Which players ended up costing Francona his job?

[Palodios]

I don't think his attitude is a problem. We'd be better off if more players were as intense as Youkilis. I am concerned that he may not be able to stay on the field and be productive. His trade value can't be too high right now.

 

I don't think we should discount the fight he had with Manny Ramirez a few years back. I think there is a difference between being intense, and too intense.

[Gringo]

IMO Crawford's postgame comments don't necessarily indicate that he cares about the team. He was totally overwhelmed with guilt over his final nail in the Red Sox season by ignoring what should have been a running shoe-string catch. It would have made no difference if he whiffed on it - the run was going to score if he didn't catch it. He knows he was a majot disappointment in 2011 - and in total " I'm sooo sorry" mode. If he was sincere' date=' he would have made the effort to match his skill set some time ago. I think he needs a major attitude adjustment. He plays with no confidence, and he probably sensed that his teammates couldn't depnd upon him as a clutch player. He might just be a small market player - out of the spotlight. I think Joe Madden must have held his hand a lot in TB.[/quote']

 

Yep, just no conviction in his play at all. That ugly attempt of a catch the other night perfectly sums up his season. Should have had it, could have had it, but didn't have the will or confidence to do it.

[example1]

I don't think his attitude is a problem. We'd be better off if more players were as intense as Youkilis. I am concerned that he may not be able to stay on the field and be productive. His trade value can't be too high right now.

 

I think his trade value would be pretty high. Part of his trade value is that he's an all-star and recognizable face/name to teams throughout the league. That's sometimes a very important factor if a team is going to give up someone significant, rather than getting a bunch of unknown rookies.

[a700hitter]

It's the FO"s fault that the team wasn't good enough to compete with a team like PHI. Theo and Co need to do a better job on numerous levels, but they put together a team that--skill wise--is more than sufficient to win the division and play at home throughout the playoffs.

 

It's also the fault of the FO that they didn't build a team with enough depth or character to go down the stretch.

[a700hitter]

I think his trade value would be pretty high. Part of his trade value is that he's an all-star and recognizable face/name to teams throughout the league. That's sometimes a very important factor if a team is going to give up someone significant' date=' rather than getting a bunch of unknown rookies.[/quote']He was limping around all season. He has a bad back and a sports hernia. I don't think you can get a lot for him right now.

[example1]

It's also the fault of the FO that they didn't build a team with enough depth or character to go down the stretch.

 

Yep. Don't disagree with you.

 

EDIT: What about the Ortiz question I asked you...?

[Gringo]

Youk is toast as a everyday infielder. The only way he stays is if we ship Papi out, and make Youk the DH.

[SoxSport]

Crawford was a mess on all fronts. AGon had a good year stats-wise' date=' but its hard to think of a big clutch hit from him and September. Neither guy seems to have any capacity for leadership. Getting these guys while letting Beltre and VMart walk is looking like a mistake.[/quote']

 

Agreed. Texas gave Beltre a crazy deal to age 38, so they might not have been able to re-sign him. VMart they should have kept. AGon's stats were way down the 2nd half.

 

I think the club had an underlying conditioning problem. Had it last year, too, with all those injuries.

 

We are looking at one soft organization.

[Cairns_Sox]

Wonder if Billy Beane would be keen on Youk + prospect/s for either Gio or at a stretch Anderson.

[Cairns_Sox]

Youk is toast as a everyday infielder. The only way he stays is if we ship Papi out' date=' and make Youk the DH.[/quote']

 

I fully agree, I take Papi everyday of the week, as long as he isn't apart of these clubhouse problem which in a way I think he may be.

[a700hitter]

A700, what do you think about those who are saying that Ortiz should probably go next year? I think you've been (appropriately) a huge champion of Ortiz's production on the field, but you've also been one of the strongest supporters of the FO/management doing what needs to be done and addressing problems.

 

If it turns out that he is part of the problem, what would you think about moving on without him? Would you prefer to eliminate the clubhouse problem without an obvious solution to the production?

 

I'm genuinely curious. It seems like you've been quiet on this...

I've never read where any teammates have had a problem with Ortiz. He always seems to be genuinely supportive of his team mates. He stepped up for Salty when he put his foot in his mouth about Latin players. When teams lose, they fracture internally, because desperation sets in. I think it is ridiculous to lay off this collapse on poor clubhouse chemistry. Let me state this clearly. The problem with the 2011 Red Sox was that they didn't have the horses. It was a poorly constructed team that collapsed after a few key injuries. I became very concerned during interleague play when I saw how the offense crumbled from taking Ortiz bat out of the lineup.

 

Ortiz is getting older. I think he can be very productive for another year, and because he is just a DH, his value is artificially low. If they let him walk, they need to bring in a premium bat to replace him, and that will not be cheap.

 

I have to laugh how people are so willing to throw Ortiz under the bus. In 2008 and 2009 he slumped at the beginning of the season and people were writing his obit and recommending that he be DFA'd. The team collapses in 2011 and all of a sudden he is a clubhouse cancer? I'm not convinced. You just don't want the finger of blame pointed where it belongs-- the Front Office. Bad attitudes and beer drinking didn't cause this collapse. If the FO thinks it will repair this team by replacing the manager and weeding out a few negative personalities, they are kidding themselves.

 

If they want to get rid of Ortiz, because they are going to bring in a premium bat, fine. If they want to trade Youk because he is declining physically, fine, but they will need to bring in a premium bat to replace him. I'm not onboard with getting rid of either of these guys because of their attitudes. They are both intensely competitive on the field. Youk leaves everything on the field., and Ortiz has worked extremely hard to recapture his offensive production, especially against lefties. Attitude did not cause the team to collapse, not even lackey's *******ness. You are barking up the wrong tree.

[jacksonianmarch]

Youk as DH provides you with flexibility, though. He could play 3b and 1b still, just not on a full time basis

[a700hitter]

Youk as DH provides you with flexibility' date=' though. He could play 3b and 1b still, just not on a full time basis[/quote']If they get rid of Ortiz, they need to get a premium bat to replace him and that will be very costly.

 

Of course, you would love to see Ortiz gone, because he eats Yankee pitching for lunch as did Manny. We replaced Manny with the God-fearing AGon who couldn't hit .200 against the Yankees. That's concerning to me and music to your ears.

[jacksonianmarch]

a700, not having the occasional rest really tired out your lineup. Having a floating DH is a good idea on a team with guys who seem injured yr in and yr out. Keeps em fresh

[Gringo]

Agreed. Texas gave Beltre a crazy deal to age 38, so they might not have been able to re-sign him. VMart they should have kept. AGon's stats were way down the 2nd half.

 

I think the club had an underlying conditioning problem. Had it last year, too, with all those injuries.

 

We are looking at one soft organization.

 

Yeah, this "Conditioning" issue is news to me, but apparently an ongoing concern in the FO...which begs the question why wasn't it addressed at an earlier point than the day after we get bounced?

[a700hitter]

a700' date=' not having the occasional rest really tired out your lineup. Having a floating DH is a good idea on a team with guys who seem injured yr in and yr out. Keeps em fresh[/quote']Yes, and I am sure that your ideas to help the Red Sox improve will be very helpful... not! We should know enough on this forum that any advice that you offer is dissembling ******** at best and trolling at worst. Stick to your Yankee threads. We'll come get you when we need you.

[jacksonianmarch]

they dont read our suggestions

[example1]

I've never read where any teammates have had a problem with Ortiz. He always seems to be genuinely supportive of his team mates. He stepped up for Salty when he put his foot in his mouth about Latin players. When teams lose, they fracture internally, because desperation sets in. I think it is ridiculous to lay off this collapse on poor clubhouse chemistry. Let me state this clearly. The problem with the 2011 Red Sox was that they didn't have the horses. It was a poorly constructed team that collapsed after a few key injuries. I became very concerned during interleague play when I saw how the offense crumbled from taking Ortiz bat out of the lineup.

 

Ortiz is getting older. I think he can be very productive for another year, and because he is just a DH, his value is artificially low. If they let him walk, they need to bring in a premium bat to replace him, and that will not be cheap.

 

I have to laugh how people are so willing to throw Ortiz under the bus. In 2008 and 2009 he slumped at the beginning of the season and people were writing his obit and recommending that he be DFA'd. The team collapses in 2011 and all of a sudden he is a clubhouse cancer? I'm not convinced. You just don't want the finger of blame pointed where it belongs-- the Front Office. Bad attitudes and beer drinking didn't cause this collapse. If the FO thinks it will repair this team by replacing the manager and weeding out a few negative personalities, they are kidding themselves.

 

If they want to get rid of Ortiz, because they are going to bring in a premium bat, fine. If they want to trade Youk because he is declining physically, fine, but they will need to bring in a premium bat to replace him. I'm not onboard with getting rid of either of these guys because of their attitudes. They are both intensely competitive on the field. Youk leaves everything on the field., and Ortiz has worked extremely hard to recapture his offensive production, especially against lefties. Attitude did not cause the team to collapse, not even lackey's *******ness. You are barking up the wrong tree.

 

I don't think I'm barking up the wrong tree at all. The chemistry issue is at the heart of why this team sucked, appeared lifeless and uncaring, etc.,

 

I think it's a problem when Ortiz throws a hissy-fit over not getting an RBI. I think it's a problem when he's calling out decisions that the team makes. I certainly don't put all of the blame on him, but he gets some of it and as a guy whose contract is up, I think they need to look really hard at what he brings to the table. He's one of the few players who can be addressed right away.

 

I personally would be unwilling to spend much money or many years on Ortiz at this point. I'm completely skeptical of his production. Yes, he had a horrible beginning of 2009 and 2010. Those would be inexcusable next year for team that needs to get off to a good start. I can't explain his amazing turnaround in terms of hitting against LHP. Did he develop a new strategy to approach them? After all these years? It doesn't add up and I'm not taking it to the bank.

 

I also agree with Jacko that his lack of versatility hurts the team. He's worth about 4.5 wins in a great season like the one he had. In that sense, I don't think they necessarily need to replace him with a huge bat. They can improve by 4.5 simply by having players come back to seasonal norms, guys like Crawford, Buchholz, Youkilis and Lackey would easily replace that production.

 

We will see. It will be a very interesting offseason.

[a700hitter]

they dont read our suggestions

No, but the gullible posters read them and you are effective at misleading them, and then I have to argue with them. That is why they have to be warned that you are totally full of s***.

[a700hitter]

I don't think I'm barking up the wrong tree at all. The chemistry issue is at the heart of why this team sucked, appeared lifeless and uncaring, etc.,

 

I think it's a problem when Ortiz throws a hissy-fit over not getting an RBI. I think it's a problem when he's calling out decisions that the team makes. I certainly don't put all of the blame on him, but he gets some of it and as a guy whose contract is up, I think they need to look really hard at what he brings to the table. He's one of the few players who can be addressed right away.

 

I personally would be unwilling to spend much money or many years on Ortiz at this point. I'm completely skeptical of his production. Yes, he had a horrible beginning of 2009 and 2010. Those would be inexcusable next year for team that needs to get off to a good start. I can't explain his amazing turnaround in terms of hitting against LHP. Did he develop a new strategy to approach them? After all these years? It doesn't add up and I'm not taking it to the bank.

 

I also agree with Jacko that his lack of versatility hurts the team. He's worth about 4.5 wins in a great season like the one he had. In that sense, I don't think they necessarily need to replace him with a huge bat. They can improve by 4.5 simply by having players come back to seasonal norms, guys like Crawford, Buchholz, Youkilis and Lackey would easily replace that production.

 

We will see. It will be a very interesting offseason.

You are in denial. You loved Theo because he was going to build a strong organization from the bottom up. He was going to put in place a scouting and development system that would churn out stars and it would be the envy of baseball. For a time that was true. They churned out top talent that became stars, but after Ellsbury and Buchholz there has been nothing. I am curious what personnel changes there have been in the scouting and player development organization, because they obviously lost a key component of that successful organization. Not only isn't our scouting and player development not the envy of baseball, it is only the third best organization in our own division. The Yankees and Rays are kicking our ass in that aspect. We hate the Yankees for all their money and buying Championships, but their minor league system and their scouting is burying ours. In the last few years the FO has given us a bloated payroll of overpaid under producing players and a farm system without any top talent. That's a bad job. Theo got credit for this team when things were going well, so he has to take the hits as well. He needs to rebuild his scouting and player development team. That might be the most important development of the offseason, but it will be hard to evaluate for the fans. Attitude was not the issue. It's so ridiculous to think that guys who were winners and clutch players like Youk and Ortiz have become clubhouse cancers that caused this debacle. It's absurd and a bigger copout than blaming injuries. They weren't good enough. That's the reason. We all need to stop whining and hope that the organization is making the changes off the field that are necessary to get back to where they were.

[a700hitter]

I personally would be unwilling to spend much money or many years on Ortiz at this point. I'm completely skeptical of his production. Yes, he had a horrible beginning of 2009 and 2010. Those would be inexcusable next year for team that needs to get off to a good start. I can't explain his amazing turnaround in terms of hitting against LHP. Did he develop a new strategy to approach them? After all these years? It doesn't add up and I'm not taking it to the bank.

 

Actually he did change his approach and it was talked about a lot during the season. He had become pull happy and he made a conscious effort to take lefties to the opposite field. That's what he used to do when he as at his best. He adjusted his approach. Are you insinuating that he started juicing and that's the reason? Do you really want to go down that road? If he is juicing, that should help keep him young and he should produce at a high level for years to come, so I don't get the point of your insinuation.

 

Edit: If the FO wants to go in a different direction than Ortiz, because they think he is too old, I am fine with that, but they need to replace him with a premium bat, and as I said before, that will be very expensive. If they are cutting ties with him because of his attitude, that's just ridiculous. I have never read or heard one story where any team mate thought he was anything other than a positive personality.

[example1]

You are in denial. You loved Theo because he was going to build a strong organization from the bottom up. He was going to put in place a scouting and development system that would churn out stars and it would be the envy of baseball. For a time that was true. They churned out top talent that became stars' date=' but after Ellsbury and Buchholz there has been nothing. I am curious what personnel changes there have been in the scouting and player development organization, because they obviously lost a key component of that successful organization. Not only isn't our scouting and player development not the envy of baseball, it is only the third best organization in our own division. The Yankees and Rays are kicking our ass in that aspect. We hate the Yankees for all their money and buying Championships, but their minor league system and their scouting is burying ours. In the last few years the FO has given us a bloated payroll of overpaid under producing players and a farm system without any top talent. That's a bad job. Theo got credit for this team when things were going well, so he has to take the hits as well. He needs to rebuild his scouting and player development team. That might be the most important development of the offseason, but it will be hard to evaluate for the fans. Attitude was not the issue. It's so ridiculous to think that guys who were winners and clutch players like Youk and Ortiz have become clubhouse cancers that caused this debacle. It's absurd and a bigger copout than blaming injuries. They weren't good enough. That's the reason. We all need to stop whining and hope that the organization is making the changes off the field that are necessary to get back to where they were.[/quote']

 

I'm not in denial at all. There needs to be accountability at all levels, including the FO.

 

However, you are exonerating the players on the field above all else. I don't see how that is possible. The team didn't win enough games on the field, and in virtually every game they played they were the favorites. They were favorites over the Rays, favorites over the O's, favorites over the Jays. They should have won more than they did and we couldn't have asked for more than to have Jon Lester or Josh Beckett on the mound when it mattered most.

 

The team, as constructed, had the 2nd best record in baseball for most of the season and the best record in the AL. Then they collapsed. Should they have had more "horses" behind Beckett and Lester? Maybe, but those guys needed to be able to go more than 6 innings in games that matter.

 

I'm not willing to write this all off as a function of the way the team was constructed. Sure, that was part of it, but as constructed this SHOULD have been a team that got to the playoffs and made a run. No doubt in my mind. Instead, they didn't. The players are responsible for that.

 

I doubt we disagree there.

 

Finally, I think that there has been a lull in the player development line. This is partially due to poor draft picks (Place, Dent, etc.,) trades (V-Mart, Gonzalez), partly due to injuries (Kalish, Doubront) and partly due to pure misfortune (Westmoreland). I think there's still pleny of reason to be optimistic about the farm system, and that people who really know these things woudl agree. These things ebb and flow, but the farm system is in MUCH better shape than it was when Theo took over. No doubt about that.

[example1]

Actually he did change his approach and it was talked about a lot during the season. He had become pull happy and he made a conscious effort to take lefties to the opposite field. That's what he used to do when he as at his best. He adjusted his approach. Are you insinuating that he started juicing and that's the reason? Do you really want to go down that road? If he is juicing, that should help keep him young and he should produce at a high level for years to come, so I don't get the point of your insinuation.

 

Edit: If the FO wants to go in a different direction than Ortiz, because they think he is too old, I am fine with that, but they need to replace him with a premium bat, and as I said before, that will be very expensive. If they are cutting ties with him because of his attitude, that's just ridiculous. I have never read or heard one story where any team mate thought he was anything other than a positive personality.

 

I'm wary of going down the steroids line too, but I'm not so naive as to think A) it couldn't happen or B ) it wouldn't stop when he gets a nice new contract.

 

With all of the s***** contract year signings lately, I'm hesitant about a spike in production the year before a contract.

[soxfan74]

I don't think I'm barking up the wrong tree at all. The chemistry issue is at the heart of why this team sucked, appeared lifeless and uncaring, etc.,

 

I think it's a problem when Ortiz throws a hissy-fit over not getting an RBI. I think it's a problem when he's calling out decisions that the team makes. I certainly don't put all of the blame on him, but he gets some of it and as a guy whose contract is up, I think they need to look really hard at what he brings to the table. He's one of the few players who can be addressed right away.

 

I personally would be unwilling to spend much money or many years on Ortiz at this point. I'm completely skeptical of his production. Yes, he had a horrible beginning of 2009 and 2010. Those would be inexcusable next year for team that needs to get off to a good start. I can't explain his amazing turnaround in terms of hitting against LHP. Did he develop a new strategy to approach them? After all these years? It doesn't add up and I'm not taking it to the bank.

 

I also agree with Jacko that his lack of versatility hurts the team. He's worth about 4.5 wins in a great season like the one he had. In that sense, I don't think they necessarily need to replace him with a huge bat. They can improve by 4.5 simply by having players come back to seasonal norms, guys like Crawford, Buchholz, Youkilis and Lackey would easily replace that production.

 

We will see. It will be a very interesting offseason.

 

 

 

 

I agree with this completely. There is no telling what went on behind closed doors. Complaining about one RBI. really? That seems like a guy that is more interested in himself than anything else. You can take some pressure off Agon and Youk by having them DH at times also. I could never understand why He was good enough to play first in interleague play. Yet he could not be used to give Agon ar Youk when he played there the occasional day off from the field.

 

 

I personally think that it is time for Lavernway at backup catcher/DH. He did much better than expected the last two games. No he did not get the key hit needed the last game. He did have one taken away with the great catch by Markakis.

[a700hitter]

I'm not in denial at all. There needs to be accountability at all levels, including the FO.

 

However, you are exonerating the players on the field above all else. I don't see how that is possible.

No, I am not exonerrating them. I am acknowledging that they weren't good enough. You are making some sort of insinuation that they weren't trying. I don't believe that for a second. They tried, but they weren't good enough.

 

The team' date=' as constructed, had the 2nd best record in baseball for most of the season and the best record in the AL. Then they collapsed. Should they have had more "horses" behind Beckett and Lester? Maybe, but those guys needed to be able to go more than 6 innings in games that matter. [/quote']It's a 162 game season. How you play for 1 or 2 months doesn't matter in the end. At the end of the day, they were a 90 win team and that wasn't good enough. Lester and Beckett and Papelbon and Bard all came up small. They weren't good enough. It wasn't their attitudes.

 

I'm not willing to write this all off as a function of the way the team was constructed. Sure, that was part of it, but as constructed this SHOULD have been a team that got to the playoffs and made a run. No doubt in my mind. Instead, they didn't. The players are responsible for that.

 

I doubt we disagree there.

I thought they were built to win, but I was wrong. They weren't good enough and the season proved it to be the case. It wasn't luck, injuries, attitudes or some other boogeyman. They simply weren't good enough. Are the players to blame? Certainly, they are. They weren't good enough. Did they try? Yes, they did. Who put together a roster of players that weren't good enough? You know the answer. Sorry, your boy Theo messed up. Just because we all thought it was a great team doesn't make him right.

 

Finally' date=' I think that there has been a lull in the player development line. This is partially due to poor draft picks (Place, Dent, etc.,) trades (V-Mart, Gonzalez), partly due to injuries (Kalish, Doubront) and partly due to pure misfortune (Westmoreland). I think there's still pleny of reason to be optimistic about the farm system, and that people who really know these things woudl agree. These things ebb and flow, but the farm system is in MUCH better shape than it was when Theo took over. No doubt about that.[/quote']More excuses. The production by the minor league system has fallen off dramatically. Something has gone awry in that part of the organization. It is probably due to personnel changes that we know nothing about.

[a700hitter]

I'm wary of going down the steroids line too, but I'm not so naive as to think A) it couldn't happen or B ) it wouldn't stop when he gets a nice new contract.

 

With all of the s***** contract year signings lately, I'm hesitant about a spike in production the year before a contract.

Then give a 1 year contract.

[example1]

A700, I realize you don't think that chemistry or mental preparation has much to do with how a team does, but I think that most high level atheletes and experts in the field would say that is often the difference between teams that succeed and those that don't. It is probably too touchy-feely for you to embrace (no pun intended ) but mental preparation and feeling supported by teammates through good and bad is something that coaches/managers and leaders spend a lot of time on.

 

This team lacked leadership, from the FO down to the on-the-field level. Francona help himself accountabile enough to not come back. A number of those players should not be welcomed back. Theo's job is not to come into the clubhouse and do the ra-ra thing, but it is to make sure that the leaders are there when they are needed to be. Clearly that didn't work out this year, so it will need to be addressed moving forwad.

 

It isn't all about effort that you give when you are out there. A leaders mentality about the game rubs off on other players and, over many weeks or months, it can be infectious in a good or bad way.

 

As Edes put it:

 

"Starting pitchers drinking in the clubhouse during games on days when they weren't pitching, which can leave one boozily indifferent to the plight of teammates after they've just lost in extra innings? Originally reported in the Boston Herald, it was not only confirmed here, but with the added twist that it has been going on the past two seasons."

 

This is the kind of nuanced s*** that takes an otherwise good team and makes them average. It's the small stuff that matters.

 

More excuses. The production by the minor league system has fallen off dramatically. Something has gone awry in that part of the organization. It is probably due to personnel changes that we know nothing about.

 

You have to know that trading away big prospects for players immediately hurts the ability of your farm to help the team. That's just a given. It's not an excuse. Same with injuries.

 

We know the personnel changes. Theo has lost a number of his highest assistants to other jobs and many of them have taken others from within the organization with them to the new position. There have been plenty of personnel changes.

[example1]

Then give a 1 year contract.

 

And if he demands 2 for "all that he's done" for the organization? Would you be okay with them cutting bait and searching for a better alternative?

[fendog]

I blame Crawford for not putting up the numbers he was paid to put up and Lackey..........well do I even need to say anything about him at this point?

 

I don't blame Crawford at all for this stuff. Yes, he should have produced more, but perhaps he didn't because he showed up to this clubhouse zoo and said to himself, "WTF am I doing here? Nobody told me these guys were so f***ed up!" add that to his newness and huge contract and I can see that doing a number on a new guy who cares.

Lackey just doesn't care, period. He was described as a "bulldog" - let's change that to "bully". Consider how much of a jerk he was in front of 37,000 people - imagine what an ******* he was behind closed doors. I think he was the most poisonous of all and he needs to go.

Youkalis is a jerk as well - a real hot head. Remember his comments about Ellsbury last year? From the looks of it, Jacoby paid I bit more attention to his body than Youk did. Now, Youk is broken down. Ells contributed far more in 2 of his 3 years than Youk ever did.I heard that Youk continued to rag on Jacoby this season.

Management really blew this - they should have exercised Tito's option mid season and told the players that "THIS is your boss for as long as you are here - toe the line or you are gone." Now they have the psychos running the asylum.

[jung]

"They were not good enough" is simply too simplistic an answer and ignores some real issues that this team is going to have to address. Yes the actual talent level was a problem but they were not in a mental state as a team that allowed them to overachieve or even play to their potential all-be-it potential that was less than we had hoped.

 

How do you explain being 2-61 in games when they were behind at the 7th inning stretch?

How do you explain guys gaining weight during the season?

How do you explain many of their highest paid players inability to play consistently into the second half?

How do you explain the incredible number of mental mistakes they made going down the stretch?

How do you explain a less talented team like Tampa taking them to the woodshed?

How do you explain guys vocally and publicly pursuing their own selfish interests while the team is crumbling around them ala' Ortiz and Wake and Lackey?

 

This was a heartless, bloated, overpaid, "I only care about getting mine" bunch that does not even deserve to be called a team. The guys that were truly selfish, self centered *******s took a number of the other's down with them and the whole thing disintegrated into I gotta get mine-ism.

 

How clear could Tito have been. "When things started to turn I could not get them to care enough about each other". "When things go bad, a team tends to show its true colors and I did not like the colors I saw". I am not saying I believe that Tito ushered himself out the door but don't confuse that with thinking he fabricated any of the above comments.

 

In business there is a thing called "calling in rich". It generally refers to a management group that gets its windfall via the acquisition route and no longer has the desire to work. This team called in rich. They filled out the uniforms. In fact some of them more than filled out the uniforms but were there in body only. Unfortunately with few exceptions the highest paid guys and guys that were expected to be the guys that defined this team did just that. They were either so colorless and lacking in intestinal fortitude that they simply bent with the prevailing wind or they were the prevailing wind, all in the wrong direction. They did define this team and dragged it right into the gutter.

 

When you have a $180M payroll and cannot even make it to the show, you are in the gutter. There is no consolation in having compiled a better record than the Orioles. In the end, this was a "team" that did not even like itself. That is not the same thing as the Oakland A's fighting with each other but winning as a team or Reggie Jackson's Yankees. They could not get back to the dugout from an at bat fast enough and they could not get away from each other fast enough either. At the end for many of them the desire to get away from each other was stronger than the desire to win and go on. With few exceptions, they did not want to go to Tampa for one game or to Texas for five. They just wanted to go home!