Elktonnick

He said he was going to renew In Feb but he never did it before ST. Gammons specifically cites an April incident of how poor morale to be in the FO. I think it is probable that Henry and Werner decided then that they weren't going to renew because the poor state of collaboration in the FO.

Gammons also left the Globe

Gammons is an award winning sportswriter , the most highly respected baseball writer in the US you and others here are not. That is the difference.

Subscribe to The Athletic it is behind a paywall. Until I heard Russo and Gammons speak about this in separate shows on the MLB network after DDs sudden departure did I realize that DD had leadership issues. I seems it was common knowledge among baseball circles but because it dealt with personality issues there was this wall of silence. Baseball execs do not speak ill of one another in public for obvious reasons. It seemed once DD is gone then the gloves came off.

I do not think I hate DD but merely citing what Gammons reported. I do not believe Gammons hates DD either. The facts are for whatever his successes may be, it seems that many who worked for and with him do have some animus towards him though.

Not likely. Henry said in February that he was going to renew DDs contract but kept postponing it. I think the available evidence is more than sufficient to indicate that Henry and Werner had enough of the work environment that DD had created. But since the Sox never made the playoffs the argument is moot. Henry fired him with a month to go as Gammons described in another article.

Actually you have it backwards. Russo specifically said in his nationwide radio and TV show in Sept immediately after the firing that the assessment of DD not being the right man was a cover for DDs personality as the real reason for his dismissal. Gammons's article makes it crystal clear that office morale was awful and it was affecting both the FO's current performance but the future as well. The article if you read it was pretty damning about a toxic work environment which is what one Boston sportswriter actually called the FO during this era.

From Russo and others, Henry was going to fire DD in 2018 but decided not to after winning the World Series. As Gammons wrote Henry refused to renew DD'd contract in 2019. There were leaks to that effect throughout the year. DD in September brought it to a head and was fired after he confronted Werner. Now you all can choose not to believe Gammons whose reporting is pretty solid. But I think the record is clear that Henry and Co had enough of DD's style regardless of the spending. Again Gammons is probably the most respected baseball writer in the US. I can think of no one with his stature. Gammons makes it pretty clear it was about collaboration not spending.

Oh I think we know that it wasn't. Many simply refuse to believe because it is inconsistent with their narrative. Sure the spending had some role as did not winning but it was minor compared to the general misery that DD was spreading in the FO. Clearly Henry saw that as the bigger threat to the long term success of the organization than the Lux tax. I think Henry's mindset was like mine or yours in a similar situation, I can no longer need to put up with this crap. Too many good people are jumping ship.

Oh but I think it very much does; Peter Gammons Sept 19 2019 The Athletic: "And five minutes into Sept. 9, 2019, Dombrowski was dismissed. Which means that when the 2020 season opens, the Red Sox will have won four World Series under Henry ownership and will be turning to their fourth general manager over that period — not counting interims from Mike Port to Jed Hoyer and Bill Lajoie to the four extraordinarily gifted members of the present organization. The gorilla suit was a mess. The Tito/Theo departures were a mess. The behind-his-back treatment of Cherington was a mess. Now, Sunday night’s events were as strange as the way the Colts departed Baltimore in moving vans. Understand, this is a very difficult job. The easy part is replacing Dombrowski; what’s hard is finding what the Dodgers’ Andrew Friedman, Epstein and Arizona’s Mike Hazen have built in terms of organizational collaboration. Dombrowski was estranged from many of the people who are the framework and soul of a franchise who at times this season fielded a team where every positional player was homegrown, and installed by those who preceded Dombrowski. His cabinet was perceived to be Frank Wren and Tony LaRussa. One former Red Sox front office member who is now in the National League came to a Saturday afternoon game in April and said, “these guys just got their World Series rings, and everyone’s miserable. It’s unbelievable.” Another former member of the inner circle said last month, “I hate all that I hear about that place. It should be great. But it seems like everyone wants to leave.” And there were many indications that Dombrowski and Red Sox President Sam Kennedy, arguably one of the most trusted people in the business, weren’t on the same page. Kennedy is the face and voice of the franchise. Many of Kennedy’s associates said where Kennedy and Epstein had melded baseball operations and business into one focused unit, this was not what Dombrowski was told would be the case when he was hired. In fact, when Dombrowski arrived in Boston, Kennedy picked him up at the airport. Dombrowski asked Kennedy to arrange a meeting between him and Cherington. He’d been hired and didn’t know Cherington was already gone. A year later, Hazen, Jared Porter and Amiel Sawdaye, three key figures in a decade of success, left for Arizona with no love lost for Dombrowski." That's what Peter Gammons and Chris Russo were talking about when they said DD had a personality and management style problem. Now you can still refuse to believe Gammons three time sportswriter of the year and 2004 J. G. Taylor Spink Award Winner that it was management style not payroll that led to his departure but I will.

Again none of that diminishes the fact that DD was fired for his management style not his spending which Henry approved of when it happened.

Good questions. I think restgate really sullied his reputation and made it possible to no longer overlook his personality.

They are reporters. Peter Gammons is probably one of the most well respected baseball writers in the country. I guess being in Canada you may not be aware of his reputation.

Gammons and Russo do not have the track record of misleading their public and misingengenious comments that eminate from the FO from time to time, just ask Terry Francona.

DD stopped winning in 2019 not 2018 and he stopped winning because he either listened to or implemented the idiotic spring training regime.

After the fact. Hiring Bloom does not disprove Gammons Russo et al statements that DD was fired because of management style not bloated payroll. Henry is perfectly capable of making sharp changes of direction if it suits his purposes.

As Cervantes wrote in Don Quixote "It doesn't matter if the rock hits the pitcher or if the pitcher hits rock it is still bad for the pitcher" The Red Sox sure have run through a lot of GMs in last few years.

Most knowledgeable sources do not buy that line at all. Gammons, Chris Russo et al all heard that DDs personality was pissing off Henry even before the Sox won in 2018. Russo said on the MLB network that DDs management style and the complaints about it were the talk around baseball in 2018 but no one would say anything publicly. Russo also said that he was surprised DD was not fired then. Gammons more or less confirmed Russo's account as have others. So you can believe the Red Sox disinformation campaign that it was about money and strategy if you wish. It isn't as if Red Sox ownership has never lied before about personnel issues. No they would never do that.

I have no expectations of Bloom other than he do his job. I see however no evidence that he has done anything of note. DD for all his faults has two rings Bloom has none. For the record DD was not fired for overspending. His contract was not renewed because he was not collobarative enough and did not keep everyone in the loop. For whatever his good points Bloom has yet to prove himself one way or other. I do however have one prediction Bloom too will one day be fired. Fans can only hope he too can win a ring before Henry tires of him and let's him go.

Actually I had but that is beside the point, are you making the case that the two P boys are right up there with Big Papi and Manny. I suspect the two Ps will be something far less than significant.

Yea you are correct. Peraza and Perez are right up there with Ortiz and Manny Ramirez. What a freaking genius, how could Tampa ever let Bloom go.

Wow stop the presses greatest move by a Red Sox GM since getting Ortiz. This changes everything. ....Nah. I don't think so!!!!

You do know that in 1918 the Sox had just won the title and had won a number of titles previously but it would be 86 years until they would win another one. That is why I chose 1918.

Again wrong question, the right question is would Bloom know. I can only go by the fact that nothing has been done. So based on the known quantifiables Bloom has accomplished nothing.

I am sure someone in 1918 said the same thing and look how that turned out.