2009 Yankees Game Thread

[yankees228]

It was negative.. You know it! :harhar:

 

I was being completely sarcastic.

 

I thought the fact that I was clearly upset by Posada's actions would have helped to illustrate that point. Guess not.

 

Anyway, Gaudin vs. Tallet tonight. Yankees without Damon and Posada.

[yankees228]

Apparently Posada and Carlson were only given three games on the condition that they don't appeal.

 

Source: yankees.lhblogs.com

 

Pretty light.

[RWTP24]

I was being completely sarcastic.

 

I thought the fact that I was clearly upset by Posada's actions would have helped to illustrate that point. Guess not.

 

Anyway, Gaudin vs. Tallet tonight. Yankees without Damon and Posada.

 

LOL I know you were... I was trying to play along with you. Sorry, I thought you would catch on.

[yankees228]

LOL I know you were... I was trying to play along with you. Sorry' date=' I thought you would catch on.[/quote']

 

Haha ok, my bad.

[RWTP24]

Haha ok' date=' my bad.[/quote']

 

So I was reading your sig and Gom's made it seem like a lot of Yankees fan did not like Torre. Well, hell, Gom’s think Joe Girardi is the best manager in the AL. I just do not see it, but anyways, I think Torre is the best manager in baseball, so I am glad you to see others like him as well.

[yankees228]

So I was reading your sig and Gom's made it seem like a lot of Yankees fan did not like Torre. Well' date=' hell, Gom’s think Joe Girardi is the best manager in the AL. I just do not see it, but anyways, I think Torre is the best manager in baseball, so I am glad you to see others like him as well.[/quote']

 

I lot of Yankee fans do not like Joe Torre. I also have my issues with Joe Torre, and if you went back to threads from 2007, you would probably find examples of me expressing those opinions. On top of that, there are a variety of things that I blame him for in the 2003 and 2004 postseasons that I think proved to very costly. In an attempt to clarify and/or spark conversation (I enjoyed talking about postseasons of the past, whether it involves the Yankees or not) I'll list them.

 

2003 World Series Game 4 (Extra Innings): Losing the game with Jeff Weaver on the mound when they still had Mariano Rivera available in the bullpen. Use Rivera for the two innings. Take your chances that you score while he's in the game. If you don't, then it's the underbelly of your bullpen vs. the underbelly of their bullpen. The Marlins had already used their closer (Urbina) so, even though the Yankees were on the road, you could make the case that they had the advantage with their closer still available. Instead, the Yankees lost the game without over taking advantage of that situation.

 

2004 ALCS Game 4: Starting Orlando Hernandez instead of Mike Mussina. There are a couple things to remember here. The Yankees were one win away from closing out the series. As it played out, the game four pitching matchup was Orlando Hernandez vs. Derek Lowe and the game five pitching matchup was Mike Mussina vs. Pedro Martinez. Hernandez was yet to pitch in the postseason due to a tired shoulder that he began suffering from in late September. Mussina, in two postseason starts, was throwing the ball really well. As it stood the game four matchup was pretty even (maybe a slight edge to the Sox) while the game five pitching matchup was even as well. However, when you only need one win, you have to try to create the mismatch. The Yankees got a break with game three being rained out, which meant they would have been able to bring back Mussina in regular rest for game four. Mussina vs. Lowe would have given the Yankees an advantage, and things might have played out differently.

 

2004 ALCS Game 5: The Yankees were up 4-2 heading into the bottom of the 8th inning, after Tom Gordon had gotten Manny Ramirez to hit into an inning ending double play to preserve the lead. A home run, walk, and single later, the score was 4-3 with runners on first and third and nobody out. Torre then went to Rivera, who gave up a sac fly. If he doesn't want to use Rivera for a full six outs after what happened the night before, that would be fine. However, if he was willing to, which clearly he was, he should have started the inning. Gordon had been relatively shaky so far in the postseason, Rivera would have had a better chance to get the job done.

 

2004 ALCS Game 7: This is more of a minor one. In the second inning, with the Red Sox already up 2-0, Damon came up with the bases loaded. There was a good chance the game was going to be decided right there (which it was) if Damon got a big hit. In my opinion, it should have been someone more trustworthy than Javy Vazquez. My preferences were Tanyon Sturtze or Tom Gordon. In a game seven, traditional managing techniques have to be thrown out the window. However, I understand why Torre made that move, and there is a good chance that they don't win that game anyway. Therefore, like I said, that is more of a minor one.

 

Anyway, those things, combined with what I viewed as some bad bullpen managing caused me to have some issue with the way Torre managed.

 

However, at the end of the day, the Yankees got rid of a manager who, in twelve straight seasons, made the playoffs every single year. I think that speaks for itself.

 

EDIT: RWTP, I understand you probably weren't looking for that long of a response, but there are my feelings on him.

[Cocos Disciples]

He also physically and psychologically abused Scott Proctor.

[yankees228]

He also physically and psychologically abused Scott Proctor.

 

Haha yup. Falls into my "bad bullpen management" comment.

[RWTP24]

I lot of Yankee fans do not like Joe Torre. I also have my issues with Joe Torre, and if you went back to threads from 2007, you would probably find examples of me expressing those opinions. On top of that, there are a variety of things that I blame him for in the 2003 and 2004 postseasons that I think proved to very costly. In an attempt to clarify and/or spark conversation (I enjoyed talking about postseasons of the past, whether it involves the Yankees or not) I'll list them.

 

2003 World Series Game 4 (Extra Innings): Losing the game with Jeff Weaver on the mound when they still had Mariano Rivera available in the bullpen. Use Rivera for the two innings. Take your chances that you score while he's in the game. If you don't, then it's the underbelly of your bullpen vs. the underbelly of their bullpen. The Marlins had already used their closer (Urbina) so, even though the Yankees were on the road, you could make the case that they had the advantage with their closer still available. Instead, the Yankees lost the game without over taking advantage of that situation.

 

2004 ALCS Game 4: Starting Orlando Hernandez instead of Mike Mussina. There are a couple things to remember here. The Yankees were one win away from closing out the series. As it played out, the game four pitching matchup was Orlando Hernandez vs. Derek Lowe and the game five pitching matchup was Mike Mussina vs. Pedro Martinez. Hernandez was yet to pitch in the postseason due to a tired shoulder that he began suffering from in late September. Mussina, in two postseason starts, was throwing the ball really well. As it stood the game four matchup was pretty even (maybe a slight edge to the Sox) while the game five pitching matchup was even as well. However, when you only need one win, you have to try to create the mismatch. The Yankees got a break with game three being rained out, which meant they would have been able to bring back Mussina in regular rest for game four. Mussina vs. Lowe would have given the Yankees an advantage, and things might have played out differently.

 

2004 ALCS Game 5: The Yankees were up 4-2 heading into the bottom of the 8th inning, after Tom Gordon had gotten Manny Ramirez to hit into an inning ending double play to preserve the lead. A home run, walk, and single later, the score was 4-3 with runners on first and third and nobody out. Torre then went to Rivera, who gave up a sac fly. If he doesn't want to use Rivera for a full six outs after what happened the night before, that would be fine. However, if he was willing to, which clearly he was, he should have started the inning. Gordon had been relatively shaky so far in the postseason, Rivera would have had a better chance to get the job done.

 

2004 ALCS Game 7: This is more of a minor one. In the second inning, with the Red Sox already up 2-0, Damon came up with the bases loaded. There was a good chance the game was going to be decided right there (which it was) if Damon got a big hit. In my opinion, it should have been someone more trustworthy than Javy Vazquez. My preferences were Tanyon Sturtze or Tom Gordon. In a game seven, traditional managing techniques have to be thrown out the window. However, I understand why Torre made that move, and there is a good chance that they don't win that game anyway. Therefore, like I said, that is more of a minor one.

 

Anyway, those things, combined with what I viewed as some bad bullpen managing caused me to have some issue with the way Torre managed.

 

However, at the end of the day, the Yankees got rid of a manager who, in twelve straight seasons, made the playoffs every single year. I think that speaks for itself.

 

EDIT: RWTP, I understand you probably weren't looking for that long of a response, but there are my feelings on him.

 

Holy hell, lol, that is a really damn good memory.

 

I think everyone is going to make some mistakes while coaching over a long period of time. With that said, sometimes your players have to pick you up IMO. We can always put the blame on the managers, but sometimes it needs to go on the players. But I do hear what you are saying.

[yankees228]

Holy hell, lol, that is a really damn good memory.

 

I think everyone is going to make some mistakes while coaching over a long period of time. With that said, sometimes your players have to pick you up IMO. We can always put the blame on the managers, but sometimes it needs to go on the players. But I do hear what you are saying.

 

Right, which is why, in the end, I wanted him back (and still wish he was here).

 

2003 is just frustrating because, in my opinion, they were definitely the best team in baseball. 2004 is frustrating for obvious reasons.

[RWTP24]

Right, which is why, in the end, I wanted him back (and still wish he was here).

 

2003 is just frustrating because, in my opinion, they were definitely the best team in baseball. 2004 is frustrating for obvious reasons.

 

I know how you feel, man. I feel the same way about last year with the Sox.

[yankees228]

Chad Gaudin has been in the middle of the plate all night. With the off day tomorrow, and Joba not slated to pitch till Sunday, I would expect to see the full extent of the bullpen tonight.

[yankees228]

Ugh, this is awful. They're really going to need to hit tonight.

 

EDIT: Have to admit, I was kind of hoping he would have to come out. He is really awful.

[RWTP24]

Hey, seeing that you guys all post on here.. Is there not a good Yankees message board?

[yankees228]

Hey' date=' seeing that you guys all post on here.. Is there not a good Yankees message board?[/quote']

 

I'm a member at nyyfans.com. It's a pretty decent site. However, I'm basically not allowed to be negative in the game threads and I enjoy the different perspectives here.

[RWTP24]

I'm a member at nyyfans.com. It's a pretty decent site. However' date=' I'm basically not allowed to be negative in the game threads and I enjoy the different perspectives here.[/quote']

 

Yeah this MB is really relax compared to most.

[yankees228]

So Tallet exits the game with an injury after two innings.

[yankees228]

Really nice play from Teixeira.

[RWTP24]

Teix sucks! :harhar::harhar::thumbsup:

[yankees228]

Spectacular play by Aaron Hill. I guess his days of not showing up against the Yankees are over.

[yankees228]

Pretty unlucky there.

[yankees228]

Really bad error on a very routine play by Jeter. Now they have to face Lind.

[yankees228]

Al Leiter just actually said on the Yankees broadcast that it would have been OK if Mike Piazza went out to the mound when Clemens threw the bat in his direction. I've heard some dumb things on baseball broadcasts, but that probably just topped it.

[a700hitter]

Al Leiter just actually said on the Yankees broadcast that it would have been OK if Mike Piazza went out to the mound when Clemens threw the bat in his direction. I've heard some dumb things on baseball broadcasts' date=' but that probably just topped it.[/quote']

 

Piazza should have charged Clemens. No doubt about it.

[yankees228]

Piazza should have charged Clemens. No doubt about it.

 

You can't be serious? The Mets best player? In the World Series?

[redsoxrules]

Al Leiter just actually said on the Yankees broadcast that it would have been OK if Mike Piazza went out to the mound when Clemens threw the bat in his direction. I've heard some dumb things on baseball broadcasts' date=' but that probably just topped it.[/quote']

 

I agree with him , but with that being said he shouldn't of said that

 

Piazza should of took the bat and charged the mound and whack clemens in the head

[yankees228]

I agree with him , but with that being said he shouldn't of said that

 

Piazza should of took the bat and charged the mound and whack clemens in the head

 

World Series!!!! Try to remove your hatred for Clemens from the equation. That would be one of the most selfish things I would have ever seen in a baseball game.

 

I love to debate things just as much as the next guy, but this is one that is not going anywhere. If you guys think he should have intentionally removed himself from a World Series game, and possibly from future games in the series, then I'm really at a loss for words.

[a700hitter]

You can't be serious? The Mets best player? In the World Series?

Absolutely. I know plenty of Mets fans that agree. After the psycho act that Clemens put on the Mets went down like lambs. They were totally intimidated and overmatched by Clemens that night. There was not an ounce of life on the Met bench after the incident. If Piazza and Clemens both got tossed, the Mets would have benefited from that swap on that night. Instead, Piazza's pussy routine made his team Clemen's bitches.

[yankees228]

Absolutely. I know plenty of Mets fans that agree. After the psycho act that Clemens put on the Mets went down like lambs. They were totally intimidated and overmatched by Clemens that night. There was not an ounce of life on the Met bench after the incident. If Piazza and Clemens both got tossed' date=' the Mets would have benefited from that swap on that night. Instead, Piazza's pussy routine made his team Clemen's bitches.[/quote']

 

How do you know that he would have just missed that game? It's very possible that MLB would not be more lenient simply because it's the World Series. That is a chance that Piazza has no right to take. Considering what the entire organization had at stake, it would have been an awful decision.

[yankees228]

Can't have Gaudin in the game if he is going to go exclusively with his slider.