Papelbon is the closer according ESPN

[Joeroafan]

good move

[CrespoBlows]

That's too much to give up for Cordero' date=' IMO. Especially if Paps is only a stopgap for the year and they've got something else in the works for the offseason.[/quote']

 

I don't think Bowden will be a great pitcher in the bigs. His lack of an offspeed pitch will really hurt him if he can't develop it. I'd have trouble dealing Ellsbury, but if we can net Cordero out of it, (A young star, himself) we'd have to do it.

[BoSox21]

The first four better throw complete games, because the pen is going to be doing a lot of mop up duty when the fifth starter takes his place on the mound.

 

Seriously, what the hell do you guys see in Kyle Snyder? Him getting skull f***ed after the fourth inning wasn't enough? Julian Tavarez? Calling him a success after four starts in September? Laughable.

 

Snyder is a sack of s*** but considering Tavarez did well in each start he was given, though it was only a handful, I'd say it's enough to give him a shot at the back end of the rotation

 

And Clemens is the ideal but my gut still says he's going to New York if he does return at all

[schillingouttheks]

I really don't like this move. I'm concerned about his shoulder, and I don't think it's the right thing to do if we're looking towards the long run. 200 innings are a lot more valuable than 50, and just like last season, I'm going to be s***ing my pants every fifth day. Hopefully Tavarez can pull something out of his ass like he did last season down the stretch. I still think he's a worthless sack of s***, though.

[jacksonianmarch]

Tavarez had Chacon-esque luck. His 1.5 WHIP as a starter is pathetic, he was magical in getting out of jams. He wont be so lucky over an entire yr.

 

Your best scenario would be to see what Hansack can do, then hand it over to Lester.

 

And I agree with rician. Rudderless is a good adjective. You have some of the best orthopedic surgeons in the country telling you that a heavy workout every 5 days vs a light workout daily is preferred and you go against that? Those restrictions dont change the fact that he is still working essentially every other day on average. And, this isnt a 35 yr old who lives for right now with no future. Paps is a once in a few yrs kind of talent, and to put him at risk is a bad idea. If he goes down with a career altering injury, expect a FO cleaning.

 

And who is to say that those restrictions will be followed. Are you telling me that in late August when the yankees make their charge, the sox will throw some schmuck out there to close because Paps has pitched for 3 straight days? When the rubber hits the road, these "guidelines" will go right out the window.

[TheKilo]

Ugh.

 

I'd rather keep Papelbon in the rotation and deal for a guy like Lidge or Cordero, and we all know I had reservations about Cordero.

 

I think this is the FO re-signing Mirabelli, part 2. It's a clear panic move.

[riverside sluggers]

Hell yea, just got the news! Of course hopefully this move is being done with the OK by the docs

 

Hey yankees, the race has just gotten tighter. Now I heard Tavarez will be the 5th starter but I think it will end up being a revolving door until Lester is ready or... Roger decides to come back

 

EDIT: Guys I dont like this talk about him just being a stopgap. Closer to starter to closer to starter, etc, will just harpen his mechanics and maybe even his arm. If he wants to do it, and he has been approved by the medical staff, then I'll be filled with adrenaline that he could be the team's closer for a long time. A la Mariano

[adam123]

I dont think this is front office move I read he wanted this job he was drafted as a closer he said he has not been able to sleep at night he loves this role .I say if he wants it you say ok closers like him dont come around to often

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

This sucks...

 

I have a completely different view of the pitching staff now....

 

The Red Sox had the best starting rotation going into the season...now they are somewhere in the middle.

 

...but our bullpen has a closer. Not to mention this adds more injury risk to Jonathan Papelbon. Terrible move by the front office. I think we had the arms in the bullpen to get innings and hold plenty of leads. What kind of confidence does the bullpen have now???

[Plumpamania]

Hey guys.

 

I'd just like to chime in. I think that this is a horrible move. Papelbon's shoulder won't continue to hold up in my opinion. If he couldn't hack it last year, how is he going to hack the pen this year? (Health wise of course, not performance).

 

The starting rotation was the best in MLB with him in it. The rotation until an expensive Clemens or a revamped Lester comes back to it.

 

I understand that the trade market for quality relievers is horrible. I know that Bowden was asking for Lester, Hansen and either Ellsbury or Pedroia for Cordero, and I agree that we were right to leave that offer out there.

 

But Houston has Dan Wheeler or Chad Qualls, who were both quality relievers that are ready to step up for the closer job. It was said that Purpura was asking about David Murphy and either Hansen or Delcarmen for either reliever, and that is something I would have liked to have done.

 

Sure we have an average pen right now. To Average from Below Average. But now our rotation went from Best to Average. I don't like that trade off.

[MANNYHOF24]

Hey guys.

 

I'd just like to chime in. I think that this is a horrible move. Papelbon's shoulder won't continue to hold up in my opinion. If he couldn't hack it last year, how is he going to hack the pen this year? (Health wise of course, not performance).

 

The starting rotation was the best in MLB with him in it. The rotation until an expensive Clemens or a revamped Lester comes back to it.

 

I understand that the trade market for quality relievers is horrible. I know that Bowden was asking for Lester, Hansen and either Ellsbury or Pedroia for Cordero, and I agree that we were right to leave that offer out there.

 

But Houston has Dan Wheeler or Chad Qualls, who were both quality relievers that are ready to step up for the closer job. It was said that Purpura was asking about David Murphy and either Hansen or Delcarmen for either reliever, and that is something I would have liked to have done.

 

Sure we have an average pen right now. To Average from Below Average. But now our rotation went from Best to Average. I don't like that trade off.

 

Wrong again, our bullpen went from solid without a closer, to a championship level bullpen. Our rotation is hurt but we still have 3 potential 1 starters with wakefield as an innings eater. If Lester returns to what he was in June and July last year, this team is going to be better with Papelbon being the closer.

[Plumpamania]

Wrong again' date=' our bullpen went from solid without a closer, to a championship level bullpen. Our rotation is hurt but we still have 3 potential 1 starters with wakefield as an innings eater. If Lester returns to what he was in June and July last year, this team is going to be better with Papelbon being the closer.[/quote']

 

Our bullpen is LONG even with Papelbon from being Championship Calibur. You want Championship Calibur look at Minnesota, Los Angeles (A), New York both AL and NL and finally take a look at the Braves. Those are Championship Calibur bullpens.

 

Brendan Donnelly was alright last year. He's going into his age 35 season and has had an ERA+ of 113 and 111 the last two years respectively. That's slightly above average.

 

Julian Tavarez as a reliever is pure s***.

 

Joel Piniero hasn't had a full, solid year since his rookie campaign.

 

Mike Timlin is going into his age 41 season. Had a 106 ERA+ last year, a drop of 91 points from the previous year and is starting the year on the DL. Not good.

 

J.C. Romero had a 65 ERA+. An average pitcher has a 100 ERA+. His career ERA+ is 101. He's an average reliever coming off a year where even he wouldn't have pitched for our injury pounded pitching staff.

 

Hideki Okajima (spelling is wrong) is coming off a decent year in the Japanese league, but one has to believe that he was brought over to ease the transition of cultures for Dice-K.

 

After this spring and last year you can't tell me that Delcarmen and Hansen are MLB ready.

 

Our bullpen is pedestrian. It becomes average with Papelbon in there. Just admit it, and stop going about it blindly by faith.

[CrespoBlows]

Wrong again' date=' our bullpen went from solid without a closer, to a championship level bullpen. Our rotation is hurt but we still have 3 potential 1 starters with wakefield as an innings eater. If Lester returns to what he was in June and July last year, this team is going to be better with Papelbon being the closer.[/quote']

 

Championship?

 

If one of our starters can't get to the eighth inning, who's going to bridge the gap to Papelbon?

[Plumpamania]

Championship?

 

If one of our starters can't get to the eighth inning, who's going to bridge the gap to Papelbon?

 

 

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[VA Sox Fan]

Papelbon was the best closer in the AL last year. I never understood why they wanted him in the rotation.

 

So, all of you "GM's" out there, instead of what you think is best for the team, what about what Papelbon wants? And what he wants is clearly best for this team.

 

From the Globe:

 

March 22, 2007

 

Paps: I want to close the rest of my career

 

By Gordon Edes, Globe Staff

 

Jonathan Papelbon and Terry Francona confirmed this afternoon that the club is abandoning the experiment to convert him to a starter and that he will continue as the team's closer.

 

Papelbon, despite his public declarations of embracing the role of starter, said he hasn't been able to sleep this spring because he wanted to close and finally told Francona of his desire on the field prior to Tuesday night's exhibition game.

 

"I walked into Tito's office and said, 'If you want to give me the ball in the ninth, I want it,'" Papelbon said today.

 

Papelbon confirmed the decision after this afternoon's game with Philadelphia.

 

“This was something that’s been kind of weighing on my shoulders for most of spring training, and trying to decide what makes me happy and what gets me going every day to show up at the ballpark to play 162 games a year,” Papelbon told ESPN. “I’m glad to finally make a decision and get it over with.”

Francona, who had spent a fair amount of time publicly disparaging the notion that Papelbon would close, acknowledged yesterday that the idea has been percolating for some time, so the team was ready to adjust on the fly. Julian Tavarez becomes the fifth starter, with Tim Wakefield sliding into the No. 4 hole.

 

“A lot of research has been done all spring because of the way he’s come into camp, the way he’s throwing, the way he structurally is so sound, the way he’s bouncing back,” Francona said in an ESPN interview. “There’s a lot of questions that I wanted to get answered, and to do something like this, there’s a lot of questions that needed answering by the appropriate people. And we went every step of the way, but then he beat me to the punch coming in.”

 

Papelbon said he told team captain Jason Varitek of his desire to close before speaking with the manager, and also consulted his family. His parents were in Clearwater to watch him pitch three innings today.

 

Both Papelbon and Francona insisted that Papelbon had done so well strengthening his shoulder that the medical reasons for making him a starter have been allayed. Francona did say he would have to closely monitor Papelbon's workload to protect against overuse. He said last August, Papelbon threw more pitches than anyone in the big leagues.

 

“My shoulder issue is not really an issue at this point,” Papelbon said in an ESPN interview. “It’s really for me to go out there and stay on my shoulder program and really understand my body, know when I can and can’t pitch. There was a few times last year when I took the ball and maybe I shouldn’t have. But you can’t really point your finger at one thing to say why I got hurt last year. Thank God nothing tore and I’m able to come back healthy this year and reclaim my job.”

 

Papelbon was insistent that he would not do something that would jeopardize his health just because the team didn't have a clear-cut alternative as closer.

 

"To make a decision solely based on one year is kind of retarded, in my opinion,'' he said. "This is something I'd like to do the rest of my career. Forget about starting. Go out (as a closer), chase records and hopefully do for the Red Sox what Mariano Rivera does for the Yankees.''

 

"Obviously we're thrilled,'' Francona said. "This kid is very special.''

 

Francona insisted that if the team had any doubts about Papelbon's health, it wouldn't have mattered that Papelbon wanted to close. He would have walked Papelbon right out of his office if that had been the case.

 

Posted By: gedes | Time: 04:25:59 PM

[VA Sox Fan]

Championship?

 

If one of our starters can't get to the eighth inning, who's going to bridge the gap to Papelbon?

 

Lopez, Okajima, Pinero, Romero, Snyder, Donnelly, and eventually Timlin....

[Plumpamania]

Lopez' date=' Okajima, Pinero, Romero, Snyder, Donnelly, and eventually Timlin....[/quote']

 

Now name someone good.

[TedWilliams101]

This is awesome.

 

They cleared his arm, so we shouldn't really have to worry about injury risk. They wouldn't move him to the pen if it wasn't perfectly fine with his shoulder. I'm sure they will make sure he is nice and healthy too.

 

And he wants to close for the rest of his career, so for the first time in a long while, it looks like we now have a fanchise closer that we'll hopefully see for the next 10 years.

 

I love this move.

[Plumpamania]

During the offseason Papelbon publically stated that he wanted to be a starter. That he didn't think his shoulder would last in the pen for a career. You won't see Papelbon in the pen after this year. Craig Hansen is your franchise closer. That's why he was drafted. Papelbon was changed to a starter by the Red Sox for a reason. To start.

 

Bucholtz, Lester, Papelbon, Matsuzaka, Beckett is a helluva young rotation.

[RobZombie]

During the offseason Papelbon publically stated that he wanted to be a starter. That he didn't think his shoulder would last in the pen for a career. You won't see Papelbon in the pen after this year. Craig Hansen is your franchise closer. That's why he was drafted. Papelbon was changed to a starter by the Red Sox for a reason. To start.

 

Bucholtz, Lester, Papelbon, Matsuzaka, Beckett is a helluva young rotation.

 

First off, I am highly skeptical that Hansen will ever be that franchise closer. Yes that's why he was drafted, but he's a long way off from being that dominant guy that he was billed as. He's not there yet. He may never get there. I am hopeful, but its certainly no sure thing.

 

Second, I'm not to sure that Papelbon would do that well as a starter. His peripheral statistics in his last full season starting were strong but not outstanding. He clearly can be dominant as a closer and has show better peripherals than he had as a starter at any level.

 

I am hopeful that some of the Sox young arms step forward, but I think that in a year we are going to be sitting here with Papelbon as the best option to be the closer once again.

[ORS]

His peripheral statistics in his last full season starting are kind of irrelevant now, I think. He was a different pitcher then. He struggled a bit with his FB command, and he really didn't have a plus second pitch at the time. Last year he really refined his command, and he developed a plus splitter. His curve has shown drastic improvement in ST, and his splitter is looking plus plus. I think he's a different animal than what he was two years ago. I think they are sacraficing what could be a really good thing without finding out if it will be. That is shortsighted and irresponsible.

[jacksonianmarch]

Wrong again' date=' our bullpen went from solid without a closer, to a championship level bullpen. Our rotation is hurt but we still have 3 potential 1 starters with wakefield as an innings eater. If Lester returns to what he was in June and July last year, this team is going to be better with Papelbon being the closer.[/quote']

 

solid without a closer? On which planet? Last yr the sox middle relief was pathetic and they added a bunch of stiffs to it. Their best middle reliever is 41 and starting the yr on the DL. They added a declining righty and a terrible lefty as well as an unknown lefty. Paps makes the pen better, absolutely. But dont kid yourself. You just went from one of the worst pens in the game to bottom third. Your MR ERA was 5+ last yr. Dont kid yourself.

[riverside sluggers]

solid without a closer? On which planet? Last yr the sox middle relief was pathetic and they added a bunch of stiffs to it. Their best middle reliever is 41 and starting the yr on the DL. They added a declining righty and a terrible lefty as well as an unknown lefty. Paps makes the pen better' date=' absolutely. But dont kid yourself. You just went from one of the worst pens in the game to bottom third. Your MR ERA was 5+ last yr. Dont kid yourself.[/quote']

 

One of the worst to the bottom 3rd, so basically they didnt move up?

 

JC Romero should do a commendable job if just used as a lefty specialist. Also maybe its just me, but Okajima's not going to be a bad reliever as many people Ive heard suggest it

[jacksonianmarch]

One of the worst to the bottom 3rd, so basically they didnt move up?

 

JC Romero should do a commendable job if just used as a lefty specialist. Also maybe its just me, but Okajima's not going to be a bad reliever as many people Ive heard suggest it

 

No, something like high 20s to low 20s upper teens.

[VA Sox Fan]

During the offseason Papelbon publically stated that he wanted to be a starter. That he didn't think his shoulder would last in the pen for a career. You won't see Papelbon in the pen after this year. Craig Hansen is your franchise closer. That's why he was drafted. Papelbon was changed to a starter by the Red Sox for a reason. To start.

 

Bucholtz, Lester, Papelbon, Matsuzaka, Beckett is a helluva young rotation.

 

 

Yes he did state that in the offseason, but today, he said he wants to close for the next 10 years.

 

I'd take him over any closer in the game today. And why some others can't see that is beyond me.

 

It's an excellent move for the Sox and the BP is more solid than some give it credit.

 

Let the season begin and GO SOX!

[riverside sluggers]

The morale & optimism for the season really got drained from this board about Papelbon going back to close role

[jacksonianmarch]

Yes he did state that in the offseason, but today, he said he wants to close for the next 10 years.

 

I'd take him over any closer in the game today. And why some others can't see that is beyond me.

 

It's an excellent move for the Sox and the BP is more solid than some give it credit.

 

Let the season begin and GO SOX!

 

there's a certain closer 200 or so miles away who I think you'd rather have for this yr anyway.

[VA Sox Fan]

there's a certain closer 200 or so miles away who I think you'd rather have for this yr anyway.

 

 

Um, no, I wouldn't. Mo is where he belongs.

[jacksonianmarch]

Papelbon was a better reliever than he was a closer. As a reliever, he had the second best ERA for a pitcher throwing over 50IP of relief. As a closer, he saved 85% of his SvOpps which is good for 15th in players with over 20 saves.

[VA Sox Fan]

Papelbon was a better reliever than he was a closer. As a reliever' date=' he had the second best ERA for a pitcher throwing over 50IP of relief. As a closer, he saved 85% of his SvOpps which is good for 15th in players with over 20 saves.[/quote']

 

 

Nice stat jacko.......whatever gets you through the night

 

So would Tavarez be the better closer? Who on our roster is a better option?

 

You were psyched when you thought Julian was going to be the closer. Now you're just reaching and it's not very becoming.