Why Beltre Will Only Cost $2 Million....

[Imperial59]

At least for the purposes of the salary cap.

 

According to Alex Speier of WEEI.com, the Red Sox only added $2 million to the 2010 payroll for luxury tax purposes after signing Adrian Beltre and trading Casey Kotchman to the Mariners for Bill Hall.

 

It's some pretty clever maneuvering. The $5 million player option for Adrian Beltre is key, as it pulls his average annual value to $7 million per season. With that contract in place, the Red Sox agreed to trade Kotchman -- likely to make $3.5 million in arbitation -- to the Mariners for Hall, whose contract averages $6 million per season. In turn, the Mariners will kick in around $7.5 million as part of the trade, which will be deducted from the Red Sox payroll for luxury tax purposes. Add it all up and the Red Sox were able to sign Beltre and acquire Hall for just around $2 million. Not bad, Theo. Not bad at all.

 

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=MLB&id=2616

[redsoxrules]

Good stuff

[jacksonianmarch]

So he wont cost too much, but he sucks. He did OPS under .700 last yr.

[Plumpamania]

Name one bench player on the Yankees roster better.

[Dipre]

Like f***ing clockwork. Holy hell.

[Imperial59]

So he wont cost too much' date=' but he sucks. He did OPS under .700 last yr.[/quote']

 

I'm heartbroken that we're stuck with a guy who averaged a 3.9 WAR 2006-2008 for a whopping $2 million. Jacko said he sucks, and we all know how reasonable he is.

[jacksonianmarch]

I am just playing your game Imperial.

[Imperial59]

Like f***ing clockwork. Holy hell.

 

The bitterness of palpable. Jacko spent quite a bit of his time arguing how Beltre would be a huge blow to the Red Sox in luxury tax. He could have just admitted he was wrong, but that would require a small amount of maturity.

[Dipre]

I am just playing your game Imperial.

 

********.

 

This is your game. Always has been. Always will be.

[Imperial59]

I am just playing your game Imperial.

 

If there's another guy named Imperial who spends his free time baiting on a Yankees board, I promise it's not me.

[Cocos Disciples]

So he wont cost too much' date=' but he sucks. He did OPS under .700 last yr.[/quote']

 

I think I'll consider his .779 career OPS over his career worst OPS. He's also the best defensive 3B in baseball.

[jacksonianmarch]

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

[yankees228]

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

 

But, what you're missing is that they've clearly changed their approach.

[redsoxrules]

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

 

HOLY s***

 

 

Lowell cant play third base anymore , anyone will be an upgrade over him

 

We also added Lackey

 

our defense is WAY better than last year

[Dipre]

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

 

*Yawn*.

 

Add a full season of V-Mart and Marco Scutaro, as well as two players with tailor-made swings for Fenway.

 

Keep trying to convince yourself, buddy.

 

The only pink hat fan would be one who bought the ******** you're selling.

 

And yes, i'm being dismissive and confrontations because i have little patience for trolls.

[Cocos Disciples]

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

You changed your tune very quickly on Beltre. You also forgot the offensive upgrade at SS. ButI don't think anyone will dispute that the offense has downgraded. You're not breaking new ground here. However, if you really think there's not a tremendous defensive upgrade, I don't know what to tell you.

[Dipre]

You changed your tune very quickly on Beltre. You also forgot the offensive upgrade at SS. ButI don't think anyone will dispute that the offense has downgraded. You're not breaking new ground here. However' date=' if you really think there's not a tremendous defensive upgrade, I don't know what to tell you.[/quote']

 

That's not the point.

 

The point is that the offensive downgrade is not "massive".

 

Some offense will be lost, but in 2009, the Red Sox' problem was not offense, it was defense and pitching.

 

We still need a big bopper, which we don't have, but the team will be much more competitive by solidifying pitching and defense, and seeing what the offense can do.

 

If you think this team will score less than 820 runs next year, then i have a bridge i want to sell you........

[Cocos Disciples]

That's not the point.

 

The point is that the offensive downgrade is not "massive".

 

Some offense will be lost, but in 2009, the Red Sox' problem was not offense, it was defense and pitching.

 

We still need a big bopper, which we don't have, but the team will be much more competitive by solidifying pitching and defense, and seeing what the offense can do.

 

If you think this team will score less than 820 runs next year, then i have a bridge i want to sell you........

That's basically what I said. Moderate offensive downgrade, but also a pitching and defense upgrade.

[Imperial59]

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

 

If you want to discuss the Red Sox offense, there's a thread for that - http://www.talksox.com/forum/talk-sox-forum/13674-should-offensive-regression-expected-next-year.html

 

I'm not going to let you derail every single thread on this site with the same off-topic rant about how the Red Sox offense is so much worse than they were last year with Jason Varitek and Nick Green.

[Dipre]

That's basically what I said. Moderate offensive downgrade' date=' but also a pitching and defense upgrade.[/quote']

 

It's simple.

 

Take a look at last year's run differential:

 

872 RS

 

736 RA

 

695 ERA

 

That "massive" offensive regression will be very much outdone by the upgrade in run-prevention. Preventing runs is just as important as scoring them, and if you got a little worse at scoring but a lot better in preventing, then you upgraded your team. Or so would logic dictate, which is not something everyone on this site respects.

[Cocos Disciples]

It's simple.

 

Take a look at last year's run differential:

 

872 RS

 

736 RA

 

695 ERA

 

That "massive" offensive regression will be very much outdone by the upgrade in run-prevention. Preventing runs is just as important as scoring them, and if you got a little worse at scoring but a lot better in preventing, then you upgraded your team. Or so would logic dictate, which is not something everyone on this site respects.

Again, I didn't say it was a "massive" downgrade. I'm agreeing with you.

[Dipre]

Again' date=' I didn't say it was a "massive" downgrade. I'm agreeing with you.[/quote']

 

Lol not directed at you.

 

You are removing Bay who had a .921OPS and a .384OBP.

You are removing Lowell who had an .811OPS and a .337OBP.

You add a player in Beltre who had a .683OPS and a .304OBP.

You add a player in Cameron who had a .794OPS and a .342OBP.

 

You can make all the excuses you want to, but both of these guys are massive downgrades. Beltre, when healthy, is good for a .780-.800OPS and a .320OBP.

 

The sox offense was built upon being difficult outs. But you subtract two guys from the middle of your order who worked counts and add two guys who arent tough outs. This offense became less dangerous and is being sold to the pink hats as a defensive upgrade.

 

Directed at the bolded part.

[Cocos Disciples]

Lol not directed at you.

 

 

 

Directed at the bolded part.

Gotcha. I was confused because you quoted me.

[Imperial59]

You know what's particularly hilarious about his rant? He said himself that Beltre is good for a 790-800 OPS then claims he's a huge offensive downgrade from Lowell who he just stated had an .811 OPS last year (but could only play 100 games at third).

[Dipre]

You know what's particularly hilarious about his rant? He said himself that Beltre is good for a 790-800 OPS then claims he's a huge offensive downgrade from Lowell who he just stated had an .811 OPS last year (but could only play 100 games at third).

 

What's really interesting is how he's desperately looking for ways to attack Beltre after he was pounding his chest because it was all but certain that Kotchman was going to be our starter at 1B.

[Plumpamania]

JACKSON PLZ STATE A MEMBER OF THE YANKEES BENCH BETTER BILL HALL?!?!

[Imperial59]

What's really interesting is how he's desperately looking for ways to attack Beltre after he was pounding his chest because it was all but certain that Kotchman was going to be our starter at 1B.

 

He also spent quite a bit of time claiming that Beltre would be a huge blow to the Red Sox in luxury tax. He's taking it harder than I thought he would though. He's obviously upset, making posts just to say stuff like "Beltre sucks".

 

I love how he tries to turn every thread into a discussion about how much better the offense was last year, and he hasn't mentioned the defense or pitching at all.

[Dipre]

He also spent quite a bit of time claiming that Beltre would be a huge blow to the Red Sox in luxury tax. He's taking it harder than I thought he would though. He's obviously upset, making posts just to say stuff like "Beltre sucks".

 

I love how he tries to turn every thread into a discussion about how much better the offense was last year, and he hasn't mentioned the defense or pitching at all.

 

But if i recall correctly, the real need for the Sox was "three reliable starters, which they didn't have". They sign Lackey, not another word about the subject.

[BoSox21]

So he wont cost too much' date=' but he sucks. He did OPS under .700 last yr.[/quote']

 

Name one bench player on the Yankees roster better.

 

Jacko, you read the post. We know you did. Answer the f***ing question.

[Dipre]

Jacko' date=' you read the post. We know you did. Answer the f***ing question.[/quote']

 

This post made me laugh. Hard.