Schilling rips backstabbing front office

[seabeachfred]

Besides Schilling just started that game company' date=' Green Monster games or something, he wants to stay in Boston. He basically asked to see if he could get extended one yr( even he admits he knew it was doubtful), but the FO said no we need to see how you pitch this yr. He brought up the hole I will become a FA if they don't sign me now as the only bit of leverage he had, just incase they where on the fence and that might make them lean towards signing him, but the FO was not teetering, they where on the lets wait side already. He knew this was a possibility too and said this wont be a distraction, so lets take him on his word and wait and see what he does. If he switches gears and becomes a pain in the ass or whatever, or leaves in the offseason for more money or years thats on him. He said all he wanted was 1 yr and 13M.[/quote']

 

And that should be the utter end of this thread BoNat as we all move on to a different topic. I think we have exhausted this one to its bitter end.

[Mr Crunchy]

dont worry fred

when schill is 12-3 at the break and he turns down theos offer for 30M for 2 seasons we can revisit this

[BSN07]

If he turned that down, then f*** him.... Thats a sweet deal for any 40+ yr old pitcher, and if he turned that down then I think its safe to say he had no intentions on resigning, but I don't care, we will see what happens this yr and go with it from there.

[jacksonianmarch]

bosox, if Schilling is 12-3 in the ALE at the break, then 15 mil a season would be a starting point. And in the NL he could get a Jason Schmidt type deal. If RJ can get 2 yrs 32 mil for sucking, how much can a younger Curt get for being good?

[MANNYHOF24]

bosox' date=' if Schilling is 12-3 in the ALE at the break, then 15 mil a season would be a starting point. And in the NL he could get a Jason Schmidt type deal. If RJ can get 2 yrs 32 mil for sucking, how much can a younger Curt get for being good?[/quote']

 

At this point in his career, do you really think Curt is concerned with the money? I think he would take a 2-30 million dollar deal to stay with the sox in a heartbeat, seeing how he is a ledgend here.

[seabeachfred]

MANNYHOF, I agree with you on that point. He probably would stay in Boston because he loves it there, but that is another reason I don't like the way they are dissing him over this damn extention. What's done is done; the FO is not talking about an extention right now but I hope they have assured Curt that if he shows he is solid they will take into consideration that he wants to finish his career with the Red Sox. And while I'm about it that is something they sure as hell ought to make clear because our record in keeping our key players over the years has been s***** in the extreme.

[castigs850]

i disagree with that fred, i don tthink curt is that big into loyalty or staying where he is a legend, he wants to play for as long as he can, if he gets more years/more money somewhere else i have not doubt he will take it, this isnt arroyo we are talking about, there will be no hometown discount. IMO June is the real deadline unless he does s***** and then we wont bother resigning him anyway.

[seabeachfred]

i disagree with that fred' date=' i don tthink curt is that big into loyalty or staying where he is a legend, he wants to play for as long as he can, if he gets more years/more money somewhere else i have not doubt he will take it, this isnt arroyo we are talking about, there will be no hometown discount. IMO June is the real deadline unless he does s***** and then we wont bother resigning him anyway.[/quote']

 

Castigs, one of us will be right but I am not going to sweat it if it isn't me. I've repeated all along that I am a big Curt Schilling fan and always will be with one big stipulation----if he goes over to the Yankees. He would get on my s*** list quicker than fly ball off Pena's glove. Being an optimist and a romantic I tend to look at Schilling as a good guy, but sometimes I think I think a little like General Patton did. Maybe I belonged in a different century. Anyway, we'll see soon enough. Hope you're having a good weekend.

[exsubmariner]

Schilling will never go to the Yankees. As for the money, if you listened to what he said right after they turned down the one year extension for 13 million, the home town discount is gone. Schilling will go FA, he will get a 2 or maybe even a 3 year deal (probably 2 with an option year) and I'm willing to bet that the deal will not be met by the Sox. My prediction is to enjoy him this year because next year he will be playing somewhere else.

[a700hitter]

Good starting pitching is at a premium. There just aren't that many available. $13 million gets you a # 3 starter today. It would be a mistake to let Schilling walk for what will turn out to be a bargain price.

[SuperManny]

Good starting pitching is at a premium. There just aren't that many available. $13 million gets you a # 3 starter today. It would be a mistake to let Schilling walk for what will turn out to be a bargain price.

 

Unless he reverts back to 2005 or what he pitched like in the 2nd half of last year. The Sox have already planned for life after Schilling so him being around for one extra year isn't a concern for the FO. I think they're willing to overpay him for 1 year next year if he proves he still has it this year. There was no reason to sign him before this season to an extension at his age. The rotation already has 3 26 year olds as well as Lester and Buchholz being to step into the rotation next year.

[HeadOfSoxNation]

 

I didn't imply that Clemens can't have sentimentality, I implied that the Sox FO will not give him $20M plus for half a season base on sentimental reasons

 

Here...for each and every one of you...because it's obviously something that needs to be addressed YET AGAIN:

 

CLEMENS WILL NOT MAKE $20 MILLION FOR A HALF-SEASON. $20 MILLION IS A FIGURE BEING THROWN OUT BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE BESIDES ROGER CLEMENS SIGNS HALF-YEAR CONTRACTS. HIS CONTRACT WILL BE A PRO-RATED AMOUNT BASED UPON WHEN HE COMES BACK AND HOW MUCH HE PLAYS, BASED ON A FULL-YEAR SALARY OF ABOUT $20 MILLION.

 

Sorry for the size people...but how do some people just not get this?!?

[a700hitter]

Unless he reverts back to 2005 or what he pitched like in the 2nd half of last year. The Sox have already planned for life after Schilling so him being around for one extra year isn't a concern for the FO. I think they're willing to overpay him for 1 year next year if he proves he still has it this year. There was no reason to sign him before this season to an extension at his age. The rotation already has 3 26 year olds as well as Lester and Buchholz being to step into the rotation next year.

$13 million for one year is a worthwhile investment and gamble at this point. If they wait to see what he has and he performs like an ace or a solid # 2 the price will go up to 2 years $30 million. Look at what the Unit is getting from AZ coming off back surgery and he's 3 years older than Schilling. $13 million is a good price and a worthwhile gamble. the three 26 yr olds in the rotation have never struck out as many as 200 in a single year and only Beckett has won as many as 15 games in a season, so let's not get ahead of ourselves with these guys, and let's keep in mind that Bucholz and Lester are unproven quantities. If Schilling outshines this young staff and leaves the FO will have egg on its face once more. The market is what it is and bums like Lilly get long term contracts at $10 million/year. An aging Schilling is worth at least $13 million for one year. He's not going to be the Schilling of '05 because his ankle is healed. His problem has never been his arm.

[a700hitter]

He has looked very good this Spring. He's prepared to be the ace of the staff onced again. The FO should extend him before they come north.

[Mr Crunchy]

yet they continue to play f*** f*** and why??

why of all people must they dick around with him

 

i dont get it

i understand being careful prudent and wise

those things hold a lot of water when running a business

how this applies 90 days after spending 75M on drew 36M on lugo 100M on matusaka is the confusing part

 

never mind the DO THE RIGHT THING approach

never mind the fact that he can teach the staff full of youngsters how to prepare

never mind the fact that he is more loved here than the mayflower

 

simple economics from a competetive standpoint demand we sign this man today

[seabeachfred]

yet they continue to play f*** f*** and why??

why of all people must they dick around with him

 

i dont get it

i understand being careful prudent and wise

those things hold a lot of water when running a business

how this applies 90 days after spending 75M on drew 36M on lugo 100M on matusaka is the confusing part

 

never mind the DO THE RIGHT THING approach

never mind the fact that he can teach the staff full of youngsters how to prepare

never mind the fact that he is more loved here than the mayflower

 

simple economics from a competetive standpoint demand we sign this man today

 

Well said Crunch. At least there are a few of us around here who can see the forest from the trees. Schill is a special case and he brings the Red Sox a lot more than just a solid pitcher. His experience would be priceless to our young pitching staff and his popularity with fans will be enduring long after he stops pitching. Besides, I hark back to his putting his career on the line for his team while more notables like Damon, Petey, and Lowe took the money and ran like hell away from us.

[TheKilo]

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[a700hitter]

simple economics from a competetive standpoint demand we sign this man today

100 percent correct. If he does well, which I expect he will since he is healthy, his price will go up and he'll want more than 1 year. If his price goes up to high, they'll let him walk leaving a gaping hole in the rotation, and in the worst case scenario he walks to the Yanks making them stronger. There is almost no upside to waiting him out. The smart bet is to lock him in now at a reasonable cost.

[TheKilo]

Man has this topic been beat to death or what?

[ORS]

While I'm a proponent of them avoiding Helton's contract, I think the risk is minimal and they should extend him now. First of all, it's only a one year deal, and doing it now shuts the competition out. Second, I'm not that sure that Schilling is in deep regression. He's certainly not the power pitcher he was 5 years ago, but he's also changing his approach. Despite his weight, he works hard at his craft, and I don't have any doubts that he will be able to develop the feel and command for more pitches in his reportoire, like his new change up.

 

Plus, the guy put his career on the line and delivered the prize. I know, I know, they don't want to pay players for their past performance, but I don't think the risk of him tanking is all that great, and, sometimes, you need to make exceptions. If anyone is worthy of an exception, it's Curt.

[seabeachfred]

100 percent correct. If he does well' date=' which I expect he will since he is healthy, his price will go up and he'll want more than 1 year. If his price goes up to high, they'll let him walk leaving a gaping hole in the rotation, and in the worst case scenario he walks to the Yanks making them stronger. There is almost no upside to waiting him out. The smart bet is to lock him in now at a reasonable cost.[/quote']

 

You guys are too young to remember, but the Kingston Triio had a big hit early in 1962 called "Where Have All The Flowers Gone". The last words should be heeded by the Red Sox powers-that-be but never seem to.

 

WHEN WILL THEY EVER LEARN; WHEN WILL THEY EVER LEARN??????

[seabeachfred]

While I'm a proponent of them avoiding Helton's contract, I think the risk is minimal and they should extend him now. First of all, it's only a one year deal, and doing it now shuts the competition out. Second, I'm not that sure that Schilling is in deep regression. He's certainly not the power pitcher he was 5 years ago, but he's also changing his approach. Despite his weight, he works hard at his craft, and I don't have any doubts that he will be able to develop the feel and command for more pitches in his reportoire, like his new change up.

 

Plus, the guy put his career on the line and delivered the prize. I know, I know, they don't want to pay players for their past performance, but I don't think the risk of him tanking is all that great, and, sometimes, you need to make exceptions. If anyone is worthy of an exception, it's Curt.

 

My God, the sky is falling--we actually agree on something for a change. Thanks for coming over to the bright side. Wasn't Dice-K simply lights out this afternoon? There, something else we can agree on. When it comes to Schilling, though, he has all the get out of jail cards from me that he will ever need.

[BSN07]

If we didn't do it for Pedro, then where not doing it for Schilling...

 

We owe Schilling NOTHING, we payed him for him helping bring a WS to Boston, thats why he was under contract last year, his option was vested when they won it all.

 

He will stay in Boston, his f***ing game company is called like Green Monster gaming or some s***, He wants to stay people. He was just trying to get a couple more years guranteed without having to proove himself. He knew the chances of that were very small and, and now him saying he will hit FA is his last bit of leverage to try and get his year extension. It didn't work and now he knows he has to proove himself. Although he could have thought the Sox would give him a yr extension because he is so popular in Boston, thats probably why he came to camp looking 8 months pregnant.

 

As much as everyone hates to hear it, this is a buisness choice And a smart one, you don't allocate big money on a player when your not sure if he is worth it. If the f***ing Yankees won't give MO a contract before the season( this man might be the biggest part of all the championships season and division titles) then nobody should get one. His case is alot like Schillings, both had decent seasons last yr but both are injury risks and there skills could possibly see a sharp decline soon.

[exsubmariner]

If we didn't do it for Pedro, then where not doing it for Schilling...

 

We owe Schilling NOTHING, we payed him for him helping bring a WS to Boston, thats why he was under contract last year, his option was vested when they won it all.

 

He will stay in Boston, his f***ing game company is called like Green Monster gaming or some s***, He wants to stay people. He was just trying to get a couple more years guranteed without having to proove himself. He knew the chances of that were very small and, and now him saying he will hit FA is his last bit of leverage to try and get his year extension. It didn't work and now he knows he has to proove himself. Although he could have thought the Sox would give him a yr extension because he is so popular in Boston, thats probably why he came to camp looking 8 months pregnant.

 

As much as everyone hates to hear it, this is a buisness choice And a smart one, you don't allocate big money on a player when your not sure if he is worth it. If the f***ing Yankees won't give MO a contract before the season( this man might be the biggest part of all the championships season and division titles) then nobody should get one. His case is alot like Schillings, both had decent seasons last yr but both are injury risks and there skills could possibly see a sharp decline soon.

 

 

First off Pedro was a bigger risk then Schilling is as far as injury

 

Second - If Schilling goes 16-7 with a 4.00 ERA, what do you think he will bring on the open market? 15 mil? 16 mil?

 

Third - 38 videos will have no bearing on staying with the Sox.

 

Expect Schilling to be offered by some team 16 mil a year with an option for a third year and expect the Sox to say good bye.

[jacksonianmarch]

First off Pedro was a bigger risk then Schilling is as far as injury

 

Second - If Schilling goes 16-7 with a 4.00 ERA, what do you think he will bring on the open market? 15 mil? 16 mil?

 

Third - 38 videos will have no bearing on staying with the Sox.

 

Expect Schilling to be offered by some team 16 mil a year with an option for a third year and expect the Sox to say good bye.

 

good post.

 

I consider the Schilling scenario over. Unless something changes drastically, he is gone. Think about it. If he has a s***** yr, the sox wont want him. If he has an average to solid yr, he will get a multiyr deal from an NL team. I think the sox want to go with a young core and if Buchholz handles AA and Lester is strong in AAA, then you will see the "big three" of this yr mixed with Lester and Buchholz to have a rather young starting 5.

[MANNYHOF24]

good post.

 

I consider the Schilling scenario over. Unless something changes drastically, he is gone. Think about it. If he has a s***** yr, the sox wont want him. If he has an average to solid yr, he will get a multiyr deal from an NL team. I think the sox want to go with a young core and if Buchholz handles AA and Lester is strong in AAA, then you will see the "big three" of this yr mixed with Lester and Buchholz to have a rather young starting 5.

 

If he has a good year he will be back. He will be 41 years old, do you really think he will want to move his famiy again? No, Schill is pitching with us next year if he pitches well. It is not about money anymore either, at this point in his career is their a big difference between 13-14 million to 15-16. He has made enough money. He will also want to go out on top, and he knows the redsox can help him do that.

[jacksonianmarch]

If he has a good year he will be back. He will be 41 years old' date=' do you really think he will want to move his famiy again? No, Schill is pitching with us next year if he pitches well. It is not about money anymore either, at this point in his career is their a big difference between 13-14 million to 15-16. He has made enough money. He will also want to go out on top, and he knows the redsox can help him do that.[/quote']

 

so can the Mets who would salivate at the thought of having a finally healthy Pedro and even an aging Schilling to go along with the maturation of their kids in Humber and Pelfrey.

[MANNYHOF24]

Schilling wants to stay. What do you not understand about that? He loves the fans and the city. Why would he leave if the sox made him a good offer?

[jacksonianmarch]

I think you are being a tad naive here.

[Mr Crunchy]

Schilling wants to stay. What do you not understand about that? He loves the fans and the city. Why would he leave if the sox made him a good offer?

 

ya right

if history has taught us anything its that pro athletes and this ownership group are loyal to 1 thing

money

 

he will play this lack of respect card just as clemens did just as mo vaughn did just as damon and petey did and he will go to the highest bidder in november

thats the reality

 

the cardinals sign him next year

watch