2009 Yankees Game Thread

[jacksonianmarch]

y228, I will crunch the numbers later, but I know he has a significant difference in ERA between save and non save opps

[yankees228]

shouldnt have gone to Mo. Stupid f***ing call from our manager

 

Look, he would have done the same thing in this situation, but you were leading the charge to not bring back the manager who did NOTHING but win.

[Dipre]

y228' date=' I will crunch the numbers later, but I know he has a significant difference in ERA between save and non save opps[/quote']

 

It's not only him.

 

It happens throughout the league.

 

If you wanna have some fun, try Billy Wagner career-wise.

[jacksonianmarch]

I am not saying I dont like Girardi. He just made a stupid call, especially with CC at 100 pitches

[Dipre]

Look' date=' he would have done the same thing in this situation, but you were leading the charge to not bring back the manager who did NOTHING but win.[/quote']

 

LOL

[a700hitter]

Big mistake not sticking with CC for the 9th. His pitch count was fine and he was very strong. It was nice to see Mo get manhandled. You would never have seen that a couple of years back. It was refreshing to see. The TB pen sucks big time. They need 3 more outs, and they will have a tough time getting them. They'll need an at'em ball or two.

[a700hitter]

Instead the Rays are giving the Yanks additional outs. That's not a good thing.

[yankees228]

y228' date=' I will crunch the numbers later, but I know he has a significant difference in ERA between save and non save opps[/quote']

 

Well, lets talk about this year.

 

Mariano Rivera in non-save situations:

 

April 9th @ BAL: Scoreless inning

April 19th vs. CLE: Scoreless inning

April 22nd vs. OAK: Scoreless inning

April 29th @ DET: One run in a 1/3 of an inning

May 6th vs. TB: Scoreless inning

May 7th vs. TB: Two runs in a 2/3 of an inning

May 16th vs. MIN: Two scoreless inning

May 17th vs. MIN: One scoreless inning

May 24th vs. PHI: One scoreless inning

Today: Awful

 

However, this year he has pitched ten times in non-save situations. In seven of those he was excellent, once going two innings. One of them, he gave up a run, but finished the game. In two of them he was bad. Doesn't seem awful to me.

 

Now, even if the numbers were more skewed then they are, if you can't give me a substantial reason why Rivera would be worse in non-save situations, then I can't buy into it.

[a700hitter]

The way Tex is swinging I get the feeling that Wheeler should stop wasting everyone's time and turn around and throw the ball into the stands.

[yankees228]

That error is going to be a killer.

[a700hitter]

Wheeler was part of the game 5 ALCS fiasco last year.

[a700hitter]

Look closely at Wheeler. I think he has a poopie in his pants.

[yankees228]

Plenty of pitches to hit that AB for A-Rod, but Wheeler did make a good pitch to get him out.

[a700hitter]

ARod didn't want to spoil the effect of his error by getting a hit.

[yankees228]

Ugh, got a pitch to hit on 3-2.

[a700hitter]

Thuuuuh Yankeeees Loooose!!!!

Thuuuuh Yankeeees Loooose!!!!

[yankees228]

This loss is right up there with Sunday game vs. PHI, and the first BOS game.

[a700hitter]

What a shame.

[a700hitter]

Hang this one around Girardi's neck for pulling CC and give a huge assist to ARod for his error in the 9th. Without that error, they play to push Tex to 3rd and Sac Fly him in.

[yankees228]

Hang this one around Girardi's neck for pulling CC and give a huge assist to ARod for his error in the 9th. Without that error' date=' they play to push Tex to 3rd and Sac Fly him in.[/quote']

 

Both of those things were contributing factors, but, because of who he is, this loss is on Sabathia. He is supposed to be the ace, twice the offensive gave him leads, and twice he coughed it up. The Yankees scored seven runs today, and I know he was only responsible for five of the runs, but this game never should have come down to the ninth inning. Facing an injured Rays lineup, Sabathia needs to do better.

 

Don't get me wrong, I really like him, and I'm glad the Yankees got him. However, him and Mo are responsible.

 

You cannot blame Girardi for using his best reliever. Hold the players accountable.

[a700hitter]

Both of those things were contributing factors, but, because of who he is, this loss is on Sabathia. He is supposed to be the ace, twice the offensive gave him leads, and twice he coughed it up. The Yankees scored seven runs today, and I know he was only responsible for five of the runs, but this game never should have come down to the ninth inning. Facing an injured Rays lineup, Sabathia needs to do better.

 

Don't get me wrong, I really like him, and I'm glad the Yankees got him. However, him and Mo are responsible.

 

You cannot blame Girardi for using his best reliever. Hold the players accountable.

I didn't say that Sabbathia had a good game, but Girardi made moves that lost his team the game. With the weak yankee pen, he never should have gone to Mo in the 9th. CC's PC was low and he was still very strong. What if the game went extra frames? It was a bad move and it cost his team the game.

 

And I am holding the players responsible. ARod gets a huge assist for his error.

[yankees228]

Back to the Rivera argument, in all of 2007, he was only bad four times in non-save situations, and in only two of those situations did he cost them the game.

 

He was bad in 2008, but that was only one year. He has been pretty good this year in non-save situations, and he was really good in 2007. These are not sufficient reasons to hold him out of the game in non-save situations.

[yankees228]

I didn't say that Sabbathia had a good game, but Girardi made moves that lost his team the game. With the weak yankee pen, he never should have gone to Mo in the 9th. CC's PC was low and he was still very strong. What if the game went extra frames? It was a bad move and it cost his team the game.

 

And I am holding the players responsible. ARod gets a huge assist for his error.

 

Yeah, I said earlier that he made the wrong because of extra innings, but that ended up not mattering. He made the wrong move, but the reason why it was wrong is not what cost them. You have to see the difference there.

[yankees228]

And you say you're holding the player's accountable, however you don't mention Rivera once? He is one of the biggest, if not the biggest reason why they lost.

[a700hitter]

Back to the Rivera argument, in all of 2007, he was only bad four times in non-save situations, and in only two of those situations did he cost them the game.

 

He was bad in 2008, but that was only one year. He has been pretty good this year in non-save situations, and he was really good in 2007. These are not sufficient reasons to hold him out of the game in non-save situations.

The reason to hold him out of today's game had nothing to do with his performance in non-save situations. The reason today was that the team ace still had about 30 bullets in his gun and he was strong (hit 97 in the8th). He was throwing very well. There was no reason to go to Mo unless the game went to extra innings. If Mo had pitched a scoreless 9th and the Yankees didn't score in the 9th, Genius Girardi would have had to whip Mo for a second inning or go to the pen of horrors. Sorry, this was a bad move. Maybe Sabbathia can shoot his last 30 bullets in the clubhouse.

[a700hitter]

Yeah' date=' I said earlier that he made the wrong because of extra innings, but that ended up not mattering. He made the wrong move, but the reason why it was wrong is not what cost them. You have to see the difference there.[/quote']A good manager has to look ahead a couple of moves.

[a700hitter]

And you say you're holding the player's accountable' date=' however you don't mention Rivera once? He is one of the biggest, if not the biggest reason why they lost.[/quote']After what he has done for your team in his career, I should beat on him for one bad outing? It's not like he sucks. He's just getting old and he's not what he used to be. Thank goodness. He obviously had a bad game. That goes without saying. In an earlier post, I said it was nice to see him get manhandled. I even called it refreshing. How much more critical do you want me to be?

[yankees228]

The reason to hold him out of today's game had nothing to do with his performance in non-save situations. The reason today was that the team ace still had about 30 bullets in his gun and he was strong (hit 97 in the8th). He was throwing very well. There was no reason to go to Mo unless the game went to extra innings. If Mo had pitched a scoreless 9th and the Yankees didn't score in the 9th' date=' Genius Girardi would have had to whip Mo for a second inning or go to the pen of horrors. Sorry, this was a bad move. Maybe Sabbathia can shoot his last 30 bullets in the clubhouse.[/quote']

 

I was talking about his success in non-save situations in response to posts made by Jackson and DipreG.

 

Once again, I agree with you that Girardi made the wrong move, but you can't blame Girardi for losing the game. You can only blame him if the move backfires for the reasons that the move was wrong. Rivera, pitching, is not the reason why the move was wrong, and that is why you can't blame Girardi.

 

However, lets say the game is still tied after Rivera comes out, and in the next inning the Rays score off of another Yankee reliever, then you can blame Girardi. This is because he should have held Rivera off. Again, it was the wrong move, but Rivera giving up runs in his first inning of work is not Girardi's fault.

[yankees228]

After what he has done for your team in his career' date=' I should beat on him for one bad outing? It's not like he sucks. He's just getting old and he's not what he used to be. Thank goodness. He obviously had a bad game. That goes without saying. In an earlier post, I said it was nice to see him get manhandled. I even called it refreshing. How much more critical do you want me to be?[/quote']

 

You were talking about who is at fault for losing the game. Believe me, there are few people who appreciate more what Rivera did for the Yankees. When he gets inducted into the HOF, I'll be in the crowd. However, his past successes have nothing to do with today. You came into a tie game today, in the ninth inning, and gave up three earned runs.

 

When you posted about who deserves blame for this game, you did not mention Mariano Rivera.

 

If I was to defend Rivera for losing today's game with his past successes, that would be like me defending the Yankees' postseason failures by talking about their 26 championships.

[a700hitter]

You were talking about who is at fault for losing the game. Believe me, there are few people who appreciate more what Rivera did for the Yankees. When he gets inducted into the HOF, I'll be in the crowd. However, his past successes have nothing to do with today. You came into a tie game today, in the ninth inning, and gave up three earned runs.

 

When you posted about who deserves blame for this game, you did not mention Mariano Rivera.

 

If I was to defend Rivera for losing today's game with his past successes, that would be like me defending the Yankees' postseason failures by talking about their 26 championships.

Not mentioning they guy who gave up 4 runs in an inning is not an absolution. He obviously lost the game. He's the one with an L next to his name. A soccer fan that never watched baseball would have observed that. There's no point in discussing the obvious. I was pointing out things that will not show up in the boxscore. The reasons why Girardi's move was stupid will not translate from a boxscore and neither will the significance of ARod's error.