cuddyer.

 

One guy they should re-sign is Scutaro. Unless they are going after Reyes. Furcal is good but prone to injury at this point. So is Reyes. Keep Marco. Pretty steady.

 

The Sox budget last year was $170M, and they didn't get much out of it.

They are adding AdGon to the books this year to go with CC. That's +$20M.

They will lose some off the books--Drew, Tek, Wake, ???Maybe -$20M to offset AdGon.

 

My guess is they will cut some more. Henry won't be so generous this year.

[Gringo]

Cafardo today says Farrell might require compensation, but regardless, I think they should pass.

They need a break from the past with this team--too many issues. A manager and coaches from the outside.

 

I'm a little concerned about keeping the FO intact. Baseball is full of bright young sabermetrics types these days--easy to get. I think they have to get away from the Yankeeball thing--throwing big money at free agents--and get more efficient about developing their own. Buy low, sell high. That's why I favor letting Pap go, and moving homebred, cheaper Bard to closer. Closers are not hard to develop. Look at Madsen last year, plus a few others in the big leagues. They can get a couple of draft picks for Pap, plus save a lot of money.And they have a great option ready to step in with Bard. He faded last year from overuse.

 

I also hope they let Papi walk. They can get a couple of draft picks for him, too. And use the money to sign Cuddyer, who is a few years younger and can play the OF.

 

Get those draft picks!

 

Agreed. They need a wholesale change upstairs. All Theo's minions need to go too. Total overhaul time.

[SCM33]

I think Farrell is a good fit for the team.

 

You cant blame 2010 on Farrell, he was the pitching coach, For all we know that s*** might have been one of the reasons he decided to leave Boston rather than wait it out with Tito.

 

Farrell by all accounts, is a disciplinarian.....which is good, especially since he is not a smaller fragile guy like Tito. Farrell is a 6'4 220 pound dude, he is a presence.

 

Farrell would be a good fit. He knows the players, he knows the system. Dont blame Titos funhouse in 2010 and 2011 on Farrell.

[example1]

I think Farrell is a good fit for the team.

 

You cant blame 2010 on Farrell, he was the pitching coach, For all we know that s*** might have been one of the reasons he decided to leave Boston rather than wait it out with Tito.

 

Farrell by all accounts, is a disciplinarian.....which is good, especially since he is not a smaller fragile guy like Tito. Farrell is a 6'4 220 pound dude, he is a presence.

 

Farrell would be a good fit. He knows the players, he knows the system. Dont blame Titos funhouse in 2010 and 2011 on Farrell.

 

Agreed. People who are willing to write off potential managers because they have some past association with the team--regardless of the nature of that association--are throwing away other positive attributes. It wouldn't hurt if the next manager had rapport with the players already, or if he didn't need to learn all the nuances of managing in Boston. Farrell is an intimidating mo-fo. He could run a tight ship and be an excellent name on the short list. Personality matters a lot here.

[onlybereaved]

The James Bible says don't overvalue closers, and the Red Sox pretty much adhere to his principles.

I wonder, with Bard the logical cheap successor, if they will just let Pap go. Closers are one inning /one pitch guys.They aren't worth top dollar. Pap had the typical contract year, and you wonder if he will get up that high again after a big contract. I like the two draft picks, with Bard waiting to close. It's his time. Plus they can save the $$ to sign another FA starter.Bard trailed off in September from overuse. He did come back in the end to pitch effectively--at least one outing. He had a long streak of scoreless innings mid-season.

 

I'd do the same with Papi--another popular re-sign. Two draft picks. Papi has a big ego, and I think he'll be surprised to find what an ageing DH is worth on the market. Look at VGuerrero. Big year in Texas two years ago, and couldn't get dork the next year. Stats declined in Baltimore. Use the Papi money to sign Cuddyer.

 

One guy they should re-sign is Scutaro. Unless they are going after Reyes. Furcal is good but prone to injury at this point. So is Reyes. Keep Marco. Pretty steady.

 

The Sox budget last year was $170M, and they didn't get much out of it.

They are adding AdGon to the books this year to go with CC. That's +$20M.

They will lose some off the books--Drew, Tek, Wake, ???Maybe -$20M to offset AdGon.

 

My guess is they will cut some more. Henry won't be so generous this year.

 

Well said. I completely agree here.

[VA Sox Fan]

Blue Jays shut the door on Farrell

 

Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff October 25, 2011 01:14 PM

 

 

By Peter Abraham, Globe Staff

 

Toronto shut the door on the idea of the Red Sox hiring John Farrell as manager. Team president Paul Beeston released this statement:

 

“Due to the distraction caused by media speculation regarding our employee permission policy, the Toronto Blue Jays have amended their policy and will not grant permission for lateral moves.”

 

So that is that.