Maxbialystock

Emp9: You're right. We (not me, but talksox overall) do know these players pretty well and possibly better than Cora. That said, I do like how Cora has handled this team in the first 5 games, including three 1-run wins. He's basically played everyone on the 25 man roster, including starting all 13 position players, even Swihart. That said, the biggest plus by far is the rotation, and most of the credit for those 5 starts redounds to the pitchers. Even there, however, he insisted on not overpitching Sale and Price in ST and limited their pitches in their first starts. I believe he is still evaluating everyone--as he should be.

Lots of excursions in this thread--all good. I do agree with the notion that managers make a difference during games. Yes, of course players make the biggest difference, but managers during games adjust fielders locations (shifts), signal baserunners, hitters, and sometimes pitches, use pinch hitters, and of course control who pitches and when. Where I part company with managerial critics is in the presumption that we know better than the managers. I did exactly that in game 1 when Kelly and Smith gave up 6 runs in the 8th, but upon reflection I decided Cora's decisions had a pretty good basis. Both are experienced relievers with a good array of pitches, but of course location is so critical every time a pitcher goes to the mound, and the manager can't be sure how that will hold up. Neither one that day had the right stuff, but even then it was a close call because we had two outs and a 4-2 lead before Denard tripled with the bases loaded. Kimbrel, our 8 figure closer, has pitched just two innings and gotten two saves. One was vintage Kimbrel and a dominant performance. The second was a tad precarious when he got the last out with the tying run on 2b and after he had given up a single and a walk. I also find it fascinating that, with all the acclaim for now five straight terrific starts (30 innings, 3 runs), few have acknowledged that Cora in all five games had to manage his bullpen through an average of 3 innings per game and that overall that has gone well--except for the disastrous 8th in game 1. Games 2, 3, and 4 were all 1-run wins, which to me means you need a decent bullpen and a manager who knows how to use it. Something else no one but me has pointed out is that in the first four games Cora used all 13 position players in the starting lineup, 4 of his starters, and all 7 relievers. In other words, to me the evidence to date is that Cora was a solid pick.

Miami split four the Cubs, so that can't be horrible. First time thru, our rotation has been astounding. Hitting seems to be picking up--we'll see. Fielding, while errorless, is at best average. Except for game 1, bullpen has been above average. Thoreau spent too much time with Walden.

That could work. Beni should maybe be even lower until he gets his swing back.

Lineup does good, but Johnson give up 2 quick singles in the 4th. Hmm.

Starting to like Johnson and really not like our putrid lineup--even though that Miami rookie seems to have pretty good stuff and pretty good command.

And a good bat by Betts, but followed by a terrible at bat by hitless Beni. Looks like bulking up might not have been the best thing for his hitting. Early days, however.

Hard to comment intelligently about those two starters, both largely unknown--about right for the 5th guys in the rotations. Richards was in AA ball last year and did well. So he's skipping a step. In the four game series at the Trop, Cora used all 13 position players, all of whom started at least one game. In addition to 4 starters, he used all 7 relievers. Can there be any doubt he wanted to see everyone play in games that counted? He also moved guys around in the batting order, but not a lot. And he let Kelly close a 2-1 game, which could well have taken a couple of months off his expected life span. Against a righty, I expect to see-- Betts Beni JD HanRam Bogaerts Devers Nunez JBJ Vazquez

I like great closers because we have seen some pretty good ones. They do make a difference. What's worth debating is how much they should be paid.

You think so? Joan Benoit won the first ever Olympics Marathon for women in 1984 after undergoing arthroscopic surgery a month before. Her time was 2:24:52, which would have won all men's Olympics marathons thru 1948. In 1952 her time would have been second only to the great Emil Zatopek. In 1956 her time would have gotten another gold model. The men only truly got better in 1960 when Abebe Bikila came in around 2:15. What women athletes do not lack is determination.

It was indisputably a bad call because there was just one out with the bases loaded at the moment Holt touched 3b. Plus the 3b coach gets to poach down the line to make the call at the last possible moment, which was when it became clear Holt would be in trouble.

Then you must have loved Girardi, who absolutely pulled relievers at the first sign of trouble.

I have said the same thing in the past. Why look for trouble when the one inning guy should be good for another?

Dead right. My six points apply only to the first 4 games. Hitting, baserunning, and especially the bullpen should straighten out. Rotation probably won't maintain their incredible performance so far. I think we all have doubts about our infield, but I hope it can be average in the field. Plus I already like 0 errors to date. The point was/is, Cora has done well to have us at 3-1.

Reading this thread reminds of the good old days when Terry Francona--let alone John Farrell--was personally responsible for every single loss. The players, not the manager, won those two WS. Ditto the one in 2013. Based on the available evidence--just 4 games--I think Cora has done a pretty good job. Here's what I've seen-- 1. 3-1 record, a game up on the Yankees. 2. Great rotation--I think 2 runs in 4 starts and 24 innings. 3. Rotten hitting, except Bogaerts. 4. Scary bullpen. Even Kimbrel had 2 guys on in one of his saves. Kelly and Smith, two seasoned professionals with good stuff, gave up 6 runs in the 8th inning for the 1 loss. Kelly came back and got a save, but one which depended way too much on Denard swinging at a pitch in the dirt which should have been ball four to load the bases in a 1 run game. Walden went 1.1 innings giving up 1 hit and 3 line drives, all of which were caught--scary. 5. So-so baserunning--Holt trying to score and out by at least five steps with the bases loaded (if he holds at 3b), 1 out, and Martinez coming to bat, Bogie doubled off first on a liner to the outfield, Betts picked off, Betts also CS, etc. 6. So-so fielding. The one really good play I remember was Betts chasing down a double to keep the runner on first from scoring the tying run yesterday. The infield has limited range. Vazquez doesn't like blocking pitches in the dirt. However, 0 errors in 4 games, which should count for something.

Actually, I come close to that. I follow one college basketball team, which starts fall practice in October and has their first game in November which rarely conflicts with the WS or, in the case of 2014-17, the ALDS. Come spring, March Madness rarely conflicts with the Sox regular season even when my team gets to the final four (last 2 years). What this also means, however, is that my blogging tends to be seasonal. I follow the Patriots and Celtics (of whom I once was a devoted fan, going back to the Bob Cousy era) only at a distance and the Bruins not at all.

Do not understand what took so long to throw a breaking ball. Before that changeup, 14 straight fast balls. Either Vazquez is calling the wrong pitches or the bench is. First two out, Kelly mixed in breaking balls, so, obviously, he was told to stop doing that.

Horrible call by the 3b coach sending Holt home with 1 out, a hard hit single to RF (strongest arm), and JD coming to bat.

The Trop is a dump and Rays fans have figured that out. But the players still have to play there. Bogaerts seems not to have understood the dictum that you can't hit in the trop--but the rest of the lineup has embraced that dictum.

Kimbrel, who did not pitch in game 1, has now saved the next two games, in both of which he was desperately needed. Cora did not, repeat, did not let that lead slip away. Check the box score. Kelly and Smith let it get away.

He plays him game 1, Kimbrel is not available for the two games he did save. You can’t manage the first game of the season likes it’s a playoff game. Right now Cora looks a whole lot smarter than the critics.

Short game thread. Sox must have won.

Next best thing. Look at the thread title and the number of pages. There is a palpable hunger for something that is hardly new to the Red Sox Nation. I believe we are on our 5th manager in the John Henry era--and 2 of the previous 4 actually managed WS winners. Of course, I personally believe that managers are for the most part hired to be fired and was OK with all four firings. Still . . .

Yup.

Page 8 of this discussion which is basically about one inning in the first game of a 162 game season. Could be a world land speed record for fastest lynching of a new manager.