SoxFanForsyth

Late to the party I see. Good to see others agree w giving Napoli a 4th year. Happy Thanksgiving all!

Looks like the Sox are hesitating to give Napoli a 4th year. He's meeting w Seattle, though, who may offer up. I think the Sox will ultimately give him 4/36 or 4/44, somewhere in thy area. Potentially a 3/36 with a 10mm option. Would you give him a 4th year? I would. He's got versatility, and has the stick to DH in years 3 and 4 when Ortiz is gone. He's a middle of the order RH power bat that this team needs, and he comes cheap. I give him a 4th year if I'm Cherrington.

I think it's interesting (and fantastic) that the Sox are really starting to focus a lot more on a players make up rather than just his sabermetrics and talent. Obviously those should be extremely involved in decision making, but it was almost as if the Sox just thought "talent is talent and regardless of the situation, it'll translate." They're getting away from that and going after guys like Kevin Millar. Guys who are talented, but have an outstanding presence in the clubhouse. I think we saw first hand last year how a toxic clubhouse can completely take over a team. Not only that, but you want your young kids coming up into a situation that is lead by guys like Gomes, Pedroia, Ortiz, David Ross, etc. This was a very solid move by the Sox. I am curious, though, if the Sox are still in on Hamilton as a potential LF since I would expect Gomes to play LF. Also, I wonder if Kalish plays RF vs RHP, and Gomes plays LF vs LHP, and then they have someone else in the mix who rotates. Kalish is certainly capable of playing RF at Fenway, and has an absolute cannon for an arm.

I would certainly give up significant prospects for Gordon and Butler. They are very underrated players. OBP's in the .370's. Gordon has 20 HR power, Butler has 30+ HR power at Fenway. Both are .300 hitters, or right around it. I wouldn't give up Bogaerts or Bradley, but I'd give up Webster, De La Rosa, Cecchini, Barnes, etc, along with MLB talent like Doubront. Not all of those guys, but if the Royals wanted Cecchini, Webster, Doubront, and Kalish for Gordon and Butler, I'd likely strike on that deal.

I would absolutely give up Webster for Alex Gordon. He's a stud. Also, Hosmer and Wil Myers would be extremely intriguing for 1B. I could certainly see the Sox pulling a deal for Gordon and Hosmer. EDIT: Actually I think the Royals would be much more willing to part with Butler than Hosmer, and I think Butler would be an excellent fit at Fenway.

I think it's a good gamble to take to sign Hamilton and look at it like this - You put a very talented team around him this year, and you start infusing your prospects over the next 3 years. Corner OF and 1B are the two most glaring holes that the Sox have in their minor league system right now, so spending big money on those to positions is ok because you're going to be using prospects to fill other holes at cheap rates. So you build a team of Napoli, Hamilton, Kuroda, Garza, and like you said, Kalish/Sands in RF. Then next year, you bring up De La Rosa, Webster, Brentz (RF), Bradley (CF), and Bogaerts (SS). That's 5 players right there at league minimum who will contribute heavily to the Red Sox. And if you win even 1 WS in a 5 year/$120mm deal for Hamilton, it's worth it.

Yup. So if they're going to be in the $145-155 range, which still will leave them with loads of flexibility, they've got around $55mm to $65mm to spend. That's why I am starting to think they're going to go hard after Hamilton, Napoli, and Kuroda. That's around $48mm right there in payroll. Then they'll have another $17mm going forward for a RF and 1 more arm. And they'll still be $34mm under the $189 threshold, with a large amount of money coming off the books over the next 2 years.

He's not nearly the impact player that Hamilton is, though. And if he's going to get 5/90 or 5/100 like I'm hearing, I'd much rather throw down an extra $4-5mm AAV and get Hamilton, and then trade Salty + Wilson for Garza and sign Kuroda to a short term deal. By this time next year, we'll have potentially 3 guys in Barnes, Webster, and De La Rosa who can all deliver production consistent with that of Sanchez. Certainly De La Rosa and Webster will be close, Barnes may be 2 years out.

He also said that signing "sluggers, pure hitters" often do better in FA contracts than others. To me, all signs indicate that the Sox are very interested in Hamilton and will likely be one of the finalists on him. If you get Hamilton for LF, and Napoli for 1B, you can hide an Iglesias at SS and let his defense be his skillset that helps out our SP and saves some runs. RF, however, would be a position that I'd like to see an upgrade. While I do like Kalish and hope he gets his chance, I'd certainly rather have a proven veteran to mix in there with him. And even more than that - We really, really need a RH bat in the OF. Both Corey Hart and Hunter Pence would be very intriguing options for RF.

Ciriaco is smoke and mirrors man. .352 BABIP fueled run, 2.9% BB% and 17.3% K%. Bill James projects Iggy to be a .240/.285/.283 hitter next year. That's bad, but his defense up the middle is unbelievable. Iglesias posted a WAR of 0.3 last year in 25 games. Ciriaco posted a WAR of 0.9 in 76 games. So, essentially they had the same impact. Except Iglesias hit .118 last year. He's obviously going to get close to doubling that, so to me, he's a better option. Iggy will give you a 2-3 WAR at SS if he plays 150 games.

Yes. For 1 year, coming off an injury ridden season where he made 18 starts and didn't start a game after July 21, and in the games he did start he posted a near 4 ERA in the NL Central that just lost both Pujols and Fielder, going into his final year of arbitration where he'll be making more than he's made during his entire tenure with the Cubs. No, no. They'll get the moon for him. A 25-30 HR catcher and an above average bullpen arm? I'd say that's a good deal. Wilson posted a 9.5 K/9 and a 3.2 BB/9 as a reliever in 60 innings last year in Pawtucket, with a 3.27 ERA. He pumps around 97 with an above average slider. Not to mention Theo has always coveted Salty. That's about as much as the Cubs will get for Garza right now. Sorry to burst your bubble.

I agree. Give Hamilton 5/115-125 (LF) Give Napoli 3/27 (1B) Trade Salty + Alex Wilson (or that caliber of a prospect) for Garza (#4 SP) Sign Hiroki Kuroda 1/15 (#3 SP) Then you have a rotation of Lester/Buch/Kuroda/Garza/Lackey. Lineup of Ells/Pedey/Hamilton/Ortiz/Napoli/WMB/Lavarnway/Kalish/Iggy. Given the AL East this year, that's a team that will contend for the AL East title. All at a cost of around $145-150mm, which is about right where I expect the Sox to be.

And now, more than ever, when the cost of even a #3 pitcher like Garza or Sanchez is reaching $90-100mm, it's even more imperative that you retain the guys who have the high ceilings like De La Rosa, Barnes, Webster, Owens, etc.

Come on now a700. Just because the Sox have had a bit of a draught doesn't mean it's not the best course of action to develop players internally and retain a core at least until FA. Where would the Sox be without Pedroia, Ellsbury, Youk, Pap, Lester, Trot, etc? Certainly wouldn't have had the 2007 championship.

An 88 OPS+ and a -12 OPS+ are two very different things. And he was 22. And he started the season in AA. And he was called up in July. He's a much better OF than you give him credit for. He's been injured and is finally healthy. Pedroia had a 42 OPS+ when he was 22.

http://www.milb.com/index.jsp?sid=t531 Off topic, but everyone must see this. They used to be the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees (AAA affiliate). Oh how they've changed.

http://www.milb.com/index.jsp?sid=t531 hahahahahahahahahahahahaha. Oh this is fantastic. This actually happened "And here are your Scranton Wilkes Barre.....RAIL RIDERS!!!!!"

Well, this is also the first time Kalish has been healthy since 2010. And in 2010, as a 22 year old, he showed a lot of promise. Certainly enough promise for Bill James to project him to be a 20/20 guy in 2011, but then he got hurt. I don't think it would be a bad idea at all to line up 2013 with Kalish as your starting RF. He's going to be 25 next year, it's time to see what you've got in him. Just to be clear, too, when I met Kalish, he actually said he moved to Boston this offseason because he was finally healthy for the first time and wanted to train here and at Fenway, so this is from the horses mouth, not from some report.

Upton is going to demand 5/70mm, I think that's way too much for him myself. I'd much rather take a flier on Melky Cabrera for 1 year/7-8mm and see how he rebounds.

Why pay for Victorino when you can get almost the same production from Kalish?

Now that Hunter is gone, the OF market is getting thin, and Cody Ross can probably be more firm on his desire for a 3 year deal. I think the Sox land Napoli, it's a very good fit for both parties. And I think the Sox will go the extra mile to acquire him (much like they did for David Ross, who is going to surprise a lot of people on this thread. Very good defensive catcher, knows the game well, gets respect from pitchers, calls good games, provides above average offense). Josh Johnson was someone I had on my radar, but that's moot now. I wonder if Cherrington can pry Garza from the Cubs for a deal revolved around Salty and Cecchini? I am getting a bit antsy, though. Thanksgiving always signals the meat of the offseason to me, and usually I'd like to see at least one starting piece added by this time in an offseason that is as demanding as this one is going to be if the Sox want to be competitive. Hope we don't end up in a position like last offseason where we basically make no moves. Salary is only at around $90mm right now. Tons of money to spend, Ben. Don't have to blow it all this offseason, but don't turn us into the Royals either.

Who are you referring to here? Cecchini/Swihart/Owens? Or is it just a general statement?

Can't just pick and choose reports you believe. Gammons is almost always spot on with his information.

Hearing the Marlins wanted Middlebrooks and Bogaerts for Reyes and Josh Johnson. I apologize for jumping on Cherrington for not striking on that deal. Edit: Doubront, too! Red Sox would have had to give up WMB, Bogaerts, and Doubront plus some for the Marlins deal. Not sure if that includes Buehrle/Buck/Bonifacio.

This should have been Cherrington's baby. Absolutely should have been. Those 3 pieces alone would have put the Sox right back into contention. I feel like Ben got taken to the cleaners here