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May 30 vs. Cleveland

Youk Of The Nation
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ksushi First Round Pick

ksushi

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I think I prefer OBP over speed, because good hitters get themselves into good counts and find pitches to hit anyway. The guy with speed on first is a plus
TheKilo All-Star

TheKilo

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Well' date=' for now, yes. The idea of having speed at the front of the order benefits your middle of the order guys, so long as your lead off hitter gets on base at a good clip. All major league hitters are fastball hitters, and having a guy with good speed on first base while your 3 and 4 guys are at the plate will get them a better percentage of fastballs and pitch outs which helps them work the count... OBP is a must though.[/quote']

 

Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz can hit a curveball 400 feet. I'd rather people were on base when they did it.

 

edit - What a slide by Lowell.

HeadOfSoxNation First Round Pick

HeadOfSoxNation

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I still disagree...

 

I understand what you're saying about OBP and what not, but whatever happened to the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" philosophy? The Sox are scoring lots of runs and winning lots of games...a large part of this is because of Lugo's RBIs out of the leadoff spot. The bottom of the lineup has been hot, and the guy at the top of the lineup has been driving them in when his turn has come around. Like I said, it's unconventional, but I'll take it anyday.

TheKilo All-Star

TheKilo

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I still disagree...

 

I understand what you're saying about OBP and what not, but whatever happened to the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" philosophy? The Sox are scoring lots of runs and winning lots of games...a large part of this is because of Lugo's RBIs out of the leadoff spot. The bottom of the lineup has been hot, and the guy at the top of the lineup has been driving them in when his turn has come around. Like I said, it's unconventional, but I'll take it anyday.

 

Whatever happened to "put the best team on the field" philosophy?

 

Pedroia's been far and away a better offensive player than Lugo. Give Pedroia Lugo's RBI chances and I guarantee he'd match, but more likely exceed, Lugo's production.

ORS All-Star

ORS

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I still disagree...

 

I understand what you're saying about OBP and what not, but whatever happened to the "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" philosophy? The Sox are scoring lots of runs and winning lots of games...a large part of this is because of Lugo's RBIs out of the leadoff spot. The bottom of the lineup has been hot, and the guy at the top of the lineup has been driving them in when his turn has come around. Like I said, it's unconventional, but I'll take it anyday.

I really don't like this line of thinking. Just because they are scoring enough runs to win games, thanks in large part to excellent pitching, doesn't mean they couldn't score more. Making less outs is more important than being fast. Statistical studies have shown than ad infinitum.

 

I will say this though, if the pitching holds up to the level they've put forth thus far, and they keep winning, I don't care who hits where. My concern on the matter is, at some time I feel we'll need those extra runs, so why leave them on the table?

HeadOfSoxNation First Round Pick

HeadOfSoxNation

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I really don't like this line of thinking. Just because they are scoring enough runs to win games, thanks in large part to excellent pitching, doesn't mean they couldn't score more. Making less outs is more important than being fast. Statistical studies have shown than ad infinitum.

 

I will say this though, if the pitching holds up to the level they've put forth thus far, and they keep winning, I don't care who hits where. My concern on the matter is, at some time I feel we'll need those extra runs, so why leave them on the table?

 

I just don't understand what runs we're truly leaving on the table. My arguement is that it's a wash. The runs we're "losing" by Lugo not being on base in front of the big guys, we're getting driven in by Lugo in the second, third, and fourth time through the lineup. I like Pedroia, I really do, but he's not a top of the lineup hitter IMO. I think Lugo's average and OBP will rise, and, given a chance for some steaks, feel far more confident with him taking the swings than I do any other potential Sox leadoff candidate. It's not JUST speed with Lugo.

TheKilo All-Star

TheKilo

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I just don't understand what runs we're truly leaving on the table.

 

You do know the point of being on offense in baseball is to not make outs, right? Youkilis and Pedroia make outs less frequently than Lugo. That's why runs are on the table.

 

My arguement is that it's a wash. The runs we're "losing" by Lugo not being on base in front of the big guys, we're getting driven in by Lugo in the second, third, and fourth time through the lineup.

 

See my previous post on that matter. Pedroia is equal to if not better than Lugo offensively.

 

I like Pedroia, I really do, but he's not a top of the lineup hitter IMO.

 

What turns him off to you? The .300 average? The almost .400 OBP? The 112 OPS+?

 

I think Lugo's average and OBP will rise, and, given a chance for some steaks, feel far more confident with him taking the swings than I do any other potential Sox leadoff candidate. It's not JUST speed with Lugo.

 

Call me crazy, but I want a more consistent offensive player having the most at bats. Pedroia and Youks fit the bill quite nicely, especially in comparison to Lugo and Crisp.

ORS All-Star

ORS

Old-Timey Member
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Posted
I just don't understand what runs we're truly leaving on the table. My arguement is that it's a wash. The runs we're "losing" by Lugo not being on base in front of the big guys' date=' we're getting driven in by Lugo in the second, third, and fourth time through the lineup. I like Pedroia, I really do, but he's not a top of the lineup hitter IMO. I think Lugo's average and OBP will rise, and, given a chance for some steaks, feel far more confident with him taking the swings than I do any other potential Sox leadoff candidate. It's not JUST speed with Lugo.[/quote']

Well, right now, it is just speed with Lugo.

 

Also, he's still going to get RBI opportunities. If he and Coco are hitting 8/9, they are behind Lowell and Tek, who are getting on base. So, we don't lose there. And, we have the speedy guys in front of the gap hitters, where the speed is more important. Finally, we get the OBP machines up in front of the base clearers. It really is that simple.

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