moonslav59

We could have re-signed Lester too, and had Porcello & Lester (and Miller)!!!

They won the WS and then went back to back with last place finishes. They trashed the place. Lester for Porcello - downgrade-- Jury still out Miller for ERod - downgrade-- 2 months of Miller for 4+ years of ERod is far from a downgrade. (We should have re-signed Miller and had both now!) Lackey for Kelly and Craig - downgrade-- Again, 2 or 8 months of Lackey for 4+ years of Kelly is not cut and dry. Peavy for Edwin Escobar and Hembree - whatever-- I'll take 2 months of Hembree over 2 months of Peavy, but we got way more months than 2. These are not great moves, but they're not really "trash" either. Edwin Escobar was seen as the key to that Hembree trade and the guy was DFA'd. They basically lucked into an ok bullpen arm. I always thought Hembree had a better chance, but Peavy was worth nothing to us at the time of the trade.

One out two is not bad.

They got Cespedes (which netted us Porcello) and a draft pick the forfeited for HRam for Lester. They got Kelly. They got Hembree. They got ERod. I like what the Yanks got for their purge, but we didn't totally "trash" the place.

Castillo was a gamble that failed. That failure was more than offset by the success of the Moncada gamble that netted us Sale. Craig was not the expected prize of the Lackey deal: Kelly was. There's still time for Kelly to turn that trade into a good one. That Pablo-HRam signings were bad. One would have been understandable but not both. To me, the biggest mistakes of Ben's tenure were Lester & Pablo.

Betts had a .726 OPS on May 18, 2016. I seriously doubt we are seeing a regression from him this year. Of course, any player can have a down year, and when several have them at the same time, it's not pretty. I did expect regression from Leon, but I expected progression from Vaz, and by replacing Hanigan and Holaday's PAs, I felt our overall catcher OPS would improve over 2016. 2016: .665 catcher OPS (.250 8 60) This included: .454 from Holaday in 34 PAs .449 from Hanigan in 111 PAs .584 from Vazquez in 181 PAs To me, this more than off sets the "up year" by Leon (.840 in 271 PAs). I think Leon can give us .680-.720 for over 350 PAs, and Vaz can give us .650-.690 for 300+ PAS. That should give us a better than .665 OPS from our catchers. Another big improvement was supposed to come from LF (.759 in 2016) and maybe 3B (.686).

soxprospects.com... ...The worst news of the evening came in the fifth inning when rehabbing third baseman Brock Holt had to leave the game due to a recurrence of vertigo symptoms. ... Soulda- coulda-woulda traded him while his stock was inflated.

Haven't you heard? Brock is an all star!

...and Craig's too, but at least Castillo's and Craig's contracts don't get luxury taxed.

They might have still signed Price and maybe not gone after Sale .

Yes, and this has been another loss that kind of flies under the radar. Young and Moreland were supposed to platoon. So far, both have hit "the wrong hand" better than the "right hand", so it has largely gone unnoticed, however, I seriously doubt the reverse splits continue all year. Morealnd will slump, at least vs LHPs, and Young will likely come down to earth vs righties.

I get your position, and of course we all would have loved to replace Papi "in kind". That task, however, was near impossible. Certainly, Moreland does not even come close. A full year from Beni might make up for a little of the offense lost, but surely a loss was expected to some degree. I guess the argument is really about to what degree, and to what degree did picking up Sale and Thornburg along with Smith's expected return "on paper" put a dent into the big offensive loss? I'm not saying you were or are wrong. I'm just saying, that I felt "on paper" we should have been able to break even. So far, it looks like I (and others) was wrong, but I'm holding off judgment until Price returns. Compare what Price, Porcello and Wright gave us the first half last year, and one could blame this mediocre start solely on that alone-- not Papi.

I still think once we get Price back, we'll win at a rate similar, if not better, than last year. (I also expect our offense to improve to top 5 in runs scored by year's end. That's looking harder and harder with each game gone by, but I'm still hopeful.

Unjustifiably so, GMs in all sports are mostly judged in hindsight- like they were supposed to know a player was going to get hurt or enter a period of steep unexpected decline. There's lots of gray area--like was it DD's fault Thornburg misinterpreted the winter workout regime? Was it DD's fault to sign a pitcher to $30+M a year with most years on the wrong side of top prime? (The club philosophy was not to do that before-perhaps for good reason-perhaps not.) Was it DD's fault to not nix the Pom trade? (Of course, I say yes, since I hated the trade even with a healthy Pom.) Some of these moves could be viewed as judging in "foresight". The Ben signing of Pablo was slammed by many of us. He was in a pretty steep and constant slide before we signed him. He was overweight. Did Ben drop the ball on not insisting on some sort of weight clause or check-in on over the winter? (I say yes and yes, and I'm a big Ben fan.) Should Ben have foreseen injuries for HRam? I say yes. That's the pessimist view. One could see it like this too: if Price and Thornburg were healthy and Wright was pitching like early 2016, we'd all be praising his genius as we'd be 3-4 games up in the AL East with Carson Smith's pending return brightening the future outlook. One could ask, would Ben still be here if HRam and Porcello had their 2016 seasons in 2015?

Yes. It's hard to credit a manager with wins, because it usually just involves doing what you're supposed to do. It's easier to find faults. I don't pick on game to game decisions, although I find myself disagreeing with JF more than other past managers. My beef is with the apparent lack of motivation, lack of fundamentals, and lack of any signs of brilliance. Francona lost the clubhouse during a trying time in his life, but the guy had smarts.

soxprospects.com... Third baseman Rafael Devers has long been talked about as the long-term solution at third for the organization, but some, including the Providence Jornal's Tim Britton, are starting to wonder if he could be the answer in the present? Still only 20 years old, Devers has been dominating at a level where he is over four years younger than the average position player. In his first 117 plate appearances, he has hit .324/.393/.590 with 7 home runs and 7 doubles. Those numbers have him in the top 12 in the Eastern League in average, OBP, slugging, OPS, and total bases.

My plan was to trade for K-Rod and sign Clippard for $7M a year. We'd have the same budget but could have traded the 4 prospects for someone else. Remember, Guerra had much higher trade value back then.

I'm not sure Marrero is a plus at 3B, but I do think he's better than anyone else we've tried there this year. Marrero only played 45 innings at 3B on the farm- another example of not getting players ready to play the position we most likely will need them to play. I don't Devon as a 3B solution due to his super weak bat.

I think the argument became upgrading the rotation was a way to minimize the loss of Papi and was supposed to help lessen the need to find a Papi replacement. It is related.

Agreed. I do think Francona's "friendliness" turned into a fault as he let some of his vets get out of hand.

Edwin Encarnacion

I do not think Papi would be a good choice. Managing does involve motivating, but I don't see much energy. Never have with JF, except on walk-offs. I think he has also been overly "loyal" to struggling vets. It has worked sometimes, but has back-fired too many times, IMO..

Once I saw what EE got, that made a lot of sense, however I'm not sure who would have paid Moreland $5.5M. Also, the luxury tax limit will be tight in upcoming years as EE ages and likely declines. His signing might have been great for this year, but if it meant we couldn't keep Bogey or Betts later, then what? Weighing all factors, I'd rather have EE than Moreland, but I'd be worried about future finances even more than I am now (i.e "the cliff").

I'm usually the last to call for a manager's removal, but I have not been a JF fan for a long time. I just don't see any plus traits at all. I've never said to myself, "JF just made a call or decision that won us a game". I hate to go game by game or blame a single person for one loss, but I never feel like JF wins us anything. There are a lot of time I felt he had a hand in a loss.

I agree: he looks better than anything we have now, but I trust the Sox brass to know when "ML ready" is.