moonslav59

I agree. We may hold onto Price and Eovaldi, in hopes they show health and progress, then trade them. Sale, maybe the same. We could even trade JD, and if we have to pay part of his salary, it won't be as much as the 3 pitchers would be. We keep Devers, Bogey, beni, vaz & ERod. All others could be offered, if the rebuild will be full.

Keon Broxton was waived this year. He hit .469 after the trade. If you think we'll have to give up a lot to trade for him, I can't argue anything more. Funny how his weak hitting is okay with you, but Hamilton's is not. You neglect Dyson who is a FA this year, and had a DWAR of 0.9 and 0.7 the last two years (cumulative stats with less innings than JBJ). He will not get $9-11M at 35 years old. He is as good a defender as JBJ. Billy Hamilton was waived this year. You think he'll make big bucks this winter? His mutual option hasd a $1M buy out. No way the Braves pay him $7.5M, but keep believing they will, so you can make your point. Hamilton's career OPS: .623. He turned 29 today. Dyson's career OPS is .660. He turned 35 just a few days ago. Leony's Martin does have a -0.3 dWAR this year, but it was 1.3 last year, which is almost as much as JBJ's 2018+2019 dWAR. He's a career .668 hitter and turns 32 in March. He was released by the Guardians this year. Okay, maybe Lagares won't be available, but here are 3 guys with an OPS between 50-100 lower than JBJ. All are equal or better fielders. All cost way, way less. We aren't winning. next year, so why care about a 75 point drop in CF OPS- maybe? JBJ's career OPS is .725, and he turns 30 next April.

I didn't say "everywhere." I specifically said with an offense near .600. There are 3+ names that will clearly be available for way less money, and if traded for, should cost peanuts. My point was ONLY about defense. Plus, why is dWAR the only evidence you use? JBJ's dWAR is just 0.8, this year and was 0.4 his GG year.

A look at the numbers: UZR/150 17.1 0.2 8.1 3.5 8.8 -0.1 DRS 15 3 11 10 -2 4 OPS .617 .531 .832 .835 .726 .717 .730 He turns 30 in about 7 months. I don't expect his defense to decline, too much, but it might decline some (more). He seems to have leveled off at about .720-.730, but that may decline. I'm thinking $15M/3 is about the best offer he might get as a FA this winter (which he's not).

The ole' ACO!

When you outspend every other owner by more than $20M for 3 straight years, I'd expect more, too. The broken farm is the final straw. 3 division wins and a ring less than a year ago was not enough to save his job. Ben had a worse track record but had a very strong farm. That's the difference maker, to me. If you are going to sell out the future for the now, I think Henry expected the "now" to last longer.

It was the strongest tornado in MA history. Maybe shorten to Poly-Techs and it might work. Modify Cousy to Koozees and maybe...

My bad. That was so non PC!

Coffee boy.

Even if he'd take $15M/3, I doubt we'd do it. (I would, if we could still find a way to reset in 2020.)

The "Paw Sox" are moving to Worcester in 2021. Should they be named "Sauce"? How about the "Worcester Limburgers?" Worcester Nipmucs? (Tribe that founded the place) Cupids? (Center of Valentine cards) Thumping Hearts? (See above) Monkey Wrenches? (Invented there) Wired? (Wire production) Power Looms? (production center)

Trends change, and the teams built for the previous trend often are ill-equipped for the next one.

Love the BB rate of late.

He was obviously blamed, but he's also more to blame than Cora. We "can't fire the players," or so they say, although we did it twice in the past decade. I don't think Henry trusted DD to hire the right GM or to not meddle with a new GM.

If you trade the farm, they don't count as being a strong farm. Has Theo added top farm pieces after the Cubs started winning and got lower draft picks? We need a GM who can draft well without a top 10 pick PLUS know how to develop pitchers while in the farm (or hire someone who can).

I'm the guy predicting we offer him arb and trade him or trade him before arb offers.

He's still in single A. I know we have roster space for him, but if nobody will put him on their 25 man roster all year, he may not be protected. Plus, he was ranked like 40th in the Sox system- a weak system- before his end of year surge.

We all were laughing, but not about the spending.

My list was long and included some worse but still plus UZR players as requested. I never said all were elite defenders, but you only mentioned 3. There are clearly 3 or more elite defenders acailable at less than half JBJs cost

I said some were not free agents, but the ones that aren't will likely be available for cheap. Most were demoted, traded or benched last year. As for Lagares' mutual option. Its's not a player option. He's not making anywhere near $5M next year.

Yes, unless we dismantle some (doubful). I am not predicting a last place finish. I looks like us cliff dwellers may be wrong as much as those who denied a down time will be coming soon.

I'm guessing you are right, but maybe the next GM is Jackie Bradley Sr.

It's hard to estimate salaries for FAs, but it's pretty safe to say some will be 1/3 or less the cost of JBJ's arb estimate of $9.5 to $11M. Here are the 3 year UZR/150 numbers of some guys mentioned with their ranking listed among the 57 CF'ers with 800+ innings in CF that are FAs or maybe available through trade: 5. Hamilton 10.0 (double JBJ's UZR/150) 8. Lagares 8.7 9. Dyson 8.3 12. K Broxton 6.5 13. L Martin 6.2 15. M Margot 5.3 16. JBJ 4.9 18. DeShields 4.3 21. T Pham 3.0 28. Maybin 0.2 DRS 5. Hamilton 23 7. Margot 19 9. Lagares 18 (almost 1.3 the innings as JBJ) 10. DeShields 18 12. Dyson 17 (half the innings as JBJ) 14. JBJ 12 18. K Broxton 7 (half the innings) 19. L Martin 7 (almost 1/3)

I agree. It might be a very short list- maybe even no list but just 1 guy. I trust Henry.

The next GM chapter begins. Who will it be? At least firing DD now gives us the time to choose from everyone available or coming available. I hate that many of the deals are made during the playoffs, so actually not being in them, gives us more leeway. Whoever we get, I hope he's an expert in farm building.