Dipre

Leap in logic. Lee's had two bad games in around 12 playoff starts the last two years, and using the "his team didn't win the WS argument" is asinine. The Rangers didn't hit at all, so it's not his fault they won the WS (and the second game was a QS and he gave the team a chance to win) in the 2009 WS he single-handedly beat the Yankees twice, so what more did you want from him? Let's keep things in perspective, unless the roster contains 25 Cliff Lee's. By the way, hasn't Beckett gotten rocked the past two post-seasons he's been to while Lee has carried his team into the WS? Cliff Lee's playoff numbers: 10 GS, 2.13 ERA, 0.81 WHIP, 9.5 K/9, 0.8 BB/9, 10.0 BB/K. The whole "he's better but Beckett won two WS" argument is full of holes. Lee's the better pitcher in the regular season, post-season, winter leagues, and beer-league softball matchups. Now don't get me wrong, Beckett can (and should) rebound. He had an extreme case of bad luck with his peripherals (except BB/9) remaining in their usual ranges, but a BABIP near .400, however, at both their bests (performance and health-wise) Lee's the better pitcher and will continue to be the pitcher down the road barring injury.

Some pretty knowledgeable posters kinda look foolish now. Go through the thread, it's gold.

Sooooo.......who here still takes Beckett over Lee? Dojji? Kilo? Anyone?

And the dude wonders why i call him out on leaps in logic.... 2011 Manny is not in-his-prime Manny. Not even close on the level of production, and even worse, a full-time DH now. The talent's diminished, the ability to play the field is all but gone, yet he would be the missing piece for the Sox. He doesn't even fit into the roster. Wow.

First off, i think Varitek's offense is being underrated. He's an injury risk, but when healthy, he can still absolutely hammer lefties, and while i agree that his catching skills have diminished, he still offers an overall better package than Napoli (who also has a noodle arm and is a stone wall behind the plate). Now as a hitter and overall option against lefties, i never said i wouldn't rather have Napoli, but how do you realistically make that happen with all the moves that have been made? How do you fit him into payroll (he made 3.6 mill last year, and is arb elegible, so his receiving a raise is obvious)? Who do you trade for him? And is it worth the money and prospects it would take to acquire him to be a part-time catcher? It raises the questions of diminishing returns and the value of the overall package a player brings to the table when you can have someone who, while older, provides similar production at a fraction of the cost and without the cost of prospects or long-term commitment. Also, you just can't compare V-Mart to Napoli. V-Mart was a superior ballplayer to Napoli in absolutely every aspect of the game.

Except that Varitek can actually catch, makes little money, is a good mentor to Salty (probably main reason they brought him back) a number of Sox pitchers (Beckett mostly) feel comfortable pitching to him, and he doesn't cost prospects from an already depleted system.

I'll take Iglesias for $500 with Argenis Diaz and Yamaico Navarro as my safety picks. They're all Latin, and i'm Latin too, so it makes sense! I'd pick Scutaro, but his last name ain't Latin enough. Seriously though: Jed Lowrie: The only player with a career path similar to Jose Valentin without actually playing like Jose Valentin. I'd like to admit to the point that i'm just busting balls right now, but it absolutely baffles me how people think their ideas of personnel management are better than the FO's announced notions.

Wait, aren't you a fan of upside? Because Salty has the potential to become a better catcher on both sides of the ball than Napoli (remember how we argued last year that with regular playing time he wasn't as good a hitter as you pimped him out to be, and lo and behold, he played over 114 games for the first time in his career, had an OPS of .784 instead of the low .800 you suggested, and had a miserable .316 OBP to go with his horrendous defense at both catcher and first?), if you like potential on one player, why not like it on another one? At his worst, if healthy, Salty will be a better defender who gets on base more and makes contact on a more regular basis, and you sure like to contradict yourself, because that was exactly your argument for defending a possible Martin signing (and i agreed with you on that one) because OBP is where it's at, unless your power is absolutely marginal.

Newsflash: Mike Napoli can hit, but he sucks ass as catcher to the point where they play Jeff Mathis ahead of him. However, had they not gotten Gonzales he may have been a passable solution playing part-time DH and 1B, because his value is in his stick.

You think Iglesias is the future at Shortstop? Are you Dominican or something?

Team:Jed Lowrie The Mighty Morphin Flower Arranger C: Carlos Ruiz 1.9 MM 1B: Carlos Pena 10.12 MM 2B: Ian Kinsler $4 MM 3B: Aramis Ramirez 15.75 MM SS: Troy "Tulo" Tulowitzki 3.5 MM RF: Shin-Soo Choo 461 K CF: Desmond Jennings 400 K LF: Matt Holliday 17 MM DH: Colby Rasmus 418 K Bench: Bill Hall 8.4 Mill Bench: Reid Brignac 400 K Bench: Jose Tabata 418 K Bench: Greg Zaun 1.9 Mill Lineup (vs. Righties) 1. Ian Kinsler 2B ® 2. Sin Soo Choo RF (L) 3. Troy Tulowitzki SS ® 4. Carlos Pena 1B (L) 5. Matt Holliday LF ® 6. Colby Rasmus DH (L) 7. Aramis Ramirez 3B ® 8. Greg Zaun C (L) 9. Desmond Jennings CF ® Lineup (vs. Lefties) 1. Ian Kinsler 2B ® 2. Sin Soo Choo RF (L) 3. Troy Tulowitzki SS ® 4. Carlos Pena 1B (L) 5. Matt Holliday LF ® 6. Colby Rasmus DH (L) 7. Aramis Ramirez 3B ® 8. Carlos Ruiz C ® 9. Desmond Jennings CF ® Position Players: 64.4 million. Rotation 1. Justin Verlander 6.75 MM 2. Anibal Sanchez 1.25 MM 3. Brandon Morrow 409 K 4. Madison Bumgarner 400 K 5. Fausto Carmona 4.9 MM Bullpen 1. Cl Brian Wilson 4.43 MM CL 2. Soctt Downs 4.0 MM SU L 3. Bobby Jenks 5.6 MM SU R 4. Bobby Parnell 418 K MRP R 5. Daniel Sclereth 400 K MRP L 6. David Hernandez 418 K MRP R 7. Joel Pineiro 8.0 MM LRP R Pitchers: 31.2 million. Current payroll: 95.6/110 million used.

....just like Lowrie. But he gets a pass for being a "sexy beast" and lighting the world on fire on a SSS. Neither is a sure thing, and they should both be treated accordingly.

I'd kinda be a hypocrite if i didn't voice my concerns for Salty just like i do for Lowrie. See, the thing is that i'm a realist, and that pisses people (not directed at you) who see things through rosey-colored glasses. I always think about what's more productive for the team, not what player i have a boner for or what player i consider "sexy" (something i find wrong on many levels by the way). On Salty's case, just like Lowrie, he's yet to produce a full season of health or offensive consistency, therefore, there is reason for concern, and there is a need to ease the guy into the role that he's expected to fulfill.

Either that, or convert either Jed Lowrie or Daniel Nava to Catcher, seeing as they're both incredibly gifted athletes who are not affected by the injury bug and can do no wrong. "Sexy Beasts" if you know what i mean.

Well the way i see it, he can "fake it" against RHP, and it's better to put him in front of Drew, both to avoid having consecutive lefties, and to force pitchers to throw him FB's. Besides, every chain has its weak link.

Gonzo's superior in every aspect of offense to Ortiz right now. He should bat cleanup with Pedroia hitting third IMO.

Initial list (Alphabetical order): 1) a700 2) Dipre 3) Divinity 4) Exman 5) Flynnatic 6) Ital 7) Jacoby 8) JBay44 9) Keeper 10) RSFFL 11) Soxfan 12) Whiskeybreath 13) Wil617 14) Y228 15) Yankshater 16) YRTB Draft Order: Random Sequence Generator Here is your sequence: 1) 13: Wil617 2)3: Divinity 3)16: YRTB 4) 4: Exman 5) 2: Dipre 6)10: RSFFL 7)11: Soxfan 8) 1: a700 9)15: Yankshater 10)12: Whiskeybreath 11) 7: Jacoby 12) 9: Keeper 13)14: Y228 14) 8: JBay44 15) 5: Flynn 16) 6: Ital Timestamp: 2010-12-24 22:21:35 UTC Random number generator used: http://www.random.org/sequences/?min=1&max=16&col=1&format=html&rnd=new Good luck everyone!

First off, we'd be delighted to have you. (And by we, i mean specifically me, since i don't represent anyone else's opinions, but you get my drift). Anyways, teams will be evaluated using statistical analysis and evaluating overall roster construction (if you have a 2B playing SS for instance), and seeds will be granted, afterward, we will enter a head-to-head tournament with matchups, which will be determined by seed order, and more in-depth analysis of team-to-team matchup will be made, with the winner being decided by process of elimination. We will begin drafting Monday probably, and after a trade period will be granted, with Power Rankings being created on a monthly basis to ultimately decide the seeds and then finally entering the matchups after the season is done. Hope you have fun!

I'm ready to start this when you guys are, and i've even got the random generator going for the current teams, and if any others join, their draft numbers will be added on a first come, first serve basis, if that's okay with everyone else. All i'm waiting for is confirmation from the current signees and we can get the ball rolling on this thing. Also, great idea by Ital on setting up a parameter on the amount of pitchers and hitters (in the basis of roster construction).

And this is where your problems with reading comprehension stem from. I never argued that he would be given opportunities to take over the position, as i stated many times in before (and you conveniently ignore) it's not that he doesn't have the potential, it's that you both overstate his actual potential, and refuse to see the importance of sliding him into full-time duty slowly, i argued you using an incorrect comparison (Pedroia was the starting 2B in 2007, this was a given). He can be the starting SS, but he has to earn it, which in this post, you once again go to the "proven abilities" issue, and Lowrie has proved nothing, but will have a chance to prove himself this year. As i have said many times before, reality beckons. Try again, and this time argue what i actually say.

You know who i miss? Coco Crisp.