Gagne the newest member of the RedSox

[mtbykr]

apparently the reason the yanks didn't land gagne was because they didn't want to part with Melky (johnny damon says hi:D ) but then when they saw what the sox gave up they were surprised by 'how cheap' the sox got him.

[He Hate Me]

i have images of the soriano for Schilling demands all over again.

 

i really don't care, gagne would have only prolonged the obvious.

[BoSox21]

http://www.rds.ca/images/chroniques/233974.jpg

 

looks pretty damn good to me

[Mr Crunchy]

mdc or hansen with wilymo for jermaine dye is too much?

we have 3 starters now under 27 and signed for the long haul

we have buckholz bowden and this other guy justin masterson in the fold

we signed a set up guy who has pitched very well in texas so why is manny delcarmen untouchable??

of all our needs the 5 hitter has been the most glaring hole.

 

mdc is perhaps at the height of his career,a 6th or 7th inning relief pitcher with a 4+ era

hansen may never get there at all

pena will never get there as long as hes in boston

the 5 hitter theo signed for 70million isnt capable of getting it done in that slot and jermaine dye is just that,a legit 5 hitter

sure hes hitting .235 but isnt that about 30 points higher than our #5 hitters are performing at now??

 

i love the gagne move

but if i got a pop for jermaine dye for mdc or hansen or pena i do it without looking back,especially if ortiz is banged up and with the never ending saga of jd drews chronic menstrual pains.

[TC33]

Has anyone heard comments from Gagne since the trade was announced?

[Rdsxmbnt]

how is MannyD at the height of his career???

[Khan]

Has anyone heard comments from Gagne since the trade was announced?

 

Yes, I think he said we should've got Dye too.

[KeepTheFaith1229]

mdc or hansen with wilymo for jermaine dye is too much?

we have 3 starters now under 27 and signed for the long haul

we have buckholz bowden and this other guy justin masterson in the fold

we signed a set up guy who has pitched very well in texas so why is manny delcarmen untouchable??

of all our needs the 5 hitter has been the most glaring hole.

 

mdc is perhaps at the height of his career,a 6th or 7th inning relief pitcher with a 4+ era

hansen may never get there at all

pena will never get there as long as hes in boston

the 5 hitter theo signed for 70million isnt capable of getting it done in that slot and jermaine dye is just that,a legit 5 hitter

sure hes hitting .235 but isnt that about 30 points higher than our #5 hitters are performing at now??

 

i love the gagne move

but if i got a pop for jermaine dye for mdc or hansen or pena i do it without looking back,especially if ortiz is banged up and with the never ending saga of jd drews chronic menstrual pains.

 

Dye is awful this year and would barely be an upgrade over Drew if any upgrade at all, he has a freaking .292 OBP. Its not worth weakening our bullpen in order to get that.

 

How is manny delcarmen at the peak of his career a 4+ ERA guy? Take out his one meltdown month (September of last year) and he has a career 3.50 ERA as a 25 year old kid in the AL east.

[Mr Crunchy]

dye hit more hrs last month than drew hit all year

our 1 glaring and most obvious hole is the 5 hitter and specifically clutch hitting in that slot.

dye,with manny in front and lowell or youk behind wouldve flourished...

i also felt lowell youk pena and jd drew would fill that hole as well so what the f*** do i know...

anyways

i do know getting gagne made delcarmen somewhat expendable

delcarmen will never be a starter or a closer so with his 2.00 era he carries today he may indeed be at the height of his career as a middle guy who can potentially be a set up man.

 

dont get me wrong here.

i was born 5 minutes from the kids house,i like delcarmen and i want him to succeed but not at the expense of the redsox october success.

our future staff is secure

we got 3 starters under 27 locked up long term with a s*** load of minor league talent,some of which will be here in september when we expand to 40 men.

 

we got ancient mike timlin who has pitched very very well since his return

we will have tavares coming back to the pen,ya i know he is sketchy but in short stints he can be effective,we got a decent long man in snyder who has a big league curve ball but tends to fade with too much work and then you got 2 leftys to close out the pen in lopez and oj....the bridge to paps and or gagne is built and moving delcarmen wouldnt effect what amounts to be the best bullpen in baseball in my opinion.

 

im not totally depressed over not getting dye for the stretch run but i do think they shouldve pulled the trigger if the price was a mediocre/currently decent middle guy and pena.

[He Hate Me]

u have the best bullpen in the majors right now and your lineup has the best 1-2 combo in the game.

 

i have no sympathy for you.

[redsoxrules]

I love the fact with added Gagne, few resons

 

the game will be over if we lead after 6 innings

we will have a big advantage in extra innings

if an injury occurs to one of the big 3 , will still have the best pen

tito will have the opportunity to have them all well rested

and if one of our closers is having a bad night we have another one to back him out

[26 to 6]

This was an awesome deal for the Sox. Great job in pulling this one off.

[jacksonianmarch]

This deal was awesome for the sox. I was listening to Mike and Mike on my way into work and he said that the price for the yankees was Melky or Kennedy and a lower level pitching prospect. Then the sox nab him with a #5/spot starter, a projected backup OFer, and a 17 yr old kid who is 4-5 yrs away if he makes it at all. Maybe the Rangers just hate the yankees, who knows, but the deals dont add up.

[CrespoBlows]

This deal was awesome for the sox. I was listening to Mike and Mike on my way into work and he said that the price for the yankees was Melky or Kennedy and a lower level pitching prospect. Then the sox nab him with a #5/spot starter' date=' a projected backup OFer, and a 17 yr old kid who is 4-5 yrs away if he makes it at all. Maybe the Rangers just hate the yankees, who knows, but the deals dont add up.[/quote']

 

The Yankees wouldn't give up Cabrera. That killed the trade talks.

[jacksonianmarch]

The Yankees wouldn't give up Cabrera. That killed the trade talks.

 

I wouldnt give up Cabrera either. He's a 23 yr old switching hitting CFer who has hit .280 and .290 in the past 2 yrs respectively who is showing improving defensive and offensive skills while continuing to show patience at the plate. He has given us BA and OBP wise what Damon gave us last yr with better defense and a better arm. He shouldnt be moved, he is very necessary to this team right now.

[redsoxrules]

This deal was awesome for the sox. I was listening to Mike and Mike on my way into work and he said that the price for the yankees was Melky or Kennedy and a lower level pitching prospect. Then the sox nab him with a #5/spot starter' date=' a projected backup OFer, and a 17 yr old kid who is 4-5 yrs away if he makes it at all. Maybe the Rangers just hate the yankees, who knows, but the deals dont add up.[/quote']

 

texas needs starting pitching badly, Gabbard isnt great but he's actually their best starter now

[CrespoBlows]

I wouldnt give up Cabrera either. He's a 23 yr old switching hitting CFer who has hit .280 and .290 in the past 2 yrs respectively who is showing improving defensive and offensive skills while continuing to show patience at the plate. He has given us BA and OBP wise what Damon gave us last yr with better defense and a better arm. He shouldnt be moved' date=' he is very necessary to this team right now.[/quote']

 

I agree, Cabrera is probably in the upper echelon of CF, this year. (Top 10)

 

Seeing that Kennedy and Cabrera were off limits, what was the Yankees offer to the Rangers?

[CrespoBlows]

texas needs starting pitching badly' date=' Gabbard isnt great but he's actually their best starter now[/quote']

 

 

So sad, but so true.

[jacksonianmarch]

Yeah, but they arent looking to win this season. If they wanted to get a guy whose potential may be greater, we certainly could have given them a Chase Wright (who is right along the lines of Gabbard) and a Marquez (who is younger and has more promise than Gabbard long term). I just dont see their fascination with a lefty who has shown to be erratic in and out of the zone and doesnt have stuff that will project him past a #5. My prediction is that Gabbard will be in AAA by next season and run the shuttle up and down for the rest of his career. And for him to be the biggest name moved in the Gagne deal while other options were available is atrocious.

[br3ds0x]

Was out of town yesterday and heard about Gagne on espn. I saw he didn't pitch last night..but was he at the game? If not is he expected to be tonight?

[schillingouttheks]

He'll be in Boston tonight. He didn't make it in time for the game yesterday.

[CrespoBlows]

Yeah' date=' but they arent looking to win this season. If they wanted to get a guy whose potential may be greater, we certainly could have given them a Chase Wright (who is right along the lines of Gabbard) and a Marquez (who is younger and has more promise than Gabbard long term). I just dont see their fascination with a lefty who has shown to be erratic in and out of the zone and doesnt have stuff that will project him past a #5. My prediction is that Gabbard will be in AAA by next season and run the shuttle up and down for the rest of his career. And for him to be the biggest name moved in the Gagne deal while other options were available is atrocious.[/quote']

 

Chase Wright's stock is nil. He's struggling in AA ball, whereas Gabbard showed that he could pitch effectively in the bigs. He's probably nothing more than a #5, but he keeps the ball on the ground, which is a plus at Ameriquest.

 

Marquez's WHIP is 1.35, at AA. He's always had a problem with getting hit, and his K/9 rate took a nose dive this year. None of these guys can be considered better than Gabbard.

 

EDIT* I do agree that this haul was a little weak, but Gagne was probably going for nothing in the offseason, perhaps a type B pick. I guess they weighed that Gabbard and Murphy had a higher chance of contributing to the team, than a sandwich pick in the draft did.

[jacksonianmarch]

Chase Wright's stock is nil. He's struggling in AA ball, whereas Gabbard showed that he could pitch effectively in the bigs. He's probably nothing more than a #5, but he keeps the ball on the ground, which is a plus at Ameriquest.

 

Marquez's WHIP is 1.35, at AA. He's always had a problem with getting hit, and his K/9 rate took a nose dive this year. None of these guys can be considered better than Gabbard.

 

Marquez is a 22 yr old sinkerballer who is pitching rather well in AA. yes, the WHIP is high, but his GB rate is also high. I like him more for the fact that he has a solid arsenal and that he is young. Hence, why I think he projects more as a middle rotation or solid relief prospect.

 

Wright is 24 and I agree, he is struggling right now. But at the same time, he is a lefty with a nice curve and a solid changeup who has essentially the exact same arsenal as Gabbard and the exact same problems. This is why i was saying that a deal involving a player who is essentially Gabbard-esque, plus a higher risk/reward prospect would be a better move than getting a 17 yr old hitting .208 in the GCL.

[BoSox21]

With Schilling already wearing #38, Gagne will wear #83 during his Red Sox stint. apparently he'll be playing wide receiver for the Patriots....

[CrespoBlows]

From Keith Law, sizing the deal up.

 

By acquiring Eric Gagne, the Red Sox fortified their bullpen, which wasn't a weakness for them but was top-heavy. Adding another good reliever to the late-inning mix helps them redistribute the workload of leveraged innings across more quality arms, and can help them avoid using Jonathan Papelbon -- he of the shoulder that allegedly wouldn't let him be a closer -- too many days in a row. They also kept Gagne away from the three other American League contenders looking for relief help, particularly the Yankees, who traded away Scott Proctor but didn't add any arms from outside the organization.

 

In exchange, the Rangers got ... stuff. David Murphy and Kason Gabbard are both big-league ready, but neither is an above-average player, and Murphy is more of a fourth outfielder or a fringe regular in center field than a solid everyday player. He does have decent plate discipline, but despite his size doesn't get a lot of loft on the ball, hitting singles and doubles to the gaps but not enough of them to be a regular in a corner spot. The Red Sox sold high on Gabbard, a pitchability lefty who has succeeded in seven big-league starts by relying on his defense, which has helped keep his hit rate ridiculously low. He has good sink on his fastball, which is otherwise below-average, and hides the ball extremely well.

 

The wild card here for Texas is center fielder Engel Beltre, a 17-year-old signed for about $600,000 out of the Dominican Republic in 2006. Beltre is an exciting player with a lot of ability. He has a clean swing with some loft in it, a plus arm, and he might be able to stay in center. If not, his bat will play in an outfield corner. He's playing in the Gulf Coast League at an age when most Dominican prospects are still playing in the Dominican Summer League, and he's holding his own, with five homers (tied for eighth in the league) and a .198 isolated power (10th in the league). I like the Rangers' willingness to take a short-season prospect in each of their two deals this week (pitcher Neftali Feliz was involved in the Mark Teixeira trade), knowing that contenders are nearly always willing to part with those guys to get a deal done. If this trade is going to turn out to be a win for the Rangers, it will almost certainly be because Beltre developed into the star he's capable of becoming.

[jacksonianmarch]

By acquiring short season guys, you essentially increase the risk you are taking by a huge multiplier. This deal makes no sense.

[riverside sluggers]

Marquez is a 22 yr old sinkerballer who is pitching rather well in AA. yes, the WHIP is high, but his GB rate is also high. I like him more for the fact that he has a solid arsenal and that he is young. Hence, why I think he projects more as a middle rotation or solid relief prospect.

 

Wright is 24 and I agree, he is struggling right now. But at the same time, he is a lefty with a nice curve and a solid changeup who has essentially the exact same arsenal as Gabbard and the exact same problems. This is why i was saying that a deal involving a player who is essentially Gabbard-esque, plus a higher risk/reward prospect would be a better move than getting a 17 yr old hitting .208 in the GCL.

 

Oh Jacko how the tables are turned. Last year the Yanks got Abreu and Lidle for 2 crap prospects (I know it was a salary dump but still), plus they got Craig Wilson for Shawn Chacon who was struggling mightily

 

I think Gabbard has got a leg up on Wright who has shown much more consistency in the majors. Just a 17 year old who is hitting .208? He was one of the most sought after players when the international signing took place? Engel Beltre, like Wily Mo Pena has a lot of upside in him but he needs the proper seasoning. Tim will tell how he turns out. The Rangers also got David Murphy, a solid defending outfielder with some pop.

 

By acquiring short season guys' date=' you essentially increase the risk you are taking by a huge multiplier. This deal makes no sense.[/quote']

 

Yea its not like they needed extra insurance for Okajima (cant get him be used like Quantrill/Gordon), Timlin (achy shoulder), Delcarmen (solid as they come, sometimes can get in ruts). Youre just sour because the Sox actually one-upped the Yankees

[jacksonianmarch]

Oh Jacko how the tables are turned. Last year the Yanks got Abreu and Lidle for 2 crap prospects (I know it was a salary dump but still), plus they got Craig Wilson for Shawn Chacon who was struggling mightily

 

I think Gabbard has got a leg up on Wright who has shown much more consistency in the majors. Just a 17 year old who is hitting .208? He was one of the most sought after players when the international signing took place? Engel Beltre, like Wily Mo Pena has a lot of upside in him but he needs the proper seasoning. Tim will tell how he turns out. The Rangers also got David Murphy, a solid defending outfielder with some pop.

 

 

 

Yea its not like they needed extra insurance for Okajima (cant get him be used like Quantrill/Gordon), Timlin (achy shoulder), Delcarmen (solid as they come, sometimes can get in ruts). Youre just sour because the Sox actually one-upped the Yankees

 

The Abreu deal was straight cash essentially, the sox could have easily trumped us if they were willing to spend coin.

 

My point is that we could have beaten this deal without giving up our top prospects, yet the Rangers insisted on them while not insisting on yours. This is what is interesting.

[CrespoBlows]

Oh Jacko how the tables are turned. Last year the Yanks got Abreu and Lidle for 2 crap prospects (I know it was a salary dump but still)' date=' plus they got Craig Wilson for Shawn Chacon who was struggling mightily[/quote']

 

Jacksonian is right. This was a pure salary dump. The Phillies probably could have gotten a quality prospects had they been willing to eat some of the money, but they didn't.

 

Yea its not like they needed extra insurance for Okajima (cant get him be used like Quantrill/Gordon), Timlin (achy shoulder), Delcarmen (solid as they come, sometimes can get in ruts). Youre just sour because the Sox actually one-upped the Yankees

 

He was talking about the Rangers.

[CrespoBlows]

My point is that we could have beaten this deal without giving up our top prospects, yet the Rangers insisted on them while not insisting on yours. This is what is interesting.

 

The Rangers weren't offered a top prospect by any team. The Brewers offered Gwynn, Jackson, and a third prospect. The Red Sox offered Gabbard, Murphy, and Beltre.

 

I still don't know what the Yankees offered the Rangers.