Papelbon shut down for rest of season; his thoughts on 07

[riverside sluggers]

Paps is done, looks at starting next season

By Gordon Edes, Globe Staff

Red Sox closer Jonathan Papelbon said today that he feels great, but plans to err on the side of caution -- he cited Francisco Liriano of the Twins as an example of the perils that can befall a young pitcher -- and shut it down for the rest of the season.

 

He also indicated that he expects to return next season as a starter, although manager Terry Francona said that decision hasn't been made yet.

 

Asked if it was his mindset to come back as a starter next season, he said: "Yes, I would think so."

[example1]

It will be interesting to see how the sox prepare to have Paps be a starter. He's SO good as a closer.

[jsinger121]

no surprise there.....example he prepared for 2006 as a starter and became the closer out of need.

[example1]

no surprise there.....example he prepared for 2006 as a starter and became the closer out of need.

 

 

I'm aware dude. C'mon, I watched EVERY inning of EVERY start he made last year.

 

What I was saying is that this implies that they will need to get a closer who can replicate his production. I'm unsure of who that could be.

[jsinger121]

Brad Lidge could be available through trade and Eric Gagne is a FA who I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on.

[example1]

Brad Lidge could be available through trade and Eric Gagne is a FA who I wouldn't mind taking a flyer on.

 

Both of them please! Is there a ready closer for the 'Stros that would make Lidge's departure appear immenant?

 

Lidge would be sufficient as a CP replacement. However, I hope that moving Papelbon to the rotation is not supposed to be seen as a big SP acquisition. I hope he slides right in and they pick up another #1 or #2 caliber starter. I don't think Paps will be nearly as dominant as a SP, though he will be a high quality #3 I think.

[Anuj09]

Good, after what happened to Liriano i would not use Papelbon and let him recover more as for closing - how about giving Hansen, DC, or breslow a shot at closing out a game once in a while I mean they cant be worse than Timilin can they ??

 

as for Paps starting - hellllllll yah he was brought up as a starter and starter he should be and i really HATE the idea of having Jason Schmidt, an N.L pitcher who will no doubt demand way too much money same with Zito. This japanese player i heard about seems like an excellent idea

 

07 rotation (in no particular order)

Schill

Becket

Paps

Wake

Japanes guy (sorry to discriminate but i dont know how to spell his name

[riverside sluggers]

Its Matsuzaka

 

About Schmidt, believe me he wont get even close to Zito type money (5+ years/70+ million). Expect Schmidt to get something like a contract comparable to AJ Burnett's. Zito is likely to go to one of 3 teams (Yankees, Mets, Cardinals)

 

Id like to see Gil Meche added, only if Sox are unable to get anything going with Matsuzaka or Schmidt

[CrespoBlows]

Japanes guy (sorry to discriminate but i dont know how to spell his name

 

You indicated that the guy was Japanese, which he is. How exactly is that discrimination?

[Anuj09]

hmmm good point just didnt want to sound rude and refer to him as 'the japanese guy' :dunno:

[Jon_Papelboner]

Makes sense. The next meaningful game for the sox will be in april. No need to risk further injury.

[Cityofchampions33]

Both of them please! Is there a ready closer for the 'Stros that would make Lidge's departure appear immenant?

 

Lidge would be sufficient as a CP replacement. However, I hope that moving Papelbon to the rotation is not supposed to be seen as a big SP acquisition. I hope he slides right in and they pick up another #1 or #2 caliber starter. I don't think Paps will be nearly as dominant as a SP, though he will be a high quality #3 I think.

 

I wouldnt trust Lidge at all, he was horrible in the NL, i doubt hed improve comign into a league ehs not familiar with. As for who'd I get, Id want TIM WAKEFIELD as our closer, so long as Tek elarns to catch the knuck. Id love to get Matsuzaka, as he throws everything hard, is hard to pick up on, and has crazy movement. Shcmidt would be good, he seems liek anotehr dirt dog type of guy, and I think has some good years left.

 

Schilling

Beckett

Schmidt

Papelbon

Matsuzaka

 

That is an insane rotation with Matsuzaka as our 5th.

[Ray10]

It's going to be hard to move Papelbon to a starter role because of the fact that there is none who can close like Papelbon that the Sox have in the Pen currently. Foulke can't do it he's shown that he's not the same old closer he used to be. And Timlin has shown that he struggles to close out games. So I wouldn't be too surprised if the Sox don't move Papelbon to the rotation and keep him in the Closer role.

[Anuj09]

i doubt we will really know until spring training though

[a700hitter]

It's going to be hard to move Papelbon to a starter role because of the fact that there is none who can close like Papelbon that the Sox have in the Pen currently. Foulke can't do it he's shown that he's not the same old closer he used to be. And Timlin has shown that he struggles to close out games. So I wouldn't be too surprised if the Sox don't move Papelbon to the rotation and keep him in the Closer role.

Never mind that there is no one in the Boston pen that can close like Papelbon, there are few in the game that can close like him. He was having an historic season. He's starting his career much the same way that Mo did, although Mo pitched his first season as a set up guy. Let's not forget that Mo had been a starter when he arrived in NY. After they saw him in the late innings, they would have done the rest of the league a favor if they had moved him back to starter. How history would have changed. Papelbon is not just a good closer or a very good closer. He's a lights out guy. They are really hard to find. If they can have him close for 10 years, it will make the managers life very easy. There is no guaranty that he will be anywhere as dominant as a starter.

[jsinger121]

I am all for this. The red sox can regulate his workload by doing this. His arm is too valuable to pitch in the pen and with Lester's uncertainty they need him in the rotation.

[a700hitter]

In adddition to needing great stuff to accomplish what he did this year, you also need a closer's mentality. If he's going to be as effective as a starter he'll need to refine his breaking pitch. Also, his closer's mentality, which is as tough as I have seen, will be lost with him in the rotation as he is unlikely to finish any games. I think we may all be bitching and moaning when he looks like Beckett as a starter and we have some average or better than average closer giving us 9th inning heart attacks.

[a700hitter]

From today's Globe, Theo tells Edes that if it were not for health concerns he would be inclined to leave him in the closer's role. This makes perfect sense, because the kid established himself as a big time major league closer. He could set the standard for closers for the next 10 years like Mo did for the last 10. There is no guarantee that he will be a dominant starter.

 

Epstein was not ready to say that decision has been made, but he said that if health issues were not involved, the inclination would be to keep him as closer.

[MC Hammer]

From today's Globe' date=' Theo tells Edes that if it were not for health concerns he would be inclined to leave him in the closer's role. This makes perfect sense, because the kid established himself as a big time major league closer. He could set the standard for closers for the next 10 years like Mo did for the last 10. There is no guarantee that he will be a dominant starter.[/quote']

Thank you. I've been saying that all season.

[a700hitter]

Thank you. I've been saying that all season.

Well, apparently Theo agrees with us. Let's hope the medical staff agrees, but the kid seems psyched to go back to starting.:dunno:

[MC Hammer]

Well' date=' apparently Theo agrees with us. Let's hope the medical staff agrees, but the kid seems psyched to go back to starting.:dunno:[/quote']

Well, it really doesn't matter what he wants. Manny wanted to play for a different team for the last 5 years ... you don't see us giving him what he wants

[ORS]

I can't believe how reactionary you guys are about this. It is extremely valuable to have a shut-down closer, that is without question. A front-line starter is more valuable. They know they have the former with Papelbon, but they could also have the latter. I think it's important to determine if that is the case. In the end, if it isn't, he can always go back to closing, you know?

[MC Hammer]

I can't believe how reactionary you guys are about this. It is extremely valuable to have a shut-down closer' date=' that is without question. A front-line starter is more valuable. They know they have the former with Papelbon, but they could also have the latter. I think it's important to determine if that is the case. In the end, if it isn't, he can always go back to closing, you know?[/quote']

Right he could just go back to closing after starting for a full season, and just ... ya know completely destroy his arm. Sounds like a good idea.

 

If you have a great car you don't try to turn it into a great motorcycle ... you buy a f***ing motorcycle.

[AirPantapas]

Can he be a pitcher capable of 3.00era,200k's, 20game winner. I think he can

[MC Hammer]

Can he be a pitcher capable of 3.00era' date='200k's, 20game winner. I think he can[/quote']

Right but we know he's capable of a 1.00 ERA 75K and 35 saves.

[a700hitter]

I can't believe how reactionary you guys are about this. It is extremely valuable to have a shut-down closer' date=' that is without question. A front-line starter is more valuable. They know they have the former with Papelbon, but they could also have the latter. I think it's important to determine if that is the case. In the end, if it isn't, he can always go back to closing, you know?[/quote']As you point out, they don't know if he is a front-line starter. If it doesn't work out, you have essentially weakened two positions. There is no closer that can replace Papelbon, and relying on him as a starter will prevent the FO from going out and getting an established starter. If it doesn't work out, it could severely damage the chances of the 2007 team. What I don't understand is why this move would be made for any reason other than health concerns. It's not like we have two top closers, so that it would make sense to move one of them to the rotation. We have one superb closer but we need starters. Why not go out and get proven starters and leave the superb closer in place. If they move him to the rotation, they don't know what they are getting, and they will have to go out and get a lesser closer. It just doesn't make sense to me except for the health aspect.

[a700hitter]

Can he be a pitcher capable of 3.00era' date='200k's, 20game winner. I think he can[/quote']

You think he can, but no one knows. We know he is a shut down closer that will save 35+ games. Many great relievers couldn't start, e.g. Goose Gossage, Keith Foulke among others.

[MC Hammer]

As you point out' date=' they don't know if he is a front-line starter. If it doesn't work out, you have essentially weakened two positions. There is no closer that can replace Papelbon, and relying on him as a starter will prevent the FO from going out and getting an established starter. If it doesn't work out, it could severely damage the chances of the 2007 team. What I don't understand is why this move would be made for any reason other than health concerns. It's not like we have two top closers, so that it would make sense to move one of them to the rotation. We have one superb closer but we need starters. Why not go out and get proven starters and leave the superb closer in place. If they move him to the rotation, they don't know what they are getting, and they will have to go out and get a lesser closer. It just doesn't make sense to me except for the health aspect.[/quote']

If you ask me I think it's far more dangerous, health wise, to turn him back into a starter. We got a closer, turned him into a starter, let him start, took that starter and made him back into a closer, let him close, and now we intend to take that closer and make him back into a starter?

 

That has destroyed arm written all over it.

[riverside sluggers]

Many great relievers couldn't start' date=' e.g. Goose Gossage, Keith Foulke among others.[/quote']

 

Mariano Rivera

[ORS]

Right he could just go back to closing after starting for a full season, and just ... ya know completely destroy his arm. Sounds like a good idea.

 

If you have a great car you don't try to turn it into a great motorcycle ... you buy a f***ing motorcycle.

 

If you ask me I think it's far more dangerous, health wise, to turn him back into a starter. We got a closer, turned him into a starter, let him start, took that starter and made him back into a closer, let him close, and now we intend to take that closer and make him back into a starter?

 

That has destroyed arm written all over it.

Good thing no one asks you, because you are wrong. Arm usage is more easily controlled and monitored as a starting pitcher. Relievers go in when the leverage is high, which could be several days in a row, and they tend to overthrow because of the leverage of the spots they go in. If health concern is a factor at all, expect him to be a SP. Put that in your motocycle and smoke it.