Pavano-ginitis on the chopping block

[riverside sluggers]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/jon_heyman/02/07/wednesday.scoop/1.html

 

Looks like spring training will just be him doing an audition for other teams. He is still owed 2 years/$20 million. Makes sense considering Phillip Hughes is making his way to the big show this season. We could probably see a rotation of fill-ins at the #5 spot until they believe Hughes is ready to come up

[jacksonianmarch]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/jon_heyman/02/07/wednesday.scoop/1.html

 

Looks like spring training will just be him doing an audition for other teams. He is still owed 2 years/$20 million. Makes sense considering Phillip Hughes is making his way to the big show this season. We could probably see a rotation of fill-ins at the #5 spot until they believe Hughes is ready to come up

 

I like Heyman sometimes, but I dont think he's right in this respect. Cashman is a very smart man. Pavano's contract is no longer the bear it used to be. And a certain Roger Clemens may be making the rounds come June or July. At the same time Hughes is said to be MLB ready right now, but could really use about 2 months of minor league time to really perfect his changeup (which is close to plus right now, and would give him 5 plus pitches- 4FB, 2FB, Curve, Slider, Change). All of that leaves a window of 2 months. Now as the team's 5th starter, he may be relegated to pen duty in April and may get something like 6 starts in May. That is the time we shop him.

 

Right now, trying to deal Pavano is all about cash relief. In June, dealing Pavano may net us a few prospects and cash relief. Think about it. Pavano is 30-31yrs old and signed for 08 at 10 mil per (nothing outlandish). If he even pitches average, like mid 4's era, he would be highly sought after in the NL, especially from a team like the Cardinals who have playoff aspirations but lack pitching depth.

 

Then you deal him, and slide either Hughes or Clemens into the rotation. But in ST? Remember Crunchy talking about contingency plans? You dont deal pitching without a contingency plan. The AAA kids need about 10 AAA starts before they get their rolls going. Clemens wont be coming until June 1 at the earliest and most likely by July 1 if he comes to NY at all. We need someone to span that window and a Pavano audition sounds like the best idea.

[Optimist]

He looks like he's in pretty good shape.

 

http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/ap_photo/20070212/all/l2362584.jpg

 

Maybe...just maybe...:dunno:

[jacksonianmarch]

time for a showcase.

[schillingouttheks]

His chest looks like Belichick's or Parcells in that picture...

[adam123]

pavano is a scrub should be with jaret wrong soon

[Mr Crunchy]

why is cashman a smart man??

 

any gm who had his resources which were double of his closest competitors and failed like the yanks have this century wouldve been fired

if he was in the army he wouldve been shot for dereliction of duty

 

he has made some good moves for the future this winter

but the sox got the upper hand this offseason as far as competetion goes this year.

 

of course if drew and matsusaka fail then theo will be making cheese blintzes at einsteins bagels on coolidge corner

[jacksonianmarch]

Crunchy, the sox certainly got the better short term impact out of this offseason, but the gap to bridge was significant. I still think they are a good bullpen and a solid bottom of the order away from being the better team.

[He Hate Me]

why is cashman a smart man??

 

any gm who had his resources which were double of his closest competitors and failed like the yanks have this century wouldve been fired

if he was in the army he wouldve been shot for dereliction of duty

 

he has made some good moves for the future this winter

but the sox got the upper hand this offseason as far as competetion goes this year.

 

of course if drew and matsusaka fail then theo will be making cheese blintzes at einsteins bagels on coolidge corner

 

Hey Crunch, it's been well documented that Cash was a GM in name only until 2005. He might have had double the resources, but he was forced to use them in extremely unwise ways because of others.

[Gom]

Guys, the playoffs are a crapshoot. 6 different champs in 6 years. The only thing the Yankees should do is make the playoffs every year, which they have. It's a crapshoot after that. Ask the Braves. Or the Sox. Just get in, and hope to win.

 

As for Pavano, he'll be alright. Unlike Arod, he owns up to s***. Any contribution will be welcome.

 

Keep in mind that if this guy actually pitches to his potential, the Yankees could have a rotation as good as any. Big if, though.

[riverside sluggers]

Yea Pavano owns up to s***... wait didnt he hold out from the team about the car accident he was in?

[jacksonianmarch]

Yea Pavano owns up to s***... wait didnt he hold out from the team about the car accident he was in?

 

agreed. He was a terrible signing and is a scumbag. But he can pitch when he is healthy and has a market if he shows he can pitch. If we can have a reasonably signed 31 yr old showing he can pitch in the AL East, we could get another few top prospects and open up room for Clemens or Hughes to slide into the slot.

[Mr Crunchy]

pavano missed 10 weeks last year when he fell on his ass

despite my distaste for arod,his ballwashers and his image consultants at least he put up some solid #s between april and october 1st

pavano essentially stole 20M

 

as far as cashman goes

hes powerful as long as george stays catatonic

when george wakes up and finds out that williams sheffield johnson and wright have been dumped he may just go out and try to get denny neagle or mike hampton in the bronx,perhaps give bernie the 4 year deal he deserves or try to get mark mcguire out of retirement.....

 

cash has done well

lets see how practical the youth movement is when the season starts

[rician blast]

As for Pavano, he'll be alright. Unlike Arod, he owns up to s***. Any contribution will be welcome.

 

Huh? ARod owns up to sh*t?

 

ARod actually owns up to TOO much...his constant striving for personal perfection, fan adoration and team acceptance drives him to accept responsibility for EVERYTHING that goes wrong in the Bronx.

 

Said Gammons: "A-Rod is a great player who accepts the responsibility of greatness and plays hard every day."

 

After the 2004 Playoff Debacle, ARod said he accepts for the Yankees failure to advance. "I accept full responsibility for this loss. If I played like they pay me to, we would have won," said Rodriquez.

 

Consider some other ARod quotes:

"I need to make more contact. I struck out more than one-hundred times. I can cut down on my errors and I'd like to steal thirty or forty bags. I made a lot of dumb baserunning mistakes this year."

 

"I love the challenge of the game. I love the work. My goal right now is to have a season next year that will make people forget about this one. I'll use things like this for motivation."

 

"This whole year has been a learning experience. There are still a lot of areas in which I think I can improve."

 

So exactly how is it that he fails to accept responsibility? I'd say that because of his ego, he actually shifts TOO MUCH blame and responsibility unto himself. In fact it is that self-centeredness that I most dislike about him. I'm not 100% sure whether he sincerely thinks he means that much to the outcome of every game or if it's just an act...but whatever the case, I think he's shown a proclivity to heap responsibility upon himself, right or wrong.

 

Sh*t, he probably think he's responsible for:

 

- Global Warming ("the way I hit bombs, combined with my good looks, is heating up the atmosphere")

- Giambi's juicing ("after all, he wishes he could hit 'em like me".)

- No. Korea's nuclear ambitions ("it's not weapons or energy they're after, they really want to develop a nuclear man, because they think I was incubated in a nuclear reactor which would explain my power")

- A dramatic increase in male homosexuality ("even guys wanna do me cuz I'm so fkn hot")

[jacksonianmarch]

cash has done well

lets see how practical the youth movement is when the season starts

 

This is what scares me. Cashman has done a very good job with acquiring young pitching talent and there is some position prospect talent brewing as well. The rotation has Mussina, Pettitte, and Pavano in it, all 3 will be gone by the end of 2008. Wang and to a lesser extent, Igawa is all that will be left. Santana may or may not be a FA option by 2009. The yankees have to be prepared to let these kids handle the reigns. Aside from Hughes, and to a lesser extent Sanchez, the rest of the AAA guys will likely act like rookies and have some serious ups and downs. I have said before that I'd give up 2007 or 2008 for the development of a solid internal rotation that would return to dynasty form. The talent is there, we just have to bridge the gap with patience, something George is not accustomed to doing. This is why the ascension of Hughes this yr is critical. If he comes up as the 5, and holds down a rotation spot for 2008, then another spot could potentially open up for Sanchez at that time (or he may be in the pen). If one spot opens per season, we could turn over the rotation to the young guns without giving up short term success.

 

But we all know George. If he decides to blow everything up mid season because we are 2 back of the sox, it could set the franchise back 4-5 yrs. This farm system is not getting undo hype. The pitching prowess is real. The potential is there. It is up to Cashman to hold as long as he can before he gets porked in a deal for Enrique Wilson (Damaso Mate for Wilson, what were you smoking!).

[He Hate Me]

Huh? ARod owns up to sh*t?

 

ARod actually owns up to TOO much...his constant striving for personal perfection, fan adoration and team acceptance drives him to accept responsibility for EVERYTHING that goes wrong in the Bronx.

 

 

So exactly how is it that he fails to accept responsibility? I'd say that because of his ego, he actually shifts TOO MUCH blame and responsibility unto himself. In fact it is that self-centeredness that I most dislike about him. I'm not 100% sure whether he sincerely thinks he means that much to the outcome of every game or if it's just an act...but whatever the case, I think he's shown a proclivity to heap responsibility upon himself, right or wrong.

 

Right on the money. This is exactly what I think as well. The guy is constantly PUBLICLY beating himself up, but it just seems so damn insincere. There is definetely a underlying arrogance that ARod can't seem to keep down.

[Mr Crunchy]

arod is an enigma

his off the field behavior is stellar

hes been healthy,his #s are incredible over his career,he won an mvp and he plays gold glove defense

 

for every yankee fan that likes him

5 want him released on waivers and i think its due to the issues mr hate me stated

 

if arod said

the sky is blue he would still come off sounding like a pompous asswipe

 

what sealed the deal was his back and forth over the WBC last spring

dominica,usa,puerto rico,micronesia,all of them were on his list

he looked like a fool

 

somehow manny gets under the radar with his contract

arod cant and its got a lot to do with his playoff #s but also a lot to do with his trying too hard to be the GQ man of the year

 

it comes easy for jetsey

arod struggles

[rician blast]

Right on the money. This is exactly what I think as well. The guy is constantly PUBLICLY beating himself up' date=' but it just seems so damn insincere. There is definetely a underlying arrogance that ARod can't seem to keep down.[/quote']

 

right. it's engrained in his being and he can't help himself. So the issue isn't lack of accepting responsibility, its the arrogance he thinks is character that we see right through. And again, I'm not sure he he is deliberately arrogant at all...he's just being himself and that's the way his psyche functions.

[BudLight]

right. it's engrained in his being and he can't help himself. So the issue isn't lack of accepting responsibility' date=' its the arrogance he thinks is character that we see right through. And again, I'm not sure he he is deliberately arrogant at all...he's just being himself and that's the way his psyche functions.[/quote']

 

I never thought I would be defending Arod, but your statement about his arrogance and that he is just being himself needs some defense. Do you think he has always been this way? Think for a minute about any pro sport and an athlete from that sport who was billed as the greatest to come along in a long, long time. Are they cocky, you bet, arrogant, sure and after hearing that for a few years and then that talk to be validated with a $200M + contract, it's no wonder he is so pompous.

[jacksonianmarch]

ARod talks to the media. Manny doesnt. If you befriend the media, eventually they will skewer you. If you are an ass to the media, all that will abound is speculation with no real facts. Its about time ARod adopts the Steve Carlton view of media.

[rician blast]

I never thought I would be defending Arod' date=' but your statement about his arrogance and that he is just being himself needs some defense. Do you think he has always been this way? Think for a minute about any pro sport and an athlete from that sport who was billed as the greatest to come along in a long, long time. Are they cocky, you bet, arrogant, sure and after hearing that for a few years and then that talk to be validated with a $200M + contract, it's no wonder he is so pompous.[/quote']

 

in your defense of ARod I think you are just further supporting my point. I'm not arguing about what caused his arrogance, just that his demeanor plays out in such a way that public perception includes a questioning of his sincerity when he does constantly own up beyond what he is truly responsible for. This is not an attack on the guy...in fact I think I've been indirectly defending him myself here.

[Mr Crunchy]

ARod talks to the media. Manny doesnt. If you befriend the media' date=' eventually they will skewer you. If you are an ass to the media, all that will abound is speculation with no real facts. Its about time ARod adopts the Steve Carlton view of media.[/quote']

 

this is fantasy

arod cant help himself and his image consultants never would allow him to avoid the press

[jacksonianmarch]

I know it wont happen. He cares too much about things outside of his baseball career to focus solely upon his job.

[rician blast]

I know it wont happen. He cares too much about things outside of his baseball career to focus solely upon his job.

 

If you are saying he consciuosly cares about these other things more than BB I'd disagree. IMO he can't sepearate the image and the striving for perfection on all levels from the game...in a sense he puts to much pressure on himself trying to be all things to all people. And the Yankee fans are exacerbating the problem, which is really good news for other teams.

[ARod2212]

If he just kept his mouth shut and let his numbers talk for him, he'd be fine. I wish somebody would muzzle him.

 

And any Yankee fan with a pulse should realize that Rodriguez is the best third baseman in the league. We're not going to get anybody better than #13, why are you going to drive the guy away?

[riverside sluggers]

It was only a matter of time... http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AkNBOt1y4A3Z5PuBDvOqI_Ai0bYF?slug=ap-yankees-pavano&prov=ap&type=lgns

 

Pavano has an MRI done

[BSN07]

They should just re-name the MRI to the Pavano...

 

 

Pavano is going to have some unforseen ailment when he gets older from all the MRI's he has had to take...

[riverside sluggers]

Just watch his name will be a catch phrase as well someday

 

I can see it now GMs in the near future (mightve already happened) talking to the agents for pitchers on the market "Now I dont want him to pull a Pavano on us"

[Mr Crunchy]

i think mussina bruised his ego by calling him out last week

[BSN07]

It's not hard to bruise anything on Pavano...