When will JD get his Due?

[a700hitter]

Again, i just think we shouldn't doubt the guy's desire to play in the postseason, since he has never before asked to sit out a postseason game.

 

The regular season criticism is warranted, but the playoffs are a whole other beast.

I'm not doubting the guy or looking to bash him. I was not offering any opinion about him at all. I was just attempting to engage in some informal discussion during some down time before we get close to game time. I don't think everything has to be a debate requiring support with statistical links and proof, etc.

[Dojji]

I'm not doubting the guy or looking to bash him. I was not offering any opinion about him at all. I was just attempting to engage in some informal discussion during some down time before we get close to game time. I don't think everything has to be a debate requiring support with statistical links and proof' date=' etc.[/quote']

 

http://www.2hands.co.uk/images/projects/backpedal.jpg

[Dipre]

http://www.2hands.co.uk/images/projects/backpedal.jpg

 

That's pretty smug, you know?

[a700hitter]

http://www.2hands.co.uk/images/projects/backpedal.jpg

Back pedal from what? I'm interested to read your response.

[TheKilo]

Read the papers. Do your own research. Francona talked about it in his press conference after the specific game. He told him that he had to stay in.

 

I know exactly which game you are talking about. I'm proving a point. Please tell me the game and the alleged inning he asked out.

 

you must have hated it when Manny threw that AB against Rivera last season.

[Dojji]

That's pretty smug' date=' you know?[/quote']

 

Yeah. I know. It's probably not really fair to call him on it because all he's really doing here is playing devil's advocate, largely out of boredom.

 

I know a backpedal when I see one. God knows I do them enough myself. A700 got caught up in the argument and now wants to extricate himself from a position he found himself in by implcation and got stuck into by not making it clear enough that that wasn't what he meant. the only people who don't need to do that from time to time are delusional idiots.

[Paradisecity]

How is this relevant towards a discussion of his production?

 

It is relevant towards a discussion of him getting his "due" (whatever that is), as a player's image is a very important part of how that player, employee, politician, person, is judged by his friends, coworkers, peers, media, etc...

 

When will A-Rod get his due?

 

I play soccer at a fairly competitive level, with some former low level pros and a lot of other players who are half decent but just think they are better than they are.

 

I am not the most skilled soccer player. I have the first touch of a rapist and no matter what I do on the field, I can NOT put the ball in the net.

 

What I AM, is the hardest, smartest worker on the field every time I step on it. The way I play commands the respect of everyone else on the field. Why? Because on that field I am an overachiever. I do more than I should be able to with the talent that I have been given.

 

In life, we tend to gravitate towards the little guy- the Dustin Pedroia who will never make it in the bigs, the Wes Welker type who manages to cut between players with feet on him in size and hundreds of pounds in weight. We root for the 15 seed busting its ass to beat that full-of-itself 2 that would have been a 1 if it had hit its potential. Personally, I can not STAND playing ball with players who are blessed with talent and are no better than I am because they don't work hard enough and don't try hard enough.

 

Maybe J.D. Drew is the consummate professional- handling the game like a job rather than a passion, always on an even keel. Dustin Pedroia is the guy in sales, yukking it up with everyone he sees and scoring sales for the firm, while J.D. Drew is working in the backroom in the accounting department quietly earning his keep for the firm. Maybe that is the best way for anyone to handle the game, (and lets not forget, that is what it is, a game). Or maybe it is just the best way for him to handle the game. After all, we need an accountant, but we need a salesman too.

 

What it isn't though, is endearing to most fans. It presents the attitude of someone who doesn't care much, who isn't utilizing all of his talents, all of his power, to milk everything that he can out of the game. Is that the case? I don't know. But if his peers are calling him an underachiever, that is quite the indictment that there is more behind his attitude than the "consummate professional." That would insinuate apathy, which is not follwed by adoration.

 

Whether or not J.D. Drew is underachieving has everything to do with this discussion.

[Dipre]

Yeah. I know. It's probably not really fair to call him on it because all he's really doing here is playing devil's advocate, largely out of boredom.

 

I know a backpedal when I see one. God knows I do them enough myself. A700 got caught up in the argument and now wants to extricate himself from a position he found himself in by implcation and got stuck into by not making it clear enough that that wasn't what he meant. the only people who don't need to do that from time to time are delusional idiots.

 

He said "i don't mean to bash JD" like 40 times.

[a700hitter]

I know exactly which game you are talking about. I'm proving a point. Please tell me the game and the alleged inning he asked out.

 

you must have hated it when Manny threw that AB against Rivera last season.

Yes, I did hate when Manny threw that AB. Couldn't prove it, but when i was watching it I suspected it.

[Dipre]

It is relevant towards a discussion of him getting his "due" (whatever that is), as a player's image is a very important part of how that player, employee, politician, person, is judged by his friends, coworkers, peers, media, etc...

 

When will A-Rod get his due?

 

I play soccer at a fairly competitive level, with some former low level pros and a lot of other players who are half decent but just think they are better than they are.

 

I am not the most skilled soccer player. I have the first touch of a rapist and no matter what I do on the field, I can NOT put the ball in the net.

 

What I AM, is the hardest, smartest worker on the field every time I step on it. The way I play commands the respect of everyone else on the field. Why? Because on that field I am an overachiever. I do more than I should be able to with the talent that I have been given.

 

In life, we tend to gravitate towards the little guy- the Dustin Pedroia who will never make it in the bigs, the Wes Welker type who manages to cut between players with feet on him in size and hundreds of pounds in weight. We root for the 15 seed busting its ass to beat that full-of-itself 2 that would have been a 1 if it had hit its potential. Personally, I can not STAND playing ball with players who are blessed with talent and are no better than I am because they don't work hard enough and don't try hard enough.

 

Maybe J.D. Drew is the consummate professional- handling the game like a job rather than a passion, always on an even keel. Dustin Pedroia is the guy in sales, yukking it up with everyone he sees and scoring sales for the firm, while J.D. Drew is working in the backroom in the accounting department quietly earning his keep for the firm. Maybe that is the best way for anyone to handle the game, (and lets not forget, that is what it is, a game). Or maybe it is just the best way for him to handle the game. After all, we need an accountant, but we need a salesman too.

 

What it isn't though, is endearing to most fans. It presents the attitude of someone who doesn't care much, who isn't utilizing all of his talents, all of his power, to milk everything that he can out of the game. Is that the case? I don't know. But if his peers are calling him an underachiever, that is quite the indictment that there is more behind his attitude than the "consummate professional." That would insinuate apathy, which is not follwed by adoration.

 

Whether or not J.D. Drew is underachieving has everything to do with this discussion.

 

So his production correlates to his "showing passion" and "showing everyone he's a hard worker"?

 

This makes no sense.

 

Do you know how many guys are despised by their teammates and even the fans sometimes but they put up with it because the guy can produce?

 

Manny, Clemens, and A-Rod is beloved by everyone.

 

Smiles and celebrations don't matter. What matters is production. You're taking this to the level of ridicule to be honest.

[a700hitter]

Yeah. I know. It's probably not really fair to call him on it because all he's really doing here is playing devil's advocate, largely out of boredom.

 

I know a backpedal when I see one. God knows I do them enough myself. A700 got caught up in the argument and now wants to extricate himself from a position he found himself in by implcation and got stuck into by not making it clear enough that that wasn't what he meant. the only people who don't need to do that from time to time are delusional idiots.

Exactly what argument did I get caught up in? Here is my only substantive post in this thread about JD. I don't think it engages any argument, so there is nothing from which to be extricated.

 

http://www.talksox.com/forum/486380-post217.html

 

I think you need to back pedal from your unfounded snarkiness.

[yankees228]

which of the three are you referring to?

 

(i know which one im making a point though)

 

His Game 5 last year was OK.

[Paradisecity]

So his production correlates to his "showing passion" and "showing everyone he's a hard worker"?

 

This makes no sense.

 

Do you know how many guys are despised by their teammates and even the fans sometimes but they put up with it because the guy can produce?

 

Manny, Clemens, and A-Rod is beloved by everyone.

 

Smiles and celebrations don't matter. What matters is production. You're taking this to the level of ridicule to be honest.

 

Why are you so focused on production? This conversation is about J.D. Drew's appreciation level (which is silly in itself, as we as fans shouldn't really need to have conversations as to whether we are appreciating enough someone who gets paid 14M a season to play a f***ing baseball game)

 

 

Do A-Rod's peers call him an underachiever?

 

And the reason 700 thinks you might be angry is because any time anybody disagrees with you about anything, you respond with words like ludicrous, ridicule, THIS, FAIL, and a tone that presents yourself as an angry, self-righteous person in a Bill O'Reilly-like manner.

[Dipre]

Why are you so focused on production? This conversation is about J.D. Drew's appreciation level (which is silly in itself, as we as fans shouldn't really need to have conversations as to whether we are appreciating enough someone who gets paid 14M a season to play a f***ing baseball game)

 

 

Do A-Rod's peers call him an underachiever?

 

And the reason 700 thinks you might be angry is because any time anybody disagrees with you about anything, you respond with words like ludicrous, ridicule, THIS, FAIL, and a tone that presents yourself as an angry, self-righteous person in a Bill O'Reilly-like manner.

 

Paradisecity, stop playing victim.

 

There's not self-righteousness in my tone.

 

AM I SPEAKING IN ALL CAPS?

 

Have i insulted you?

 

I'm so focused on production because, to win baseball games, you need to, you know, score runs. That's reason number 1.

 

And other than that, is JD Drew a clubhouse cancer like Manny was?

 

Is he a media whore like A-Rod is?

 

Or is he a man whose brain is directly connected to his mouth like the Sheff?

 

Maybe a lying, cheating bastard like Clemens?

 

As i suppose you have answered "none of the above", i believe that every ballplayer is entitled to have their own personality as long as they don't stir s*** up in the clubhouse.

 

I will now end this with a smiley to avoid further confrontation.

[Paradisecity]

Paradisecity, stop playing victim.

 

 

 

As i suppose you have answered "none of the above", i believe that every ballplayer is entitled to have their own personality as long as they don't stir s*** up in the clubhouse.

 

I will now end this with a smiley to avoid further confrontation.

 

I dont think I'm a victim. I am explaining to you why people take offense to your posts, since recently you seemed so confused as to why and were offering to call tribal council votes to be voted out. Take it constructively. Or don't. Up to you. Thanks for the smiley though.

 

On the topic: I completely agree with you, a player should be able to have whatever personality serves them best.

 

Would it anger you if you were running a business and had a very good employee who was your highest paid employee and was doing a very good job but could be doing much much better? Because his peers seem to think he could be doing much much better.

 

Some people would be content with the very good job. Others would be upset at the lack of peak performance.

[Dipre]

I dont think I'm a victim. I am explaining to you why people take offense to your posts, since recently you seemed so confused as to why and were offering to call tribal council votes to be voted out. Take it constructively. Or don't. Up to you. Thanks for the smiley though.

 

On the topic: I completely agree with you, a player should be able to have whatever personality serves them best.

 

Would it anger you if you were running a business and had a very good employee who was your highest paid employee and was doing a very good job but could be doing much much better? Because his peers seem to think he could be doing much much better.

 

Some people would be content with the very good job. Others would be upset at the lack of peak performance.

 

I'm not paying his peers to discuss how he does his job.

 

I have indicators to show me whether he is or isn't doing a good job.

 

I'm not trying to be a dick, but ballplayers are paid to either hit or throw a ball, not make assessments of their fellow ballplayers.

 

Besides, i need to know where did this information comes from, as well as its reliability, and sorting out if there might be an agenda behind the whole deal.

[Paradisecity]

I'm not paying his peers to discuss how he does his job.

 

I have indicators to show me whether he is or isn't doing a good job.

 

I'm not trying to be a dick, but ballplayers are paid to either hit or throw a ball, not make assessments of their fellow ballplayers.

 

Besides, i need to know where did this information comes from, as well as its reliability, and sorting out if there might be an agenda behind the whole deal.

 

 

It was a survey of 380 ballplayers- http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1159222/index.htm

 

They cite it in that same article lauding him that was printed earlier in the season.

 

OK- a couple direct questions- Would you agree that professional baseball players have a better understanding of baseball talent than we do?

 

Would you be ok with that employee situation as discussed earlier- or would you be upset?

 

Personally, I'm not sure where I would fit there. Kind of upset I think but I would still understand he is doing a good job. I think Id say to myself "ok, whatever, he could do better, but he does well"

 

And that is how I feel about J.D. Drew. "Ok, whatever. He could do better, but he does well."

 

I didn't hate the Drew signing, and I still don't. But I don't sit in my room masturbating to my J.D. Drew starting lineup figure either.

 

Do they still make starting lineup figures?

[Dojji]

OK- a couple direct questions- Would you agree that professional baseball players have a better understanding of baseball talent than we do?

 

Depends on the ballplayer. The smart ones, the leaders, absolutely. But as sabermetric analysis becomes more and more available, I'd say the gap is narrowing even there, A lot of the worst idiots on the national broadcasting scene were former ballplayers, including the icon of the category, Joe Morgan.

[ORS]

I would say baseball players can recognize talent, but I'm skeptical of their ability measure acheivement. Therefore, it's possible that they are underappreciating what JD provides to his team relative to the expectations they have of the talent they observe.

[Dipre]

It was a survey of 380 ballplayers- http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1159222/index.htm

 

They cite it in that same article lauding him that was printed earlier in the season.

 

OK- a couple direct questions- Would you agree that professional baseball players have a better understanding of baseball talent than we do?

Would you be ok with that employee situation as discussed earlier- or would you be upset?

 

Personally, I'm not sure where I would fit there. Kind of upset I think but I would still understand he is doing a good job. I think Id say to myself "ok, whatever, he could do better, but he does well"

 

And that is how I feel about J.D. Drew. "Ok, whatever. He could do better, but he does well."

 

I didn't hate the Drew signing, and I still don't. But I don't sit in my room masturbating to my J.D. Drew starting lineup figure either.

 

Do they still make starting lineup figures?

 

That, in particular, i'm torn about. And i'm not quick to trust something i can't prove or disprove.

 

About the workplace, if you're the boss, you're the boss because you have the best understanding of each employee's performance, and you don't need other workers to tell you.

 

They don't make lineup figures anymore iirc, and no one here masturbates to JD Drew, in my case, i just think the Drew hate is unjustified while at the same time giving plenty of food for baseball discussion. And that's what we're here for, after all.

[Paradisecity]

I would say baseball players can recognize talent' date=' but I'm skeptical of their ability measure acheivement. Therefore, it's possible that they are underappreciating what JD provides to his team relative to the expectations they have of the talent they observe.[/quote']

 

This probably has merit to it.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Someone calls him Nancy and people pop a blood vessel. Do we have to be so serious?

 

I don't know, do we?

[Paradisecity]

Who is Coco's Dicksickles? Those quotes are hysterical

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Who is Coco's Dicksickles? Those quotes are hysterical

Some hilarious troll who came on here last night, made a couple of threads (one of them titled 'WHATS YOUR FAVORITE LITTLE DEBBIE SNACK', which had me rofling for a good five minutes) with the usual troll stuff. Threads were deleted.

[Paradisecity]

Wow Im laughing out loud right now. Why would those get deleted? That is comedy gold.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Wow Im laughing out loud right now. Why would those get deleted? That is comedy gold.

I am a fool

[Paradisecity]

WHAT IS YOUR FAVORITE LITTLE DEBBY SNACK?

 

Sorry i just wanted to write that so I could laugh even more.

 

Mine is probably the Peanut Butter Bars.

[Dipre]

He also says he loves Coco's Disciples and that Coco loves him back.

 

Hilarious.

[Paradisecity]

Is he banned?

[Dipre]

Is he banned?

 

Of course he's banned, i'm pretty confident he was also that Javier Lopez guy.