Felix Hernandez signs contract extension with Mariners

[jacksonianmarch]

You do know that the next "ace" coming available is coming after 2013 when Wainwright hits FA. He doesnt have the sexy fastball, but he has been nothing short of a top of the line starter for the Cards and showed plus stuff after he fully recovered from TJS. He's going to have another 20 win season this yr and command the next $20+mil per yr AAV contract

[a700hitter]

I said a couple of times here that all those Hernadezs, Kershaws, Hammels, Cains, Etc. are pipe dreams. Some said that we have the prospects and that we could grab an ace in 2014 or so while we save money and blah, blah, blah. Lets face it, ain't gonna happen.

 

All I was asking all along was a couple of solid/durable 2-3 tier pitchers (Buehrle, Kuroda, Gio, etc type) since 2011 in order to reinforce our rotation and be at least competitive in that department and mostly, be a more balanced team all around.... and in the meantime develop somehow an ace from within. Some say that 35-50 M contracts for those type of pitchers were insane. Well, when you see what aces are getting these days, those type of contracts for 2-3 tier pitchers are fair from my glasses, otherwise you have to bet and see what pitchers like Cook, Dempster, etc. can do, over and over again.

Last off season when they did nothing to improve or starting pitching, we were told that it was a prudent non-move, because there would be a treasure trove of available aces this off season. Well, it didn't turn out that way. It never does. Instead, we spent $26 million on Dempster. Wow! Brilliant.

[Divinity]

You do know that the next "ace" coming available is coming after 2013 when Wainwright hits FA. He doesnt have the sexy fastball, but he has been nothing short of a top of the line starter for the Cards and showed plus stuff after he fully recovered from TJS. He's going to have another 20 win season this yr and command the next $20+mil per yr AAV contract

 

You sure he'll be a FA? Cardinals GM John Mozeliak said that he hopes to work out a new contract with Wainwright by Opening Day

[a700hitter]

You sure he'll be a FA? Cardinals GM John Mozeliak said that he hopes to work out a new contract with Wainwright by Opening Day

I think Wainwright has had 2 TJ surgeries. We will get him after his 3rd TJ and he'll be called depth.

[jacksonianmarch]

And Wainwright has said he won't negotiate in season. The season is fast approaching and I am sure the Cards GM is negotiating from a stance that last season, he wasnt worth ace money, while Wainwright points to his strong finish and the fact that he was recovering from TJS to justify it. I think it is a near certainty that Wainwright hits the open market

[Palodios]

Last off season when they did nothing to improve or starting pitching, we were told that it was a prudent non-move, because there would be a treasure trove of available aces this off season. Well, it didn't turn out that way. It never does. Instead, we spent $26 million on Dempster. Wow! Brilliant.

 

Even most of us "ballwashers" knew the pitching was weak going into 2012, and relying on Doubront/Bard was a bad idea. Just as how most of us wanted one more pitcher in 2013.

[a700hitter]

Even most of us "ballwashers" knew the pitching was weak going into 2012, and relying on Doubront/Bard was a bad idea. Just as how most of us wanted one more pitcher in 2013.

Just for the record, I don't think I ever called you a "ballwasher". Second, based on your post, you are probably not a ballwasher. I don't know if you aspire to ballwasher status, but I hate to break the news to you. You are not doing a very good job at establishing ballwasher credibility.

[Divinity]

We will get him after his 3rd TJ and he'll be called depth.

 

I think you may be right about this.

[BSN07]

I wouldn't say Wainwright is the next elite Ace available. He is a really good pitch but has some chinks the armor so to speak. He's not someone I'd be thrilled to see the Sox invest a ton of money in.

[BSN07]

The Mariners and Hernandez are not close to finishing an extension because concern has developed over the condition of his pitching elbow, a source tells ESPN's Buster Olney. The elbow issue is perceived by at least one of the parties in the deal as being a possible impediment to the completion of the new contract, according to Olney.

 

They are probably trying to trade him to the Yankees now lol

[Palodios]

I wouldn't say Wainwright is the next elite Ace available. He is a really good pitch but has some chinks the armor so to speak. He's not someone I'd be thrilled to see the Sox invest a ton of money in.

 

MLB Trade Rumors totally reminds me...

 

 

Roy Halladay is a free agent next year. I don't care if he will be 37, Roy Halladay is a guy who is worth a 2/60 contract.

[BSN07]

MLB Trade Rumors totally reminds me...

 

 

Roy Halladay is a free agent next year. I don't care if he will be 37, Roy Halladay is a guy who is worth a 2/60 contract.

 

2/60? That's a little high imo. If he makes it through the season healthy, 2/40-45M seems like plenty.

 

Just in MLBTR top 10 list '14 FA's,

 

Halladay

Johnson

Wainwright

Linecum

Garza

[Palodios]

2/60? That's a little high imo. If he makes it through the season healthy, 2/40-45M seems like plenty.

 

Just in MLBTR top 10 list '14 FA's,

 

Halladay

Johnson

Wainwright

Linecum

Garza

 

2/40 is probably what he'll be worth. 2/60 is what it will take to get him to play in Boston.

[BSN07]

2/40 is probably what he'll be worth. 2/60 is what it will take to get him to play in Boston.

 

Then I'm not that interested. 30M a season for a 38 year old pitcher(who's likely to cost a pick) seems a bit of a stretch. Maybe if they were that one piece away from a Championship, but not in the situation they are likely to be in the next couple seasons.

 

It will be interesting to see how those 5 guys do this year. Each has his own chink in the armor, but I could see the Sox making a play for one of them next year.

[Palodios]

Then I'm not that interested. 30M a season for a 38 year old pitcher(who's likely to cost a pick) seems a bit of a stretch. Maybe if they were that one piece away from a Championship, but not in the situation they are likely to be in the next couple seasons.

 

It will be interesting to see how those 5 guys do this year. Each has his own chink in the armor, but I could see the Sox making a play for one of them next year.

 

Halladay is one of the few guys I'd count on in later years. The last time he had a full season ERA above 3.00 was 2007, and the last time he pitched under 220 innings was 2005. He's also dominated the AL East. Schilling was 41 in 2007 afterall, and Halladay is by far the superior pitcher.

 

Either way, it should be an interesting offseason because there will be a few elite arms available who have been in this division-- Halladay, Garza, and possibly Johnson and Marcum.

[a700hitter]

2/40 is probably what he'll be worth. 2/60 is what it will take to get him to play in Boston.

This shouldn't surprise people, since it took 2 years/ $26 million to sign a guy like Dempster. Pitching is at a premium. Ace pitching is at an unbelievable premium. A 2 year contract would not strangle the Red Sox, no matter what AAV. I think it would take 3/ $70 million to get him.

[Dojji]

Halladay is one of the few guys I'd count on in later years. The last time he had a full season ERA above 3.00 was 2007, and the last time he pitched under 220 innings was 2005. He's also dominated the AL East. Schilling was 41 in 2007 afterall, and Halladay is by far the superior pitcher.

 

Ehhhh. Halladay has ome of the best combinations of stuff and smarts in the major leagues today, but "by far superior" to Schill is a real stretch. Schill didn't have the pure stuff of a Halladay, not even close, but he was one of the smartest pitchers in major league ball, and his ability to raise his game in the playoffs is the stuff of legend. Very, very, very few big league pitchers in the entire history of the game have as unblemished a postseason record as Curt Schilling.

 

I agree with your overall point. Halladay has the stuff, command and smarts to be very effective even if he loses a few miles off the top of his fastball, the same way Schill was. And Halladay and Schilling are both Hall bound pitchers, unless something PED-related turns up.

 

I also agree that unless this team comes back together a lot faster than I think it will, Halladay is probably not coming here. We're not close enough to the top to be a Halladay away at this point and I don't see us catching all the breaks we'd need to reach that position in one year.

[jacksonianmarch]

Dojji, what the f*** are you talking about? Schilling had a 98mph fastball in his prime and by the time he was solid with the sox, he was a low 90s pitcher who learned over time that he could change speeds and locate and be just as effective. Halladay was not blessed with the arm Schilling had. Halladay has excelled with mostly low 90s heat that he can run, cut, split and locate with the best of them. Add in a changeup that he can do the same thing to and a breaking ball that is lights out and you have Halladay. Halladay has used deception from his early days and will, IMO, deal with diminishing stuff better than anyone not named Maddux as he ages