jacksonianmarch

This is what I think as well. Anyone with only a mild understanding of baseball could see that the sox needed at least one starter. The vaunted Red Sox pitching depth had crumbled to its foundation. Beckett and Lester keep putting up the valiant effort, but when you consistently suck in the 3-5 slot, you cannot win. It is that simple. And now, with DiceK on the way back, the sox might have a chance at righting the ship. Unfortunately for the sox, I do not think they do it in time to catch the streaking yankees. They do have a shot at the wild card. That being said, I think Theo pinned his 2009 hopes on the returns of Wake and DiceK. If they dont make it back, then the sox plan for 2010 is unchanged based on what they did this offseason. If they do, then the sox could make the playoffs this yr and go to a 3 man rotation. Theo has said before that you need to take some steps back before you take steps forward. Now, I dont think he ever intends on a full out rebuild. Not in the slightest. But I think he always puts his best foot forward and there is a limit to where he is willing to add onto the team during the season. In 2006, the sox imploded based on injury mostly. And instead of fixing 2 rotation spots and half the lineup at the deadline, he sat still and played it out. At the beginning of 2006, the sox team was considered a playoff team. Injuries robbed them of that. Rather than go crazy, he sat back, took the hit, then won the title the following yr with some FA acquisitions and with pretty much the same team, just better health. If DiceK can build off this season and get back to what he was in 07 and 08, the sox rotation becomes formidable again with the 3 headed monster of Beckett-Lester-DiceK. So for those who want a firesale, it wont be coming any time soon. I do guarantee the sox will make a FA splash this offseason and probably a trade nobody thought was coming. It is what they do. And I do bet that in 2010, the sox will be as formidable as always. That being said, there is a chance they regain their formidable status this yr too, depending on the health of the aged knuckler and the japanese pitcher.

New posters guys. Give them a chance. There are some forums that do this to every newb and before you know it, they become graveyards.

I agree with that sentiment to a point. If he signs this offseason, prior to hitting the FA market, he will be leaving a lot of money on the table. That is always the case. I also think he likes Boston. At the same time, I do not think he settles for less money. Guys of his ilk typically dont.

That's the same Gaudin. These are the kind of moves that have helped us in the past. Pick up guys with a history of some success who have fallen on bad times. Every now and then we hit when thrusting that player back in a pennant race. Aaron Small, Al Leiter and Shawn Chacon say hi. Regardless, he cannot be as bad as Smoltz or Mitre. That being said, I would actually approve of bringing Igawa back up. Why not. Can't be as bad as Mitre.

Also, Derek Lowe got 4 yrs 60 mil from the Braves at age 36. The Mets will be looking for pitching. The Angels will be looking for pitching. And the Dodgers are already looking for pitching. You are delusional if you think Beckett gets less than Burnett. Delusional

you dont think the yankees will be looking for a starter in 2011?

the market is coming up. Think about it. Tex, Burnett, and CC got market price for players at their level (plus the new york exchange fee of about 2 mil a yr more than anyone else would pay). Beckett hits FA after 2010, which will likely be a period of significant financial growth

OK, you know what? You know what? Gimme that thing! I'll do one, do one.

also, Beckett likes being "the man". And being underpaid is not what the man will be all about.

You are delusional if you think Beckett resigns for 12 mil per. Absolutely delusional. If you think about it, Beckett might have more of a claim to big money than CC. He's got two rings. Beckett is on his way to being in the running for a Cy Young. And, he's already been the ace on the team for 3 yrs. He will ask for the moon. He hits FA after his yr 30 season. He's gonna get a 6-8 yr deal and will definitely crack 20mil a yr. If Burnett gets 18 mil a yr after his age 32 season, you better believe Beckett will surpass that

I agree, that would be your best defense. But if you want to have someone who frames pitches well, you should trade for Molina RIGHT NOW

I don't know. I don't know if we'll have enough time.

Apparently Baldelli bruised his foot last night and they are using it as an excuse to DL him. Sounds like the sox are playing the DL a guy for no good reason game. It is surprising that Tito brings the kid back up, he's ready and raring to go and he sits him in favor of putting Youkilis in LF. Especially LF at the stadium, which is a massive expanse of real estate

yep, it is amazing how dumb reporters are. You would think that a guy whose sole job is to report on a sports team would actually be knowledgable about the sport itself. Kinda like with Steve Phillips most recent yankee-sox article. Anyone read it? It has two complete and glaring errors consistent with that idiot's thinking. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/notebook?page=bbtn Apparently Martinez is a 3b now too. I see I didnt know Tommy John surgery was the monicker for shoulder surgery as well? What an idiot

So, we are now a week into August and both of our teams are in desperate need of at least one starter. The sox have a plethora of rotation options, but their best 2 are in need of some luck and some health in Wakefield and DiceK. The Yankees thought they had depth as well as a solid starting 5, but the hole that Wang left (make pun here...) has yet to be filled. So where does that leave the two teams after this season seeing as we have enough problems in the rotation this yr.... First, seeing as I posted this in the yankee thread, lets start with NY. Assuming 5 starting spots in a rotation, we start off with... 1. Sabathia 2. Burnett 3. Chamberlain No problem, those three should be pencilled in for quite awhile in the top 3. The next guy to be pencilled in is Phil Hughes. Now there will be a caveat as there is with Joba this yr. Hughes will likely be limited to about 150IP in 2010. So, while Hughes would likely slot into a #4 position, his innings limit will relegate him to #5 duty. So, that leaves us with a #4 starter position open. Internal options outside of signing someone include.... 1. Ian Kennedy- coming off aneurysm surgery, who knows how strong he will be, but he was solid in AAA prior to his injury and I do think he could be a solid major leaguer one day, just not sure thats in NY. Also would be on a serious innings limit 2. Kei Igawa- BLEH (although I think Igawa sees the majors in 2009 at some point) 3. Sergio Mitre- Bigger BLEH 4. Zach McAllister- probably our best pitcher in the minors, problem being, he has missed a month with tired arm, so tough to decipher. 5. Ivan Nova- in AAA now and doing okay, although I think he is not a big league starter, rather a reliever. 6. Alfredo Aceves- good idea aside from the fact that his versatility in the bullpen may be the crux of our relief corps and moving him out of there would cause serious problems going forward. 7. Chien Ming Wang- yes, I have him as the #7 option. He never was right after the foot injury and his weak lower body led to an upper body injury. No word on what the shoulder looked like, but anytime you mix shoulder surgery in with weak lower body and a rumor of lack of work ethic, then you could have a train wreck coming. He could be a nice surprise if the sinker comes back, but we cannot count on him coming into 2010. Needless to say, we dont have any teflon rookies hanging out in the minors who are banging down the door. So someone will have to be signed or resigned for this to happen. Now for Boston.... #1 and #2 are set for 2010, although Beckett will likely be asking for a RIDICULOUS raise as 2010 is the last yr of his contract. After that though, the questions arise 1. Beckett 2. Lester 3. Matsuzaka #1 and #2 are the only two spots etched in stone for 2010 IMO. Aside from them, there are a TON of confounders. The first is DiceK. The guy we saw at the beginning of the yr lacked both the arm strength and the stuff that DiceK of a yr ago fashioned. And continually missing time with shoulder ailments makes me think something surgical is going on in there. Assuming he has a clean bill of health, he fits into the #3 spot, although his presence would necessitate a deep pool of backup options. So, lets pencil in DiceK for 2010 The #4 spot is wide open. You have Wakefield who was having a rennaissance before going back on the DL and who knows if he can still do it with his back the way it is. Lets consider him in the pool of resigning or FA options. Outside of Wake, Smoltz and Penny will be gone. You have Buchholz who for now would slot into the #4 position and Bowden would have to be the favorite for the #5 spot internally if you dont re-up Wakefield. So, lets look at the pool of options internally for the #4 and #5 spots 1. Clay Buchholz- out of options and running out of time, I assume he will be the #4 starter if he is not traded. 2. Michael Bowden- played well in AAA and with the sox, he is certainly a viable option assuming he isnt donning a Blue Jay jersey in 2010. 3. Junichi Tazaka- pitching well in AAA also, but we have all seen the jump to the bigs be a major obstacle for players. He is the first option on this list to not have seen the bigs. 4. Felix Doubront- probably a stretch since he isnt even dominating AA, but he has to be on the list since he will be in Pawtucket to start 2010. The list of options is pretty deep 1-3 in terms of sheer talent, but remember, the sox have 2 holes to fill internally. So, what are the options. For the Yankees, they could always come to the table with Andy Pettitte, who is once again giving NY exactly what they need. With all the incentives, Andy stands to make 10-12 mil for his 2009 efforts and a similarly positioned contract could get him back in fold. For the red sox, there is the easily usable 4mil option on Wakefield. He would stabilize the back of the rotation, but would also give the sox 2 guys with significant injury concerns in the rotation that will also include a novice pitcher. In terms of free agent options.... Your best bet is Jon Lackey. He is a FA and talks between him and the Angels have broken down. Lackey is a surefire top of the rotation pitcher who pitches well when the game is on the line and also well in the playoffs. His problem though, is his durability. After 5 consecutive seasons of 198IP or more, he has started out two straight yrs on the DL and looks to have his second consecutive season without being able to crack the 170IP mark. He turns 31 in October, so he should be available for hire, although he will be VERY expensive. After Lackey, the next pitcher on the list would be Rich Harden. If Lackey is an injury concern, Harden is the posterchild for great arm and limited health. Harden is on pace for his first 150+IP season since 2004 but he has been getting hit at a much higher rate in 2009 than he had previously. He might be letting up a little bit to avoid injury. Regardless, Harden stands to make good money although most of it would be in the form of incentives. Another name that is a FA right now is Ben Sheets. He was a ridiculously durable player before the Brewers essentially broke him down. Now, he can hardly get through the yr without surgery. Assuming he is repaired and strong, he could be an interesting choice. Probably one that will be getting kicked around in these parts is Jarrod Washburn. Boras is the agent and Washburn is having a ridiculous season, so he wont come cheap. But he is a playoff veteran who would offer both durability and production out of the #4 slot in the rotation, a serious need for both teams Other guys out there to fill a need.... Justin Duchsherer- solid starter, but also cannot stay healthy Erik Bedard- see above Doug Davis- seems to require the NL due to lack of stuff and command Jose Contreras- LOL Jon Garland- another guy better suited for the NL Tim Hudson- will be an interesting follow over the offseason. The Braves have a 12 mil option on him, but coming off TJS and in a smaller market makes it likely that Hudson (34 yrs old) will hit the market. Brett Myers- coming off hip surgery, Myers will likely see short terms and incentive based contracts, but he has the stuff of champions and could be a solid pitcher, assuming he stays healthy. Joel Piniero- a Duncan reclamation project who is dominating, but do you want to go down that road again? Brad Penny- I dont want him, do you? John Smoltz- yr 2 after shoulder surgery might be better?? Regardless, IMO, Lackey and Washburn are the big ones to follow. Sheets and Harden would be okay on limited risk deals. And Hudson could be a wild card. That being said, the options are there, but they sure as hell are not plentiful. So then there is trade, and we know who could swing the balance in this matchup. 1. Roy Halladay- would likely take less than it would have taken at the deadline, but he will still require a king's ranson. That being said, I think both teams could swing it depending on how the rest of the MiLB season goes. 2. Felix Hernandez- I put him on here solely to tell you he wont be dealt this offseason 3. ??? Could be anybody, but we all know there are 3-4 pitching trades from teams nobody expected to deal, so it is always a possibility that a John Danks or a Mark Buerhle comes available for the right price. So, there you have it. The synopsis of the pitching options for 2010...during the 2009 season. Not sure why I did it, but I thought about the free agent options and wanted to get it into post format.

This is an obvious indictment on the sox dire need for starting pitching. I think the sox may have overstepped their bounds when they included Masterson rather than Buchholz in the VMart deal as I think Masterson is more equipped right now to help a big league rotation than Buchholz is. Listen, I think Buchholz has amazing stuff and could be a front of the rotation starter in the future. But something just isnt clicking with him in Boston. Who knows what it is, but next season is his absolute last chance, really. After this season, he is out of options. So either they stash him in the pen and have him work it out in short stints like the yankees are doing with Hughes, or they cut bait and deal him. To be totally honest, I thought Buch's value would never be higher and that this was the time to move him. If he continues to be completely gunshy and vulnerable come this offseason, his stock will be at a pretty significant low and would likely not be able to allow him to be the centerpiece of a deal for a pitcher.

Wakefield last reached 200+IP in 2005, when he threw 225IP

hehe touche

my life has been anything but lately. Just bought a house, will be working like a fiend for the next 3 months or so and am looking for jobs. This is the first full day off I have had in a month and with all the moonlighting I will be doing, I likely wont see another one for a long while. Just enjoying being home right now

Thats the Dipre I remember. Why so bitter these days?

Dipre, the reason why I am calling you ridiculous is based on the entire premise of the post that you quickly shot down as a small sample size. When somebody uses the term, "of late" it is assumed that you are using a small sample size. If I wanted to use a statistically significant sample size, I would have said this yr, or over the past few months. It doesnt change the fact that our top 4 are coming into this series relatively hot as opposed to your top 4, which consists of 2 red hot pitchers and 2 slumping pitchers. But you had to chime in and point out the obvious, which isnt unusual. Seriously, your increase in posting on this site has been inversely proportional to the quality of your posts. Maybe if you thought about what you are typing a little more and scaled back on the posts, then you might not make an ass out of yourself

saying something looks like an easy split or an easy anything in a yankee sox series is stupid. There. Is that better? Did I break it down enough for you or do I need to type in spanish?

Idiot. READ THE POST!

Ridiculous as usual Dipre. As usual.

how can anyone say that about a yankee sox series? Cmon now, you are better than that. If I were a betting man, I'd probably say we take 3 of 4 based on the sheer offensive difference and the fact that you have Buchholz and Smoltz throwing two of the games. But this is yankee red sox. This is the pinnacle of unpredictability. For all we know, the yankees could take all 4 or Buch and Smoltz could man up and sweep the yankees out of NY.