moonslav59

My guess is nobody offers more than JBJ, Groome and Chavis, so I'd start with an offer of Groome, Chavis, Beeks & Haley. Maybe we can add Castillo or HRam to lessen the salary hit. (We could pay some of their salary.) We'd then have to give more... HRam, JBJ, Groome, Chavis, Beeks and Flores for Stanton. We'd actually save money in 2018 as HRam and JBJ will make more than Stanton, and we'd save on the luxury tax. This would allow us to get Stanton plus one from JD Martinez or Mustakas and a guy like Duda, Cobb or even Cozart. I realize the marlins want to cut $25M in 2018, and this does not help, but they could flip JBJ and maybe dump HRam for a partial loss.

You guys need a DH and have plenty of money to spend. We'll give you HRam and Rusnet Castillo for 3-4 of these guys. (LOL)

Hip-hip-hurrah!

In my opinion, it's a 3 year window, as Henry should be willing to spend heavily in 2020 to keep us near the top.

I have no issues with Yankee fans on this site. I was just saying I think the two threads are too similar and should be combined.

I was against the Vic trade for one major reason: the 3 years considering his age and likelihood of decline. It's hard to crap on the deal, since he was a major factor in 2013, but his 3 year numbers certainly did not merit the contract.

I don't disagree. I was just addressing your apparent sugar-coating the defensive differential between Beni & JBJ. I agree Beni is a better total package, has more upside, is less costly and has more years of team control. He's not better on defense in CF or in RF. Someday, he may get close to JBJ on D, but I doubt he ever equal his defensive skill set.

I seriously doubt it ever is the deciding factor for a future free agent, if we end up nearly platooning Duda with HRam next season, and HRam does not vest. Now, if HRam does well next year, and we limit his PAs, then you have a point, but HRam has sucked for 2 of the last 3 years and giving him about 60 less PAs than he had this year is not some radical smack down on HRam. Duda is way better vs RHPs.

No matter how you shake it our, Beni is a defensive downgrade to JBJ. If Betts plays CF, we lose big time in RF with Beni vs Betts. If Beni plays CF, like I feel he is better than him playing in RF, we step down on D in CF, even if Beni ends up being above average on D in CF. I'm not against trading JBJ, even though he is one of my favorite Sox players.

I agree. I will say that the Dodger dump was a great deal. It wasn't about Webster and de la Rosa. It was about dumping CC and Beckett. AGon petered out afterwards, so even that dump was worth getting nothing in return but the spending space needed to sign Vic and Naps and a ring in 2013. At the time of the 2nd sell-off, I had hoped we went more towards ML ready prospects (like ERod, Hembree & Escobar) than vets (like Cespedes, Kelly & Craig), and my hope was we'd re-sign Miller. We tried to play it "halfway" and that was my criticism then, too. The win in 2013 made it hard to continue being too critical, but we felt it afterwards. Cashman has made some great deals in the past 3-4 years. No doubt better than Ben and DD.

...and a healthy Wright to a lesser degree.

As of right now, if you had to choose from one of tehse plans, which would it be? (assuming all 3 winter plans that stay within the estimated $40M spending budget): A) Sign JD Martinez ($22M x ? years) Sign Lucas Duda ($8M/1year) to play 1B/ some DH (keep HRam from vesting his option) Sign SP'er to $10M (Hellickson/Holland type) Sign Mike Moustakas ($25M x ? years) & move Devers to 1B Sign Lucas Duda ($8M/1year) to play DH/ some 1B (keep HRam from vesting his option) Sign SP'er to $7M (Fister type) C) Sign Alex Cobb ($17M x ? years) Sign Lucas Duda ($8M/1year) to play 1B/DH (keep HRam from vesting his option) Sign Eduardo Nunez ($7M x ? years, assuming recovered from surgery) Sign 4th OF'er like Carlos Beltran ($7M x 1 yr)

Then maybe they should merge examiner's thread into yours. One Yankee thread about 2018 is enough on a Sox blog.

I don't think it's a stretch to expect several players to do more like 2016 than 2017, specially the younger players- which we have more of. You can call it "improvement", but maybe it's more like "return to their norm". There's also another big factor: returning players who did not play a full season last year. Maybe not all will be healthy and play a full season in 2018, and some are doubtful, but there is a long enough list to believe there will be a greater impact from these players in 2018 (of course others or some of these could be injured next year): Price: 11 starts to 20 to 33. Wright: 5 injury influenced starts to 20 to 33 (In fairness, ERod from 24 starts to 5 to 20) (Also, Fister, Johnson, Velazquez & Kendrick from 25 starts to 0 to ???) Carson Smith: 7 IP to maybe 57 IP Brandon Workman: 40 IP to maybe 80 to 100 IP (as long relief guy) Austin Maddox: 17 IP to maybe 47 or 57 Robby Scott: 36 IP to maybe 46 or 56 Robbie Ross: 9 IP to ??? Thornburg: 0 IP to ??? Devers: 58 games to 158 games (No Pablo or Rutledge) Vaz: 99 games to 120 (Leon from 85 to 64) These changes alone could easily outweigh any 2 free agent signings. The 4 killer Bs hitting with a 2016 OPS instead of 2017 would be like adding a major FA.

I don't see us matching up with the Rays, but we sure could use all of the three bolded players.

I would not assume Beni will be a plus defender in CF or RF. I'm not going out on a limb to say, it would be a certain downgrade on defense to have Beni replace JBJ. The upgrade in offense would be Ozuna vs JBJ. It looks like a clear plus for Ozuna, but the 2 years vs 3 years balances it up, in my opinion. I doubt the Marlins would trade Ozuna for JBJ and a mid level prospect. They want to avoid pricey arb players. Maybe a three-team deal could be worked out, but I'm not sure i want to give up 3 years for 2 seemingly better ones. It would play more into the 2 year window theory. I think our window is more like 3 years.

I was thinking the "New York Yankee" thread started by examiner.

We had a sell-off a couple times: 1) The AGon, CC, Beckett - Dodger deal 2) The free agents-to-be sell off of Lester, Lackey, Peavy, Doubront, A Miller and others. The first one, I think Sox fans were 50-50 over. The second one, fans are still going mental over. None were under DD: both were under Ben. The Yanks are being praised for their moves. Ben is being roasted for his. (Note: Ben traded his vets for more established players, while Cashman traded for younger and more speculative valued talent, something many on this board frown upon.)

Good recap, but couldn't this go on one of the other Yankee threads?

Yes, and also Shoppach who was part of the Coco Crisp trade. Freedy Sanchez who brought us Jeff Suppan and Brandon Lyons who was part of the Schilling trade. Nomar, who was traded for O Cab who helped us win in '04 and then brought us comp picks: Ellsbury (his comp pick was Kopech who helped us get Sale) and Lowrie (who brought us Melancon who brought us Holt) Manny brought us Jason Bay, who got us comp picks that ended up being Workman & Brentz. Pedro's departure to free agency brought us comp pick Buchholz. Not all of these moves can be 100% attributed to Dan D- some aren't even 50% attributed to him. Several are just slightly related to his players. My point is that every GM greatly affects what the next guy does and can do.

Dan D might have won with Henry as his owner. I'm not dissing Theo, but Dan was no dummy.

Yankee Free Agents: Maybe Tanaka Sabathia Pineda Frazier Garcia Holliday Free Agents after next year: Robertson Warren Headley Red Sox Free Agents: Moreland Nunez Reed Fister Young Abad Boyer Davis Free agents after next year: Kimbrel Pomeranz maybe HRam Kelly Ross

MLBTR reports... The Rays should be open to trading right-hander Jake Odorizzi, closer Alex Colome, outfielder/designated hitter Corey Dickerson and second baseman Brad Miller during the offseason, Marc Topkin of the Tampa Bay Times opines. All four players will go through arbitration in the winter, with Odorizzi projected to end up with the highest salary ($6.5MM). He’s also the player the Rays are most likely to trade, according to Topkin. Odorizzi, 27, is coming off a down season, but his impressive track record and two remaining years of affordable team control could lead to plenty of interest from starter-needy clubs.

Yes.

I agree. I think we just need to make 2 major additions or 3 close to major additions. We might have close to $40M to spend, if Henry give the okay to approach the second penalty phase of the luxury tax budget. That might be just enough. Add possible full years by Price, Devers, Smith, Wright, Maddox, and more from Ross and Thornburg to the probability that some of our younger players will actually improve as the approach or reach prime, and we could easily still be "the team to beat" in the AL East.