lugo needs to be dropped

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

So we should move a potential future #1 or #2 starter (and the current youngest player in AA, I believe) and a very solid offensive shortstop just so you don't have to see Lugo's face? So basically, we're looking at a knee jerk reaction trade to get a guy who is equally questionable on defense, gets on-base less, but slugs a little better and in the process export some of our most promising prospects.

 

Brilliant! (for Texas)

 

Michael Young is an excellent player and...like I said...if Michael Bowden and Jed Lowrie are too much...then thats not the trade. If it takes less then that and its lesser prospects that will never see the field for us....then you do it. You make it sound like Julio Lugo is almost as good as Michael Young.

[ksushi]

Well, tell me what is so much better about Michael Young. Michael Young is a defensive liability as a shortstop, and so far this season he isn't getting on-base as often as Lugo. He doesn't have the power numbers to be considered enough of an upgrade to justify eating Lugo's contract. There is nothing exceptional about 2008 Michael Young and there certainly is nothing about the idea of 2009 and 2010 Michael Young that has me salivating either.

 

The guy is decent. Lugo is a smidge beneath decent. Right now, we need upgrade short, I agree, but I think that answer is in-house. We just need to have the balls to start playing Lugo off the bench.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

Well' date=' tell me what is so much better about Michael Young.[/quote']

 

Julio Lugo OPS = .679

Michael Young OPS = .763

 

Young is also batting 30 points higher than Lugo. Not sure if one of our in-depth stat guys wants to look at it but I'll guess Young is superior to Lugo.

[CrespoBlows]

I never claimed Colon could bring in a guy like Reyes on his own. He could certainly add to good package. If you don't think there is any value in a guy like Colon to a team attempting make the playoffs then you' date=' sir, are insane.[/quote']

 

He's a major injury risk, and doesn't feature much else besides his fastball. I think he's a great pitcher out of the bullpen, but teams aren't going to give much up for him.

 

And I bet a great deal of people around baseball thought that there was no way Theo would move Nomar for Cabrera and a back up first basemen, but he did and it was the move of the century.

 

Nomar was really bad defensive SS in 2004, and 99.9% of great baseball men had no idea that Nomar told Theo that his achilles was not going to hold up in August.

 

From Theo Epstein:

8.2.04: Red Sox GM Theo Epstein on WEEI with Dennis & Callahan: "The way we were thinking about Nomar is, well, what do we have the next two months? We reached the conclusion, given what we know from prior negotiations that we weren’t going to sign him, that it had stopped being a consideration, we were looking forward to the next two months and said ‘well, what do we have here?’ We have a situation where we’re likely to have Nomar Garciaparra and Ricky Gutierrez playing short and we don’t think that’s going to be enough, we haven’t been playing well, and Nomar’s likely to play less over the next month than he’s played the last month, so what are we trading here? "In the end it was a straight baseball decision given the rather difficult situation we were in. (John Dennis: Theo, would you have been less likely to make that trade had Nomar told the trainers last Thursday, and by extension you and the rest of the organization that ‘the Achilles is fine, I’m 100%, I don’t think I’ll be taking any days off between now and the end of the baseball season?) Oh absolutely, that was the major impetus for the trade. It made a trade necessary, and difficult. We had to look at it from two standpoints. One, what if we don’t do anything? If we don’t do anything, then it’s Nomar, who says it’s really hurting, says he’s going to need significant time off, perhaps the DL in August, in order to finish the year healthy, so then it’s a significant amount of Ricky Gutierrez at short, and Nomar playing when he can. Or, if we do move him, now all of a sudden we have to tell the team that we’re talking to that this player is telling us that he feels like it’s going to blow out if it keeps playing the field. So, instead of being able to negotiate, we have to keep them that ‘make sure you know what you’re getting here, make sure you know this player’s going on the DL, because the only way we can make a trade with a player who is saying things to us that he was saying, was if we went out of our way to make sure the other team went in with eyes wide open. So not only did the health situation as reported by Nomar to us make it, in our mind, necessary to make a trade, but it made it much more difficult for obvious reasons... if that’s the case (that the Cubs were told that Nomar really wasn’t about to head on the DL) and that’s really what they believe, that’s odd, but, I won’t make any accusations of course, but perhaps they’re in a better position to take that gamble, with their depth in the middle infield, perhaps they can make the gamble a little bit more, I don’t know.

 

"We do shoulder some blame in what basically became a doomed marriage, but I don't think he handled it very well this year, he wasn't quite the same guy in the clubhouse, he wasn't really a positive force in there. (Gerry: Do you think his unhappiness, his state of mind affected the team?) Umm, Yes... Was it different this year and did his teammates notice that? Yeah, that's probably the reality of this year."

 

"Let's be honest, there are two months to go, and we're in an absolute dogfight for the wildcard. We're in an absolute dogfight just to get into the post-season... it's going to be an absolute dogfight and this is a year in which just about everything has gone wrong, and we need every single person associated with the organization needs to fight and scrap and find a way to have a really good two months, and not just 30 wins the rest of the way, 'cause that's not going to get it done, but to have a really good two months and salvage this season, and get into the post-season. And once the post-season starts, I really like this team, but we gotta scrap and fight and find a way to get in. That's a large part of what this trade was about, because the safe thing to do, for a lot of people, and the safe thing for the organization, was to probably not make a trade here and just say 'oh well, we're not sure how much we're gonna have Nomar but this team looks good on paper, let's just see how things go the rest of the way,' you know that would have been the safe thing for my career too, but I don't think we could have lived with that, because if we don't do anything and then Nomar goes on the DL and it's 30 games with Nomar the rest of the way, and 30 of Ricky Gutierrez, and we don't get in... I couldn't have lived with that. So instead, we do something that's not ideal (couldn't get the pitching he wanted), but I think we do something that we felt, gives us a better chance to salvage this season in a year where just about everything has gone wrong, including Nomar being largely unavailable the rest of the way."

 

Besides, what the f*** does this have to do with anything? Increase the awareness that a deal like that happens .0001% of the time?

 

If I were Omar I would jump at that deal. Say what you want about Bedard, but hes a crafty pitcher and one of the smartests hurlers in the league. His injury history is a little off-putting, sure but if I were the Mets, a gamble on a top-flight starter is a gamble I'd be willing to take.

 

If you're talking about the Erik Bedard who was Cy Young award material in 2007, you'd have a point, but Bedard's value is way down. He's not even healthy right now.

 

 

Betancourt is an outstanding defender that could play short for my team any time.

 

According to FRAA, and defensive win shares, Jose Reyes is considered the better defensive player over the last year and a half.

 

2007 + 2008 WS

 

Reyes - 7.8

Betancourt - 7.3

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=winshares&linesToDisplay=50&orderBy=field&direction=DESC&season_filter%5B%5D=2008&league_filter%5B%5D=All&team_filter%5B%5D=All&pos_filter%5B%5D=SS&Submit=Submit

 

 

If you look at FRAA, the margin gets even wider.

 

2007-2008 FRAA

 

Betancourt - -20

Reyes - +12

 

I haven't even mentioned that Betancourt has a .280 OBP this year.

 

As I said before, if you think Omar is heavily invested in the Mets future, you're dead wrong. He is invested in keeping his job and that means making the playoffs this year.

 

Making a trade that makes the Mets worse, will help them this year?

 

I think they are more likely to be in the playoffs if they add more defense (Reed and Betencourt) and shore up the rotation.

 

Where does Reed play?

 

Beltran is firmly entrenched in CF, and Reed doesn't have the bat for a corner. In fact, his career OPS .688.

 

This is a substantial downgrade offensively, and at best a wash defensively. They upgrade the rotation, but it isn't enough to justify trading Reyes away.

 

And as for Reyes being a "top three" shortstop, I don't know if that is so clear cut.

 

2008 WS - 12 (3rd)

2007 WS - 24 (5th)

2006 WS - 29 (2nd)

 

He is a poor defender at a demanding defensive position.

 

Wrong.

 

For my money I would prefer Hardy, Ramirez, Tulo, Jeter, Theriot. For the long haul, I would prefer Drew as well.

 

Jeter, Hardy, Theriot, and Stephen Drew?

 

lol

[schillingouttheks]

Julio Lugo OPS = .679

Michael Young OPS = .763

 

Young is also batting 30 points higher than Lugo. Not sure if one of our in-depth stat guys wants to look at it but I'll guess Young is superior to Lugo.

 

I don't think he's arguing that Young is superior, I think he's arguing that he's not so much better that a trade is necessary to fix it.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I don't think he's arguing that Young is superior' date=' I think he's arguing that he's not so much better that a trade is necessary to fix it.[/quote']

 

Michael Young has the best OPS for starting SS in the AL....thats not a big enough upgrade to warrant consideration?? It's a higher OPS than Peralta and Jeter and I can promise Michael Young will be up near the top by the end of the season.....he usually is

[ksushi]

He's a major injury risk' date=' and doesn't feature much else besides his fastball. I think he's a great pitcher out of the bullpen, but teams aren't going to give much up for him.[/quote']

 

Again, I never said Colon for Reyes or anything of the sort. I do think he would be a good piece in a trade. The word piece in that sentence alludes to more than one player being involved in the deal. I think Colon could act as a good kicker in a deal to an NL team that is in the hunt. You're being a little obtuse on this one. I don't get it.

 

 

 

Nomar was really bad defensive SS in 2004, and 99.9% of great baseball men had no idea that Nomar told Theo that his achilles was not going to hold up in August.

 

 

Besides, what the f*** does this have to do with anything? Increase the awareness that a deal like that happens .0001% of the time?

 

My point in bringing up the Nomar trade was to point out the value of defense up the middle. Thats all.

 

 

If you're talking about the Erik Bedard who was Cy Young award material in 2007, you'd have a point, but Bedard's value is way down. He's not even healthy right now.

 

He was healthy enough to go 5 innings and give up 1 earnie on the 4th. :dunno:

 

 

 

 

According to FRAA, and defensive win shares, Jose Reyes is considered the better defensive player over the last year and a half.

 

2007 + 2008 WS

 

Reyes - 7.8

Betancourt - 7.3

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/thtstats/main/index.php?view=winshares&linesToDisplay=50&orderBy=field&direction=DESC&season_filter%5B%5D=2008&league_filter%5B%5D=All&team_filter%5B%5D=All&pos_filter%5B%5D=SS&Submit=Submit

 

 

If you look at FRAA, the margin gets even wider.

 

2007-2008 FRAA

 

Betancourt - -20

Reyes - +12

 

I haven't even mentioned that Betancourt has a .280 OBP this year.

 

 

I'm not really familiar with defensive stats. Thats surprising if that is true, because I've always heard only good things about betancourts defense, including my friends dad who spent a lot of time in baseball scouting comparing his hands to vizquel. I'm not sure how much defensive metrics actually reveal about a player.

 

Making a trade that makes the Mets worse, will help them this year?

 

Why I am even bothering to put tags around this. You're purposely annoying. It works.

 

Where does Reed play?

 

Beltran is firmly entrenched in CF, and Reed doesn't have the bat for a corner. In fact, his career OPS .688.

 

This is a substantial downgrade offensively, and at best a wash defensively. They upgrade the rotation, but it isn't enough to justify trading Reyes away.

 

Yeah, for some reason I thought the Mets were lacking in OF depth. I disagree with the point about him not having the bat for the corner. I'm not going to argue for Reeds bat, but I haven't really decided whether I think defensive position should demand a certain offensive output. Reed wouldn't really be a good fit, and Betancourt is miserable at the plate, I knew that going in. I think if they were going to make a deal, Bedard would have to be a centerpiece and Betancourt would most likely factor in somewhere. Reed doesn't seem to fit. This is all meaningless speculation, though. I don't think any of this is going to happen to begin with, but I think its a little more plausible than you're giving it credit for.

 

 

2008 WS - 12 (3rd)

2007 WS - 24 (5th)

2006 WS - 29 (2nd)

 

 

 

Wrong.

 

 

 

Jeter, Hardy, Theriot, and Stephen Drew?

 

lol

 

I'd love to give you an annoying one or two word answer right back to some of this, but I actually think I'm kind of in the mood to talk about baseball. I mean, c'mon dude, this is a baseball forum if you want to just "LOL" at people and what not, go find a chatroom or something.

 

Besides, I don't know how you LOL@ JJ Hardy. I'd like to hear that. Honestly, I might think he is a better player than he is, but he hits for decent average and power and plays his position well. He gets on base well. Very good shortstop and I would prefer him to Reyes. Theriot is having a spectacular year, also. He has no where near the track record of Reyes or the pedigree, but he is definitely doing great this year and if you think Omar wouldn't magically swap them over night you're nuts. Though, I'm not about to be that yahoo that says he should go out and deal for the guy. In the long run, the mets might not be so bad with Reyes, but I think he is in his own head a little bit right now and he is definitely struggling with that. He's not in the game, and I think this is a big year for the Mets, they blew it last year and after going out and bringing in Santana this is a definite go year for that. They need to do stuff, and if I were them, moving Reyes would be a good start. He would command a lot of talent in return, and it would really say something to the rest of the team about the FO's intentions for this year. They want to win.

[ksushi]

Michael Young has the best OPS for starting SS in the AL....thats not a big enough upgrade to warrant consideration?? It's a higher OPS than Peralta and Jeter and I can promise Michael Young will be up near the top by the end of the season.....he usually is

 

you're missing the point. he can't play his position. we're not looking for extra-base power out of the SS spot. If we were don't you think Lowrie would be up right now? .805 OPS in AAA right now. He would be a good option. I'm not about to argue for Lugo, but how are we going to trade for Michael Young? It will hurt our defense up the middle and only be a marginal offensive improvement. You're talking about trading our top two prospects away for that? That seems like a bad idea to me.

[Jayhawk Bill]

I'm not really familiar with defensive stats. Thats surprising if that is true' date=' because I've always heard only good things about betancourts defense, including my friends dad who spent a lot of time in baseball scouting comparing his hands to vizquel. I'm not sure how much defensive metrics actually reveal about a player.[/quote']

 

Defensive metrics are very good, if you understand what they're measuring, and if you discount errors and fielding percentage as obsolete for most purposes. The exception is Win Shares, which is new but still sucks regarding defense.

 

FRAA measures counting stats, including assists, errors, putouts and double plays. If one counts those stats, and if one makes adjustments designed to account for how many chances each player should get, Betancourt suddenly doesn't look so good.

 

Let's double check. How about RZR?

 

Suddenly Reyes (.815) and Betancourt (.812) are virtually in a tie.

 

Whazzup? :dunno:

 

Two factors: first, Reyes is getting a few more balls out of zone; second, more balls are coming Reyes's way than might be expected, increasing his total chances, a factor that influences FRAA.

 

FRAA is usually better at capturing aggregate defensive value--this is an unusual aberration. Still, Betancourt and Reyes are similar in 2008 defensive value, not 12 runs apart.

 

IMO. YMMV.

[CrespoBlows]

If Michael Bowden and Jed Lowrie are too much for Michael Young then we should be all over Texas.

 

Jacoby Ellsbury

Dustin Pedroia

David Ortiz

Manny Ramirez

Mike Lowell

JD Drew

Kevin Youkilis

Michael Young

Jason Varitek

 

.....big upgrade over Julio Lugo and Jason Varitek can sit in the 9 hole now.

 

You called Michael Bowden a "future ace" in the Bowden thread. Now, you want to trade him for a 31 year old shortstop whose numbers are slipping?

 

No thanks, I'd keep the guy who'd probably OPS the same that Young could, and for about $11 million less.

[CrespoBlows]

Again' date=' I never said Colon for Reyes or anything of the sort. I do think he would be a good piece in a trade. The word piece in that sentence alludes to more than one player being involved in the deal. I think Colon could act as a good kicker in a deal to an NL team that is in the hunt. You're being a little obtuse on this one. I don't get it.[/quote']

 

Oh, I guess you're too stupid to figure out what I'm trying to say.

 

I never accused you of placing him in the centerpiece of a deal, I just don't think he's going to have a lot of value.

 

 

My point in bringing up the Nomar trade was to point out the value of defense up the middle. Thats all.

 

The Mets should downgrade defensively at SS to enhance the value of defense up the middle?

 

 

He was healthy enough to go 5 innings and give up 1 earnie on the 4th. :dunno:

 

July 6th

Manager Jim Riggleman has pushed back Erik Bedard's next scheduled start.

 

Bedard apparently complained of shoulder tightness after his start Friday. There's no timetable on when he'll pitch next or whether he'll avoid the disabled list.

 

July 6th

Manager Jim Riggleman questioned the health of Erik Bedard on Saturday.

Bedard hasn't eclipsed the 100-pitch mark since May 28 and has experienced back spasms multiple times this year. "I don't think he's really totally feeling right," said Riggleman. "With whatever was happening before -- hip, back and all that ... He may be pitching a lot more than he should. I don't think he's totally right yet. I might be wrong about that, but I do feel that he's given us everything he could give us." He should be able to make his scheduled start this week in Oakland, but don't be surprised if there are more issues in the second half of the season.

 

June 24th

The Seattle Times suggests that Erik Bedard could need a second stint on the disabled list due to his sore back.

 

Manager Jim Riggleman says the team isn't "thinking that way yet," but pitching coach Mel Stottlemyre says the team doesn't have Bedard penciled in for the Mariners' weekend series in San Diego.

 

The Mariners confirmed that Erik Bedard won't make his start Wednesday because of back spasms.

 

There was no indication of a setback for Bedard. Perhaps the Mariners just don't want to risk ruining his trade value by sending him to the mound when he's less than 100 percent. He's not the type to fight to be out there anyway. Miguel Batista will start Wednesday.

 

http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_previousnews.aspx?sport=MLB&id=3449

 

 

 

I'm not really familiar with defensive stats. Thats surprising if that is true, because I've always heard only good things about betancourts defense, including my friends dad who spent a lot of time in baseball scouting comparing his hands to vizquel. I'm not sure how much defensive metrics actually reveal about a player.

 

Oh, your friend's dad said it? Awesome.

 

 

 

I'd love to give you an annoying one or two word answer right back to some of this, but I actually think I'm kind of in the mood to talk about baseball. I mean, c'mon dude, this is a baseball forum if you want to just "LOL" at people and what not, go find a chatroom or something.

 

OK, you're right.

 

Besides, I don't know how you LOL@ JJ Hardy. I'd like to hear that. Honestly, I might think he is a better player than he is, but he hits for decent average and power and plays his position well. He gets on base well. Very good shortstop and I would prefer him to Reyes.

 

lol

 

Theriot is having a spectacular year, also. He has no where near the track record of Reyes or the pedigree, but he is definitely doing great this year and if you think Omar wouldn't magically swap them over night you're nuts.

 

lol

 

Though, I'm not about to be that yahoo that says he should go out and deal for the guy. In the long run, the mets might not be so bad with Reyes, but I think he is in his own head a little bit right now and he is definitely struggling with that. He's not in the game, and I think this is a big year for the Mets, they blew it last year and after going out and bringing in Santana this is a definite go year for that. They need to do stuff, and if I were them, moving Reyes would be a good start. He would command a lot of talent in return, and it would really say something to the rest of the team about the FO's intentions for this year. They want to win.

 

lol

[ksushi]

Oh, I guess you're too stupid to figure out what I'm trying to say.

 

I never accused you of placing him in the centerpiece of a deal, I just don't think he's going to have a lot of value.

 

Right, lets just not bother with that, cool, champ? I think Colon has some value, you disagree. Fine by me.

 

 

The Mets should downgrade defensively at SS to enhance the value of defense up the middle?

 

 

 

 

Again, here we are with you trolling in an attempt to get someone to jump out of their shoes and make a fool out of themselves. Is this your normal routine here? I haven't really read much from you, but so far in our limited interaction, you've just been kind of a pest. Way to go. You're purposely ignoring what I'm saying to try to piss me off. I happen to be having a great day, so its not working today. I guess I over estimated Betancourts defense. Your post made me realize that. This is something I acknowledge in my previous post but you continue to be a punk and try to bait me. I really hope this isn't your usual thing, because its border line trolling.

 

 

 

Oh, your friend's dad said it? Awesome.

 

My larger point in telling about my friends dad was to express that my knowledge of Betancourts defense was largely anecdotal. But again, I try to put something out there, and you twist it to try to make fun of me. Listen, dude, this is getting pretty old.

 

 

While the LOL stunt was cute and everything and I appreciate that you're really good at being kind of a douche (I'm not trying to call you a douche, it is a skill and it comes in handy) can you not be so overt about it and ruin a decent discussion? Hm?

 

So since we can't really talk about baseball, if you're next post is just more ******** trying to troll I'll remove it from the thread and lock this baby down. There is another Lugo thread with actual valid discussion that you haven't shown up in yet that kind of makes this one seem a little silly anyway.

[CrespoBlows]

 

 

Again, here we are with you trolling in an attempt to get someone to jump out of their shoes and make a fool out of themselves. Is this your normal routine here? I haven't really read much from you, but so far in our limited interaction, you've just been kind of a pest. Way to go. You're purposely ignoring what I'm saying to try to piss me off. I happen to be having a great day, so its not working today. I guess I over estimated Betancourts defense. Your post made me realize that. This is something I acknowledge in my previous post but you continue to be a punk and try to bait me. I really hope this isn't your usual thing, because its border line trolling.

 

Really?

 

I really hope this isn't your usual thing, because its border line trolling.

 

I guess I over estimated Betancourts defense. Your post made me realize that.

 

Which one is it?

 

My larger point in telling about my friends dad was to express that my knowledge of Betancourts defense was largely anecdotal. But again, I try to put something out there, and you twist it to try to make fun of me. Listen, dude, this is getting pretty old.

 

You're pretty slow, so I'll have to help you.

 

I don't know your friend's dad. I'm sure no one here knows your friend's dad. I'm also certain that if you were to ask around MLB, no one would know who he is.

 

To summarize, why would I seriously consider the opinion of your friend's dad as valid?

 

Show me something we can use.

 

While the LOL stunt was cute and everything and I appreciate that you're really good at being kind of a douche (I'm not trying to call you a douche, it is a skill and it comes in handy) can you not be so overt about it and ruin a decent discussion? Hm?

 

So since we can't really talk about baseball, if you're next post is just more ******** trying to troll I'll remove it from the thread and lock this baby down. There is another Lugo thread with actual valid discussion that you haven't shown up in yet that kind of makes this one seem a little silly anyway.

 

You advocated the following over Jose Reyes:

 

J.J. Hardy (career .324 OBP)

Derek Jeter (34 years old, and the worst defensive SS in the AL)

Stephen Drew (sub .300 OBP in 2008)

Ryan Theriot (lol, and you thought Minaya would trade him straight up)

 

This is laughable. Sorry, I will not take opinions of people who advocate this seriously.

 

Go ahead, delete this. I love it how you can dish it out, but you can't take s***.

 

s***, did you forget your emotional "BASH KSUSHI THREAD" after several members of the board called you out on your irrational behavior?

 

Looks like we're heading down this road again.

 

lol

[paranoia]

after you cut through all the stats and just BS what it boils down to is lugo sucks and is a liability to this team period bottom line. Bring up Jed and take your chances.

[TheKilo]

after you cut through all the stats and just BS what it boils down to is lugo sucks and is a liability to this team period bottom line. Bring up Jed and take your chances.

 

Insightful.

[ksushi]

Really?

 

yup.

 

 

 

Which one is it?

 

It doesn't have to be one or the other but thank you for pulling bits and pieces out of my post just to be your annoying self.

 

 

 

You're pretty slow, so I'll have to help you.

 

I don't know your friend's dad. I'm sure no one here knows your friend's dad. I'm also certain that if you were to ask around MLB, no one would know who he is.

 

To summarize, why would I seriously consider the opinion of your friend's dad as valid?

 

Show me something we can use.

 

I don't really care. You know, all I was trying to say was "I heard this, and you showed me something that made me re-think that" If you're really being this difficult about it, something makes me think you're intentionally trying to piss me off. That's fine, but it's also trolling so this thread will be lock. If you still wanna talk about this further, feel free to PM me, but there is no reason for your ******** to be polluting this thread and forum any more.

 

 

 

You advocated the following over Jose Reyes:

 

J.J. Hardy (career .324 OBP)

Derek Jeter (34 years old, and the worst defensive SS in the AL)

Stephen Drew (sub .300 OBP in 2008)

Ryan Theriot (lol, and you thought Minaya would trade him straight up)

 

Yeah, I'll take Hardy and his career .330 OBP over Reyes and his career mark of .334. Sorry that that .004 points of difference doesn't do anything for me. When did I say anything about Omar trading for Minaya straight up. Man, you really are pitiful person.

 

This is laughable. Sorry, I will not take opinions of people who advocate this seriously.

 

Go ahead, delete this. I love it how you can dish it out, but you can't take s***.

 

s***, did you forget your emotional "BASH KSUSHI THREAD" after several members of the board called you out on your irrational behavior?

 

Looks like we're heading down this road again.

 

lol

 

Irrational behavior. Ok. Well, that is fine. Make another thread and if you want to talk about my irrational behavior in fights and crap I would be happy to do that. If you can rally some support from those various members and you guys wanna have a talk about it, we can absolutely do that. Masking a personal discussion as a baseball thing and then ambushing someone like this is trolling. This isn't the place for it. The only person who really seems to want to head down that road is you. There really is no reason for this thread to remain open.

 

Save your pathetic personal internet vendettas for another website. I'm not interested in it. I don't think anybody is but you. Take your self-indulgent flippant ******** somewhere else.

[yeszir]

Any post not related to Julio Lugo following this one will be deleted by me. Aaaand go.

[a700hitter]

You guys have become terribly spoiled. As far as I am concerned, none of our guys from the 2004 and 2007 teams suck. It's hard to say that a starting SS on a World Series Champion sucks. Are there better options? Yes, but there are better options at just about every position. Lugo has plus range, a strong arm and good speed on the bases. He steals a lot of bases. On most of the teams I have watched throughout the years, he would be considered to be our speed threat, but he plays with Crisp and Ellsbury who are even faster. He has been a disappointment offensively, but he does have a higher OBP than Jeter at the halfway mark. Is he the biggest problem on the Red Sox? No. I think we need the starters to go deeper into games to cover up for a deficient bullpen. We need Ortiz' big stick back in the line up and we need to move Ellsbury down in the order and put Youk in the two-hole to set the table with Pedroia if Ellsbury continues in his funk.

[Mr Crunchy]

lugo's struggles are compounded by others who are struggling

his defensive issues are confusing but his offense isnt shocking

his obp is .350? and he runs the bases very well,he has no pop,none

i expected more.

has ellsbury had an xtra base hit in the last 40 games?

manny was hitting .180 over his last 25? i think

crisp isnt tearing the cover off the ball

teks troubles have been well documented

drew has cooled off since carrying us for 5 weeks

as the guy above said,we can upgrade in a ton of areas but as a team we're fine and built for the long run...i see the yankees are persuing victor zambrano,that should cure all their problems eh??

 

Yankees scouting Zambrano

Posted: Tuesday July 08, 2008 06:31AM ET

Scott Kazmir is pitching at Yankee Stadium Tuesday night. Can Victor Zambrano be far behind? In their never-ending quest to find starting pitching, the Yankees plan to send a scout to watch the free-agent righty throw sometime this week, according to a source. Zambrano is infamous for being the pitcher the Mets got when they shipped highly touted prospect Kazmir to Tampa at the trading deadline in 2004. Zambrano, who went 10-14 over three seasons with the Mets, pitched for Toronto and Baltimore last season, but hasn't pitched in the majors this year. After being designated for assignment by Colorado at the end of spring training, Zambrano went 0-6 with a 9.45 ERA for the Rockies' Triple-A club

 

oh f*** not this guy....bwahahahaha

[YAZMAN]

oh f*** not this guy....bwahahahaha

 

I think Jacko threw in a JV game at UMASS-Lowell.

 

He can't be too far down the depth chart now.