Terry Francona wins Manager of the Year

[TheKilo]

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/majors/features/265293.html

 

"It's a well-deserved honor. He's been fantastic for us ever since he got the job in 2004," Boston general manager Theo Epstein said. "Sometimes he doesn't get recognized for that because we have a highly competitive club year after year. Oftentimes, on clubs like that, managers tend to get overlooked. But he certainly helps to promote that kind of club every year."

 

"I've always been an early arrival guy, but it's real early here. That's by choice," Francona said. "When the players start coming in, I don't want to be sitting at my desk, looking over matchups or crunching numbers. Once the players come in, I want to be available, even if it's to play a game of cribbage with (Dustin) Pedroia."

 

"Everybody (in New England) wants him to manage every game of the season like it's a playoff game, and he understands he can't," observed Sox righthander Curt Schilling, who also played for Francona with the Phillies. "He understands his players, he understands his people and he understands the long-term implications of all of that. He never wavers."

[Jayhawk Bill]

From the linked article:

 

Francona has embraced his organization's efforts to assume an increasingly homegrown shape. He has not fled from young players—most notably Pedroia, who hit .182 in April and went on to win the 2007 Rookie of the Year—even when they struggle.

 

Wily Mo Pena and Kelly Shoppach apparently weren't interviewed in the preparation of this article.

[rician blast]

From the linked article:

 

 

 

Wily Mo Pena and Kelly Shoppach apparently weren't interviewed in the preparation of this article.

 

 

If they were, and they responded objectively (which we know they would not), perhaps they'd say "Francona knows what young guys NOT to flee from and which ones TO flee from." That's a talent in and of itself, and deserves to be noted.

 

WMP? Please.

[TheKilo]

From the linked article:

 

 

 

Wily Mo Pena and Kelly Shoppach apparently weren't interviewed in the preparation of this article.

 

While you may have a point with WMP, who was Shoppach going to replace?

[Jayhawk Bill]

While you may have a point with WMP' date=' who was Shoppach going to replace?[/quote']

 

Kelly Shoppach was called up for his cup of coffee in 2005 when Doug Mirabelli had a 15-Day DL stint. In those two weeks he was allwed to start exactly two games: one against 2005 Cy Young Award winner Bartolo Colon, and one against Mike Mussina. Terry Francona allowed Jason Varitek to rest against two of the toughest pitchers the team faced, and started him in 20 out of the 22 games through that stretch.

 

If the idea was taking care of Tek, it was well done. If the idea was getting Shoppach off to a good MLB start, it was hopelessly botched. Kelly has become a good second-string catcher with Cleveland, hitting .240 with some power. His stats with Boston under Tito were slightly worse, as we all know.

[TheKilo]

Kelly Shoppach was called up for his cup of coffee in 2005 when Doug Mirabelli had a 15-Day DL stint. In those two weeks he was allwed to start exactly two games: one against 2005 Cy Young Award winner Bartolo Colon, and one against Mike Mussina. Terry Francona allowed Jason Varitek to rest against two of the toughest pitchers the team faced, and started him in 20 out of the 22 games through that stretch.

 

If the idea was taking care of Tek, it was well done. If the idea was getting Shoppach off to a good MLB start, it was hopelessly botched. Kelly has become a good second-string catcher with Cleveland, hitting .240 with some power. His stats with Boston under Tito were slightly worse, as we all know.

 

Fair enough, I guess, but do you really think the Sox would let their second string catcher be the difference in acquiring Coco Crisp, whom Shoppach was eventually dealt for?

[rician blast]

Had Shoppach played more at the ML level for the Sox, who is to say he wouldn't have decreased his value? After all, he's only a second string guy, right? Maybe the Sox showed great insight by not playing him much and thereby not letting the league learn that he was less valuable than perceived.

[Jayhawk Bill]

TheKilo, my recollection is that Kelly Shoppach wasn't even an essential part of the trade--the Guardians were rumored to have wanted Mota and Marte for Crisp, and Boston then expanded the trade to include a swap of catchers.

 

Rician Blast, how does having Kelly Shoppach face tougher pitchers than any other batter on the 2005 Red Sox (minimum 10 PA) do anything either to improve his trade value or, as I originally contended, do anything to support young players? My point is that Terry Francona has had a tradition of screwing over young players, not supporting them.

 

2007 did perhaps mark a break with Terry Francona's pattern with respect to screwing over some of his younger players: he treated Pedroia better after a tough start where he was giving Alex Cora some better opportunities. He also treated Kevin Cash much better than he'd treated many other backup catchers.

[MANNYHOF24]

TheKilo, my recollection is that Kelly Shoppach wasn't even an essential part of the trade--the Guardians were rumored to have wanted Mota and Marte for Crisp, and Boston then expanded the trade to include a swap of catchers.

 

Rician Blast, how does having Kelly Shoppach face tougher pitchers than any other batter on the 2005 Red Sox (minimum 10 PA) do anything either to improve his trade value or, as I originally contended, do anything to support young players? My point is that Terry Francona has had a tradition of screwing over young players, not supporting them.

 

2007 did perhaps mark a break with Terry Francona's pattern with respect to screwing over some of his younger players: he treated Pedroia better after a tough start where he was giving Alex Cora some better opportunities. He also treated Kevin Cash much better than he'd treated many other backup catchers.

 

Wow, I can't believe we are arguing over backup catchers. Francona does a good job managing this team. Period. Nobody can say anything about this. He knows who to get through to his players, he knows when to push buttons and he knows when to leave things alone. Let's not also forget how well he has managed in the two postseason appearances. He has been almost flaw-less. Sure he might make a few bone headed moves in the regular season, but what manager doesn't? Francona is an excellent manager and we should be happy that we have him.

[Cocos Disciples]

This isn't the official MLB award. Wedge won that.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3110184

[Jayhawk Bill]

This isn't the official MLB award. Wedge won that.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3110184

 

Exactly. The four ALDS teams' managers split the vote. Terry Francona finished fourth...finished last of those who contended, if you will.

 

Wow, I can't believe we are arguing over backup catchers. Francona does a good job managing this team. Period. Nobody can say anything about this. He knows who to get through to his players, he knows when to push buttons and he knows when to leave things alone. Let's not also forget how well he has managed in the two postseason appearances. He has been almost flaw-less. Sure he might make a few bone headed moves in the regular season, but what manager doesn't? Francona is an excellent manager and we should be happy that we have him.

 

Francona sucks as a manager. Check the work at BBTF by Chris Jaffe regarding managers. Terry Francona sucked with Philly and he sucked with Boston. He's had a habit of destroying pitchers, and a ton of position players have struggled with Terry Francona as a manager. He was one of the 20 worst managers of the 20th Century, and he's little better now.

 

But you say, "Francona does a good job managing this team. Period. Nobody can say anything about this."

 

I say prove it. And don't say that he's won two World Series, unless you're ready to explain that the talent he's received from the Front Office was inadequate to the task and that he did it by his managerial savvy. Show us objectively why he's a good manager, or cut the crap I just quoted you as posting.

[redsoxrules]

 

 

 

don't say that he's won two World Series, unless you're ready to explain that the talent he's received from the Front Office was inadequate to the task and that he did it by his managerial savvy. .

 

so bassicaly what your saying is that the sox would of had 2 WS titles no matter who their manager was

[Jayhawk Bill]

so bassicaly what your saying is that the sox would of had 2 WS titles no matter who their manager was

 

I'm saying that I've seen no evidence that Terry Francona, rather than his players, is good.

[HeadOfSoxNation]

I'm saying that I've seen no evidence that Terry Francona' date=' rather than his players, is good.[/quote']

 

I agree...I have a hard time giving Manager of the Year to someone who is working with the 2nd highest payroll in professional baseball. Don't get me wrong...I love Tito...but common.

 

I wish we could have awarded 2 awards in the National League and bagged the AL.

[schillingouttheks]

I wish we could have awarded 2 awards in the National League and bagged the AL.

 

Why? Eric Wedge was pretty deserving, IMO.

[Gom]

Joe Torre should have won. For leaving. I hate him.

 

When you think about it, realize that he had to be given instructions [Joba Rules] so he didn't injure his player. Douchebag.

 

Congrats Francona. You deserved it, but I would have given it to Wedge.

 

As for the 2 AL awards...did you forget Arizona and Philly?

[schillingouttheks]

This isn't the official MLB award. Wedge won that.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3110184

 

^^^ Everyone read this post.

 

ERIC WEDGE WON THE OFFICIAL AWARD. This is just given by Baseball America. The official title is Baseball America's Manager of the Year.

[TheKilo]

^^^ Everyone read this post.

 

ERIC WEDGE WON THE OFFICIAL AWARD. This is just given by Baseball America. The official title is Baseball America's Manager of the Year.

 

Durrrr

 

Read the linked article

[schillingouttheks]

Durrrr

 

Read the linked article

 

I know. There are a lot of people that think Francona actually won it, lol.

[HeadOfSoxNation]

I'm retarded.