Anti Fantasy Round 2: Ital v CD

[TheKilo]

Vote for this matchup starting at 8:00 am Friday

[italstallianion]

Team: Erin Andrews Likes It Raw

 

 

QB: Peyton Manning (Joe Flacco)

HB: Ray Rice (Steven Jackson)

HB: Felix Jones (Ladanian Tomlinson)

WR: Brandon Marshall (Larry Fitzgerald)

WR: Wes Welker (Percy Harvin)

WR: Steve Smith (Car) (Devery Henderson)

WR: Lee Evans (Braylon Edwards)

TE: Dallas Clark (Brent Celek)

RT: John Stinchcomb (V Carey) (Offensive Line might be listed in the wrong order)

RG: Ryan Lilja (Deuce Lutui)

C: Shaun O'Hara (J Sullivan)

LG: Alan Faneca (Chris Kemoeatu)

LT: Bryant Mckinnie (Jordan Gross)

DE: Robert Mathis (Dwight Freeney)

DE: John Abraham (Igor Olshansky)

DT: Jon Babineaux (BJ Raji)

DT: Terrence Cody (Patrick Willis) (4-3 vs. 3-4)

OLB: Brian Cushing (Anthony Spencer)

OLB: Keith Rivers (Daryl Smith)

ILB: EJ Henderson (DeMeco Ryans)

CB: Terence Newman (Asante Samuel)

CB: Charles Tillman (Vontae Davis)

FS: Jairus Byrd (Dashon Goldson)

SS: Bernard Pollard (Quintin Mikell)

K: David Akers (Nick Folk)

P: Matt McBriar (Brett Kern)

KR/PR: Brandon Banks (Danny Amendola)

HC: John Harbaugh (Ken Wisenhunt)

Bench: Sam Bradford QB (Ryan Fitzpatrick)

Bench: Gary Brackett ILB (Tyson Alualu)

 

 

I'm going to post my rationale a bit later, but I figured that I should at least post my roster here so that people don't have to look it up.

[italstallianion]

I was a little worried about this matchup because I had ranked Coco's team pretty highly in the power rankings, but I like my team's chances here.

 

To start, I think that my team has his team beat offensively in most positions.

 

QB: I would consider Peyton Manning to be one of the top 3 QB's (along with Brady and Brees with Rodgers and Rivers at 4th and 5th) and to be honest, I'd take my backup QB in Sam Bradford over his starting QB Joe Flacco if this was 5 years in the future.

 

RB: I think that Coco has the best RB of the 4 with Steven Jackson, although I'd take my 1 and 2 backs over his 1 and 2 backs, considering that in 3 years, my RB's will be 26, and his will be 30 and 34. I think that Steven Jackson is one of the few RB's that I'd like at 30, but I think that Tomlinson would be pretty much useless at 34. I think that Coco would have to rely A LOT on Steven Jackson, especially with an average QB and a relic backup RB.

 

WR's: Much like the RB group, I think that Coco has the best overall player of the bunch (Larry Fitzgerald) but that I have the best group of the matchup. While I'd take Fitzgerald over any WR of the NFL (other than Andre Johnson) I would take Marshall/Welker/Smith/Evans over Fitzgerald/Harvin/Henderson/Edwards. Despite Harvin's problems staying on the field (which I'll give him a benefit of the doubt because migraine's are a b****) and Banana-Hands Braylon's drops, I would only give my WR crew a slight edge over Coco's.

 

TE: I think that Dallas Clark is one of the top TE's in the NFL, but Celek is also a good TE on a pass heavy team, so I think it's a wash at TE, although I'd rather have Dallas Clark, especially since the QB of my team is Peyton Manning, which makes him a perfect fit.

 

Offensive Line: While Coco has a younger offensive line, only 1 of his 5 lineman has been to a Pro Bowl, and Jordan Gross went to 1 Pro Bowl. In comparison, 4 of my 5 offensive lineman are Pro Bowlers (Mckinnie: 1, Alan Faneca: 6, Shaun O'Hara: 2, and John Stinchcomb: 1) In addition, my only lineman who hasn't been to a Pro Bowl (Ryan Lilja) was on the Indianapolis Colts pass protecting for Peyton Manning for 6 years, and is currently on one of the best rushing teams in the NFL (KC)

 

Obviously Pro Bowls are overrated, but my point is that I'd take my offensive line over his, especially over his defensive line, which I'll get too shortly, or right now.

 

Defensive Line: Talent wise, I consider this to be reasonably equal, however, Dwight Freeney is out of place in a 3-4 defense, and while I like BJ Raji, I think that if you are going to do a 3-4 defense, you'd need a bigger, gap clogging DT such as Ratliff, Hampton, Ngata/Cody, Rogers etc. The only player in my entire front 7 (front 8 counting my bench player) that is out of position is Terrence Cody, and it's easier for his health and durability to play a 4-3 DT rather than a 3-4 NT. My DE's are both Pro Bowlers and can get a lot of sacks and turnovers. I also have the textbook 4-3 with a gap clogging DT in Cody, and a faster turnover producing DT in Babineaux. I think that it would take 5 ProBowl lineman to keep these 4 from getting sacks, fumbles, and short runs.

 

Linebackers: This would be the one spot in my opinion where Coco wins hands down. He's got 2 of the best ILB's in the league in Patrick Willis and DeMeco Ryans, and he has a good OLB in Anthony Spencer. I'm not sold on Daryl Smith being a very good OLB (and this is from a Jaguars fan), and I'd also point out Daryl Smith comes from a 4-3 Jacksonville system. While Coco wins at LB, my linebackers are no slouches. Brian Cushing was the defensive rookie of the year and Pro Bowler in his first season last year, and while he did take steroids, he was so dominant that they revoted and he STILL won the award. Keith Rivers also finished SECOND in the defensive rookie of the year voting in 2008 behind Jerod Mayo, and he could have possibly won the award if his season wasn't ended early by a broken jaw from a cheap block from Hines Ward. As for my ILB's, I have two very good tacklers that can call signals and coordinate defenses for the Colts and Vikings. They certainly aren't as good as Ryans and Willis, but they can make tackles and call the shots, AND they both play in 4-3 defenses, which is what I'm going with.

 

Secondary: Coco has a good corner in Asante Samuel, but I'd be worried about his gambling nature. He can get INT's, and on the next outing get beat for a TD. He's a good CB overall, but he's inconsistent and his other CB is young in Vontae Davis. I have Terrence Newman who is a good cover CB and tackler, but not as good of a play maker as Samuel, or Charles Tillman. Tillman, like Samuel, is a turnover generator and can force fumbles and still make tackles better than most CB's. I'd give the CB talent a wash, although I'd rather have my 2 CB's. Fitzgerald can beat my secondary, but I'm not sure about his other WR's though. Coco also has a good safety in Quintin Mikell, but I'm not sure about Dashon Goldson, whereas Jairus Byrd is a young pro bowl safety (as is Mikell) and Bernard Pollard is a safety that seems to be everywhere and makes a lot of tackles. The Houston Defense isn't very good, but it isn't because of Cushing, Williams, Ryans, or Pollard. Pollard is a player that offenses need to account for and is the playmaker that I'm looking for. Again, I'd consider the overall secondary a wash, but I'd take my secondary at stopping Joe Flacco over his secondary trying to stop Peyton Manning.

 

Special Teams: I know that most Special Teams are supposed to be washes, but I'd take David Akers over Nick Folk by a lot. Nick Folk has been horrible the past 2 years, making 64.3% FG's in Dallas, and 71.9% in New York this year. This is compared to David Akers 86.5% and 83.9%. In addition, Aker's 81.8% is better than Folks 77% in their careers, but Akers has had a longer and more established career (playoffs included) and Folk has been trending downwards recently.

 

I think that the rest of the Special Teams is a wash, although I'd take Sam Bradford over Ryan Fitzpatrick and I'd take John Harbaugh over Ken Wisenhunt. Those are preferences and I don't see them to be a big deal in the voting.

 

That said, I still think Coco has a very good team and I feel bad that this is a 2nd round matchup because I had ranked Coco's team pretty high in the power rankings. I wish you the best of luck Coco and may the better team win.

[TheKilo]

Very, very close matchup. I think Manning and Bradford beat out Flacco and Fitzpatrick but I'm struggling to find any other matchup where I'd call Ital a clear winner. I like Ital's o-line but am still puzzled about the Faneca selection, has he even played this year? WR is pretty much a wash (although with Fitzgerald and Harvin I think Coco has the more explosive options) and I really think Coco's defensive backfield has a slight edge (Vontae Davis is a very, very good cover corner).

 

In my opinion, this would be a pick-'em game (pretty impressive since CD was the #9 and ital was the #1).

[TheKilo]

Upon review, I think I'll take Coco's team by the slimmest of margins.

[Youker20]

faneca is in the league and starting for arizona although he hasn't been that good this year at al.. ill come back to this one, too close

[yankees228]

I was also puzzled a bit by the Faneca and O'Hara selections, but other than that, I absolutely love Ital's offense. Both backs are dangerous, his WRs are explosive, and with them demanding so much attention, Clark should have be effective down the seam. And on top of that, he picked the right QB to take advantage of all these weapons. With Freeney out of place on defense, I'm worried about Coco's ability to generate a pass rush, and even with a good secondary, Manning should have a field day if given time.

 

On the other side of the ball I think Coco will also be able to put up some points, as Fitzgerald and Harvin compliment each other well, and Jackson will be dangerous out of the backfield. But while Flacco has his strengths, he still struggles with his pre-snap reads at times, and his touch short/intermediate throws needs to be improved. Three years down the road I think he'll improve in these areas, but not enough to match scores with Ital's offense.

 

So I'll take Ital in a game decided by 1-2 scores.

[WhiskeyBreath]

Ital

 

It's a nice match up but I just can't see CD's defense having the type of personnel to stop Manning and his weapons. Other than that it's fairly close.

[yrtb]

Ital, his explanation sums up the bulk of my opinion. Ital has a stacked offense, QB, receivers, running backs, and most importantly, his offensive line is stacked. CoCo has a decent front 7, but he won't be able to bring much pressure and Peyton Manning is a beast

 

Ital's defense can be a liability, but if the game turns into a shootout ital will win

[YanksHater213]

This is a really tough one. I'm pretty sure my original rankings had these teams further apart than they look right here. I'm really not a fan of Ital's offensive line, nor am I a fan of his defense, but there really is no denying that there's talent there.

 

I think I'm going to take Coco here. For a few reasons I'll go into in a bit. I know Ital put a little time into this so I want to give him a fair reasoning here.

[YanksHater213]

Reasons why I take Coco:

 

1. His offense is built extremely well

-He picked two quarterbacks, while definitely unspectacular, do their job well, and don't need to be throwing the ball 2/3 downs to be effective.

-He's got a very underrated RB tandem behind a good offensive line. We've been seeing what LT can do in NY when he's not the feature back, and in this offense I expect him to be more explosive. Jackson is his rock. 20 carries a game.

-He also has a perfectly built WR core. Each player has a defined role, Fitz is the go to guy, Harvin is the playmaker, Henderson is his deep threat, Edwards is his all purpose guy.

 

2. Ital's offense, while talented, I feel is poorly constructed

-He's got plenty of talent, but I feel like there is not enough variety.

-He lacks a viable rock RB who can run the clock down late in the game, so he's really going to rely on Manning a little bit too much.

-Marshall and Welker are pretty much the same type of player. Get open underneath and pick up YACs, same with Evans and Henderson running fly patterns.

-I don't see enough variety here to be extremely successful against a very good defense.

3. Coco has guys who can cover the middle of the field

-Ryans and Willis are two of the best and quickest middle guys in the NFL. They have the proper athleticism that it takes to not only stuff the run, but cover guys and wrap them up to limit the YAC potential of Clark, Welker and Marshall.

 

4. I think Coco's running game eats this front 7 for breakfast lunch and dinner

 

5. Coco's defense is on the upswing while Ital has more veterans who are on the downswing

-Ryans, Willis, Raji, Davis is an awesome young core who are all probably going to be Pro-Bowl guys

 

6. John Harbaugh is not the coach for Ital's team

-Harbaugh is a defensive coach, and isn't an offensive wizard. I think Ital's team is going to rely on blowing people out, and I think they will be somewhat limited by not having an offensive type of coach like a Martz type of guy.

[italstallianion]

While I don't agree with some of that, or a lot (or even most) to be honest, I nonetheless appreciate your effort in explaining your reasoning. I'd be lying if I didn't say that I was incredibly surprised with how this thread has turned out to this point, but if someone is going to vote, I'd much rather them explain their thought process than posting one liners.

 

I wasn't aware that being a moderator had its benefits in the redraft contests.

[YanksHater213]

It's kinda funny, I kind of assumed me and Y228 would be voting prettymuch the same way, since we both built incredibly similar teams and it seems like we kind of value similar things in a football team.

[italstallianion]

Although I would have bet my house that you and Kilo would always vote the same way.

[YanksHater213]

We have an underground agreement to do so.

[yrtb]

Yeah, I've noticed that you and Kilo seem to have a rather similar mindset in both the basketball and football redrafts

[yankees228]

It's kinda funny' date=' I kind of assumed me and Y228 would be voting prettymuch the same way, since we both built incredibly similar teams and it seems like we kind of value similar things in a football team.[/quote']

 

I'd imagine that we do see things in a similar way (based on the reasons you stated), but we just view Ital's team differently.

[Divinity]

I vote Ital, I think this match comes down which team would be able to score the most; I think having Peyton and the superior weapons Ital surrounded him with gives him the win.

[TheKilo]

Final: 4-2 Ital