moonslav59

That's the general idea of trading prospects to improve the current 26 man roster. Knowing Bloom, he'd have traded Mayer for someone who got hurt or declined, suddenly. Choosing the right major players has not been his strong suit. His near miss on Eflin might be the closest he ever got to adding a high quality player that did well, afterwards.

I said DD did not trade any top prospects after the Sale trade. If you want to count #6 Beeks for Nate in the summer of 2018, then he did not trade any after the summer of 2018, despite not signing anyone to take Kimbrell or Kelly's spots in the pen. I see this as an indication that a change had occurred in the team's top priority, even before Bloom arrived. It is a theory. I feel DD probably wanted to trade for a closer. Before the deadline in 2019, he apparently came close to trading Betts & Price, so yes, I think a change occurred during DD's last year or 1.5 years. You are free to disagree. As for the farm vs the big club trade-off, it's not clear the big club has always been the top priority. Just because you think it should be, doesn't mean it was. Note: I'm not saying the big club was priority #2 or #3. It's hard to know what the plan was, or if the plan changed over the years. I'm just saying, I think the farm and 40 man roster depth was the first priority under Blooms first 2-3 years, and maybe all years. I also think that priority became #1 during DD's last 1 to 1.5 years with the Sox. It may or may not have been a source in the friction between him and and Kennedy/JH- whoever, that ultimately led to his leaving. It's my opinion, and I do think some events that happened and stopped happening support my theory.

I explained my position more fully as a stab at answering a vague question. Yes, WTH. Did I answer sufficiently for you?

I'd prefer he play RF, so it might take signing him and trading Dugo. That may also lessen the overall budget hit, so more can be spent on pitching. LF: Duran & Refsnyder (Yoshida) CF: Rafaela & Abreu (Duvall) RF: Duvall & Abreu (Refsnyder)

I'd be fine with him saying it, if it happens!

Certainly, there is a chance big prospects could have been traded, but chose not to, or came close but blew it or chickened out. I'm not trying to make excuses for Bloom. The only thing I really like about Bloom is his apparent building up of the farm and 40 man roster depth. Had he traded top prospects, that part might look worse, and know him, he might have blown such a trade. This is not about making Bloom look better. It's about why I think no top prospects were traded by DD or Bloom for 6 years. 2 GMs: one owner.

I have said, I think Bloom may have been told not to trade top prospects or to try hard to avoid it, in so many words. I have clearly said, it was just my opinion, and that the fact that no top prospects were traded by DD, in his last 2 years, shows there seemed to be a sea change in that area from the 13 months up to the Sale trade. I do not think it's some wild theory to think the organization made farm building the top or one of the top priorities of the organization from the end of 2018 to now, or at least 2019 to 2023. It's just a theory, and I have never stated it as fact.

My position that the no top prospect trades guideline or mandate was never meant as any sort of excuse for Bloom, anymore than it was one for DD's last 2 years. I was actually okay with the idea until this past winter and offseason, so I'm not excuse making. I liked the idea, until I felt we were close enough to make the jump.

I have no idea what your question means or how it relates to the point I made. IMO, upper management did not want us to trade away top prospects after the Sale trade. Whether it was a firm mandate, a strong guideline or just a suggestion is unknown. Maybe they didn't care, at all. We did make several vet for prospect deals. Almost all of our trade for a vet, included a prospect with them (Wong with Betts, Seabold w Pivetta, German w Ottavino, DHam w JBJ, Rosier w Hosmer....) Although this is a separate issue, is does point to the idea that building up the farm was a high priority- perhaps more so than building up the 26 man roster. It could just be a general top priority to build up the farm, and Bloom took that to an extreme that JH did not demand.

Duvall may have to be the one, unless we trade for one.

Sox 2023 WAR leaders: fWAR Crawford 2.4 C Sale 2.1 Pivetta 1.9 B Bello 1.6 Martin 1.5 Houck 1.2 Jansen 1.1 Paxton 1.0 0.8 Whitlock 0.8 Winckowski 0.7 Bernardino 0.4 Murphy 0.1 Schreiber bWAR 3.2 Martin 3.1 Bello 2.5 Crawford 2.4 Pivetta 1.9 Wink 1.7 Sale 1.3 Bernardino & Houck 1.1 Paxton 0.8 Schreiber 0.7 Jansen ... 0.2 Whitlokc ... 0.1 Murphy fWAR + bWAR/2 2.5 Crawford 2.4 Bello 2.2 Pivetta 2.4 Martin 1.9 Sale 1.4 Winckowski 1.3 Houck 1.1 Paxton 1.0 Bernardino 0.9 Jansen 0.5 Whitlock & Schreiber 0.3 Murphy Everyday Players bWAR + fWAR/2: 3.3 Devers 2.3 Dugo 2.3 Duran 2.0 Casas 1.7 Duvall 1.7 Turner 1.4 Wong 1.0 Yoshida 0.7 Abreu (28 gms) 0.5 Story (43 gms) 0.5 Reyes (64 gms) 0.4 Tapia (39 gms) 0.3 Refsnyder (89 gms) 0.2 Chang (39 gms) 0.2 EValdez (49 gms) 0.1 McGuire (72 gms) 0.1 urias (32 gms) 0.1 Rafaela (28 gms) -0.3 Arroyo (66 gms) -1.1 Kike (86 gms)

I know we won't sign 3 SP'ers, unless Breslow is a miracle worker. We'll be lucky to see us add 2 high quality SP'ers, this winter, despite seeming to have the funds and trade capital to pull it off, while still signing a big RH'd bat. Let's see what Breslow can do! I'm hoping for a big sea change, but will believe it when I see it.

There is no evidence to say he wasn't told, either. You state this as a "fact." I stated mine as an opinion, and have often agreed, there is no evidence to support it, OR NOT.

No, there isn't. You are right. It might have been all Bloom's call. They rarely made trades like that in TB, so maybe that was just "his thing." One aspect does kind of support the idea that it might have been a directive or "strong guideline" put in place by higher ups: DD stopped trading top prospects after the Sale trade. If you want to count the #6 Beeks for Nate at the 2018 deadline, then it stopped after that. I'm pretty sure DD probably wanted to replace Kimbrell and Kelly after 2018, and the budget seemed to be frozen, so my guess is, he wanted to make a trade but did not. Just a guess. It fits DD's profile. No proof. Not making any major prospect trades for the last 2 years of DD's regime seems telling, to me, but it's just an opinion. The Sale trade was Dec 2016- almost 8 years ago! The biggest trades since then? #6 Beeks for Nate- summer '18 #9 Aldo Ramirez for Schwarber- summer '21 I'm curious, if Breslow will pull the trigger on a big prospect trade, or not.

I'd like to see their pecking order list, before any turndowns. Maybe Breslow was always near the top: maybe not.

fWARs 6.0 Carroll 4.2 Marte 3.8 Walker 2.7 Perdomo 2.1 Gurriel 1.7 Moreno (in just 380 PAs) (The next was 0.6) Pitching 5.2 Gallen 3.2 Kelly 1.3 Ginkel 0.8 Davies 3 @ 0.7

SEA missed the dance with 88 wins. They had one more win than MIN, who played a much easier schedule, too.

AZ had a -15 run differential and an xW-L record of 80-82, according to MLB.com. (The Sox were at 81-81 as a reference point.) They were helped by having two top pitchers: 34 GS Gallen 3.47 ERA (125 ERA+) 30 GS Kelly 3.29 ERA (132) But... WOW! The rest of their SP'ing sucked 27 GS Nelson 5.31 (82 ERA+) 18 GS Pfaat 5.72 (76) 18 GS Davies 7.00 (62) 17 GS Henry 4.15 (105) As a whole, the rotation ended up at 4.67 with a 1.34 WHIP and a .766 OPSA. The Sox rotation finished at 4.68, 1.29 and .766- almost identical, but with worse D behind them. Go figure!

Wait until it's 16!

It's hard to know how good of a hire Breslow is. It's nice to know he worked under Theo and was hired or promoted 3 years in a row for the Cubs. His focus was on pitching, so let's hope that helps, especially in the developing aspect of the organization. We'll see if he changes the philosophy of not drafting pitchers too highly. I'm optimistic this will work out, but I really do not know enough to formulate an opinion, one way or another. I'm glad all the turmoil and talk about who will be our next "guy" is finally over. We have some serious flaws to fix. Let's hope upper management gives him the green light to do it quickly. This should not be the start of a 4 or 5 year plan. We just went through that. A pretty nice foundation is set up for Breslow, but we lack in star power numbers and have 3-5 gaping holes that need to be not just filled, but filled with 2-3 studs and 2-3 plus players. Good luck, Craig!

A few coaches are gone. We will have a few new faces on the '24 team. I think it's enough to change the culture of losing. Not much will matter, if we stay $10M below the tax line and don't allow a decent prospect to be traded.

So much for my anti-crapshoot crusade.

So, you like the move?

Agreed. I was just trying to say OF has a bunch of guys ahead of Anthony, so OF is not really more crowded than MI or Catcher. You are right, none are filled with someone we can't replace or move to another position. Mayer to SS> Story to 2B (or 3B- GASP!) Teel to C> McGuire gets traded and Wong is the #2. Anthony to CF or RF> We force out the lowest performer or move them to an easier OF position, like LF. (Refsnyder is an easy player to replace on the 26, despite his useful splits.)

Trade: (BTV Accepted) Mayer, Dugo & Dalbec for Jesus Luzardo (3 years of control via arbs. His 2024 arb estimate is $6M. Verdugo's in $9M) We save $3M and add a solid SP'er, while seriously downgrading our farm and Middle Infield depth. Sign: Sonny Gray to $26M x 5 (or Montgomery to $27M x 7) Charlie Morton $22M x 1 Adam Duvall to $9M x 2 I think this keeps us under tax line 1. C: Wong & McGuire 1B: Casas (Devers) 2B: Urias & Reyes SS: Story (Reyes) 3B: Devers (Urias) LF: Duran-Refnsyder platoon (Yoshida) CF: Rafaela & Abreu (Duran/Duvall) RF: Duvall (Abreu) DH: Yoshida (Devers/Casas) The D looks better. The O looks worse, unless Story can replace JT's bat. The pitchings looks like nails: SP1: Gray SP2: Morton SP3: Luzardo SP4: Bello SP5: Sale SP6/LR3: Pivetta (Drohan/Gambrell/Walter/Hagenman/Wikelman) LR1: Houck LR2: Crawford MR3: Whitlock MR4: Schreiber MR5: Winckowski (Bernardino/Murphy/Mata/Kelly/Mills) SR6: Martin SR7: Jansen NOTE to MVP: This is not what I think will happen.