Sammy Sosa tries out for Texas at Ameriquest Field

[riverside sluggers]

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070115&content_id=1779599&vkey=hotstove2006&fext=.jsp

 

Great PR move by Texas I thought they had moved on from accused juiced sluggers (ie Canseco, Palmeiro)

[jacksonianmarch]

I hope he goes there, does well, then fails a steroid test. That would leave McGwire, Palmeiro, and Sosa out of the hall with HOF #s due to roids.

[rician blast]

I hope he goes there' date=' does well, then fails a steroid test. That would leave McGwire, Palmeiro, and Sosa out of the hall with HOF #s due to roids.[/quote']

 

It'd be kind of justice, but I'd be more comfortable with the above if EVERY player who ever used perfomance enhancing drugs were exposed, as opposed to only those who stand out because they were already exceptionally good.

[Mr Crunchy]

sosa didnt hit 20 hrs in baltimore in his last season

however

if roids are the question then 2 years of being clean should help him

look what it did for the GIAMBINO

ny tried everything to dump him but at the end of it all he is admired and worshipped for his courage and was is the comeback player of the year

 

lets not be hypocrites

if sosa can play i'd love to see him boston as opposed to signing dl drew

[jacksonianmarch]

Even Giambi was a guy who had high SLG's in the minors prior to using. I feel Giambi would never be the same player without the drugs, but he would still have some power in the bigs. Sosa barely scraped .400 in SLG in the minors. He was a 6' 160 something pound kid who seemed to balloon to 220 rather quickly. He of all people was someone who went from being a no power OFer to a power star quickly.

 

I dunno. Giambi's admission while nobody else admitted is a big step for me. Then his half assed apology was still an apology. It is guys like McGwire, Sosa and Palmeiro that make me sick, because we know what they did, they just keep refusing to acknowledge it.

[TheKilo]

Even Giambi was a guy who had high SLG's in the minors prior to using. I feel Giambi would never be the same player without the drugs, but he would still have some power in the bigs. Sosa barely scraped .400 in SLG in the minors. He was a 6' 160 something pound kid who seemed to balloon to 220 rather quickly. He of all people was someone who went from being a no power OFer to a power star quickly.

 

I dunno. Giambi's admission while nobody else admitted is a big step for me. Then his half assed apology was still an apology. It is guys like McGwire, Sosa and Palmeiro that make me sick, because we know what they did, they just keep refusing to acknowledge it.

 

Did I miss something? When did Giambi admit to using PED's?

[jacksonianmarch]

in court. He was the only one and was granted immunity.

[VA Sox Fan]

lets not be hypocrites

if sosa can play i'd love to see him boston as opposed to signing dl drew

 

 

Speak for yourself Seano. I wouldn't want that corked-bat, "I all of a sudden can't speak English" roid using tool on the Red Sox.

[Mr Crunchy]

im speaking for myself

i dont care what a guy does to his body to get on the field

i admire the man who gives a new meaning to the term team ""chemistry"" and puts the game above his own personal health.

this is the most unselfish thing one can do

 

imagine

willfully shrinking your testicles so you can perform better??

my god what sacrifice,what a teamate

 

id just as soon stick my dick in a ronco vegomatic as an anoblic steroid in my veins

 

i hope the kids are watching at home

[example1]

sosa didnt hit 20 hrs in baltimore in his last season

however

if roids are the question then 2 years of being clean should help him

look what it did for the GIAMBINO

ny tried everything to dump him but at the end of it all he is admired and worshipped for his courage and was is the comeback player of the year

 

lets not be hypocrites

if sosa can play i'd love to see him boston as opposed to signing dl drew

 

Hypocrites? Are you kidding me Mr. Cruchy? What in god's name makes you think Giambi is clean? Giambi has used steroids the ENTIRE time he's been in the majors. I remember it was in "Game of Shadows" that he began using in the minors to give him the extra "edge" and his testimony is also cited (partially, at least) here:

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=1936592

 

"Both Giambis said they had used steroids even earlier in their baseball careers [i.e., pre-BALCO]. They were granted immunity from prosecution if they told the truth to the grand jury but faced perjury charges if they did not."

 

Giambi uses steroids. I have no doubt in my mind. He stopped when he got the "parasite", sucked for awhile, then started again. If he was involved in BALCO then he can get the s*** you can't catch. He's still putting up average-guy takes steroids numbers, at the very least.

 

To me, JD Drew seems to put up numbers that LEGITIMATE, NO ROIDED OFs should put up. He's also injured a lot, which could go either way. I thought Drew could have used roids earlier in his career but I see little reason to think he does now. 20HR, 90 RBI, .400 OBP with + defense are excellent numbers in the pre-steroid era 70's or 80's. Those are SOLID numbers for an OF. He has most of the numbers of a guy like Abreu, with a little less speed, more 'natural' power (less roid power), tremendous OBP, solid defense.

 

People get on Drew because he gets injured randomly (like a normal person) and puts up numbers like a non-roided player always did. If MLB is really moving toward banning people for roids and developing tests for HGH etc., and IF Drew is clean, then I think its a move of tremendous foresight to secure a player like that for the long term. Why would you want guys who's only good seasons happened with roids and amphetmines and hormones when there are players who don't need that and put up good numbers.

 

Even Giambi was a guy who had high SLG's in the minors prior to using. I feel Giambi would never be the same player without the drugs, but he would still have some power in the bigs. Sosa barely scraped .400 in SLG in the minors. He was a 6' 160 something pound kid who seemed to balloon to 220 rather quickly. He of all people was someone who went from being a no power OFer to a power star quickly.

 

I dunno. Giambi's admission while nobody else admitted is a big step for me. Then his half assed apology was still an apology. It is guys like McGwire, Sosa and Palmeiro that make me sick, because we know what they did, they just keep refusing to acknowledge it.

 

Giambi's admission? When under threat of perjury under a Federal Grand Jury trial? Having it 'leaked' to the public and then giving a half-assed apology. Yeah, he's a moral champion.

 

Here's what he did: he cheated in the minors by taking steroids and becoming a hulking power hitter with a well-above average eye. He used and used in Oakland, brought the team to the playoffs (almost beating your team once, right?) and then YOUR team purchased him, 7 years for 120 million dollars. Then, to make matters worse, he continues using and develops some weird parasite and is essentially useless for a season. he gets threatened to go to the minors and, despite the steroid scandal, LOW AND BEHOLD, Giambi starts hitting again! vapid eyes, greasy hair, intensity beyond belief, 10+ season roid user. 20 bombs in a month and a half or something absurd. He's a hero Jacksonian. What a joke.

[Mr Crunchy]

giambi,the son of a doctor mind you,undoubdelty was involved in roids thruout his career

however

since he testified in front of the senate with the guarantee of immunity i personally believe hes been clean rather than risking his 80,000,000.00 deal with the yankees.

 

the year after they started testing he was unable to perform at all

18 months afterwards he started hitting again

this is a classic sign that he used,quit and then healed up

this s*** dont happen overnite

testoserone and growth hormones are nothing to mess with

 

anyways

id bet that jason giambi is clean and has been clean for a couple years now

if he is still juicing??

he maybe the biggest f***ing idiot on the planet

[jacksonianmarch]

from what I know, the muscle bulk doesnt go away after stopping steroids. I'll tell you what, I'd highly doubt Giambi is using again.

[example1]

giambi,the son of a doctor mind you,undoubdelty was involved in roids thruout his career

however

since he testified in front of the senate with the guarantee of immunity i personally believe hes been clean rather than risking his 80,000,000.00 deal with the yankees.

 

the year after they started testing he was unable to perform at all

18 months afterwards he started hitting again

this is a classic sign that he used,quit and then healed up

this s*** dont happen overnite

testoserone and growth hormones are nothing to mess with

 

anyways

id bet that jason giambi is clean and has been clean for a couple years now

if he is still juicing??

he maybe the biggest f***ing idiot on the planet

 

The whole point of the most current 'steroid' (actually PEDs or hormones) controversy is that all of the drugs were absolutely undectable. They took drugs to regulate the indicators of positive drug use. Giambi was at the center of it and had access to the exact same stuff that Bonds did, which was provided to track and field stars and other baseball players and football players. Undetectable. Still undectable.

 

Again, I have no doubt that Giambi still uses whatsoever. I believe Bonds still uses. Clearly he still uses amphetamines, as he tested positive last year. I think your argument is weak and that you really ought to assume that Giambi, a guy who only MADE it to the MLB because of steroids, is still juicing and is, therefore (according to your theory) the biggest f***ing idiot on the planet (except for those who still root for Giambi and his ilk). Sosa included.

[jacksonianmarch]

example, his "tumor" was considered to be potentially caused by steroid use. He already had a very rich deal, he was set for life and he was already a mockery in the eyes of the public, so getting into the HOF was not something he was worried about. There was no earthly reason to assume that he is taking them again. What would he have to gain aside from fans adulation?

[VA Sox Fan]

The whole point of the most current 'steroid' (actually PEDs or hormones) controversy is that all of the drugs were absolutely undectable. They took drugs to regulate the indicators of positive drug use. Giambi was at the center of it and had access to the exact same stuff that Bonds did, which was provided to track and field stars and other baseball players and football players. Undetectable. Still undectable.

 

 

How did Palmiero get caught if they are undectable?

[jacksonianmarch]

he took winstrol, which is a very detectable anabolic steroid. I was surprised he tested positive for that. It wasnt the cream and clear stuff.

[example1]

How did Palmiero get caught if they are undectable?

 

Not all performance enhancing drugs are undetectable. Steroids, in particular, are not. The high tech combinations of HGH and stimulent and supplements have very solid masking properties if you follow a rigorous schedule (which most athletes with personal trainers are able to do). Palmeiro just failed a drug test.

[Mr Crunchy]

Again, I have no doubt that Giambi still uses whatsoever. I believe Bonds still uses. Clearly he still uses amphetamines, as he tested positive last year. I think your argument is weak and that you really ought to assume that Giambi, a guy who only MADE it to the MLB because of steroids, is still juicing and is, therefore (according to your theory) the biggest f***ing idiot on the planet (except for those who still root for Giambi and his ilk). Sosa included

 

i allude to the fact that his father is a doctor

i allude to the fact that he and he alone admitted use under immunity in front of the united states senate

i allude to the fact that he fell off the face of the earth when testing began due to him having all the testosterone of brian boitano

and again

it took him what??15-18 to recover

if he was still involved in an 8 week cycle of roids he wouldnt have fallen as hard as he did and it wouldnt have taken him 18 mos of recovery to get his s*** together

his #s never wouldve declined had he continued doing what he was doing

 

you sir are speculating that he is still using with your proof being??

that he did it before

i on the other hand say otherwise and would suggest that he would retire or get dl'd or cut before he testified in front of congress and held a press conference essentially admitting his guilt....

 

im not naive

nor do i give a fiddlers f***

i just dont think this specific man at this specific time is using roids

and hasnt for a couple years

[example1]

Again, I have no doubt that Giambi still uses whatsoever. I believe Bonds still uses. Clearly he still uses amphetamines, as he tested positive last year. I think your argument is weak and that you really ought to assume that Giambi, a guy who only MADE it to the MLB because of steroids, is still juicing and is, therefore (according to your theory) the biggest f***ing idiot on the planet (except for those who still root for Giambi and his ilk). Sosa included

 

i allude to the fact that his father is a doctor

i allude to the fact that he and he alone admitted use under immunity in front of the united states senate

i allude to the fact that he fell off the face of the earth when testing began due to him having all the testosterone of brian boitano

and again

it took him what??15-18 to recover

if he was still involved in an 8 week cycle of roids he wouldnt have fallen as hard as he did and it wouldnt have taken him 18 mos of recovery to get his s*** together

his #s never wouldve declined had he continued doing what he was doing

 

you sir are speculating that he is still using with your proof being??

that he did it before

i on the other hand say otherwise and would suggest that he would retire or get dl'd or cut before he testified in front of congress and held a press conference essentially admitting his guilt....

 

im not naive

nor do i give a fiddlers f***

i just dont think this specific man at this specific time is using roids

and hasnt for a couple years

 

What the hell does it matter that his father is a doctor?

 

What makes me think that Giambi is on roids is:

 

a) He admitted that he only used roids, initially, to give himself power way back in the minors.

Giambi had significant power when he was admittedly on the roids, and felt that he needed roids to have power or else he wouldn't have used them.

c) Giambi's numbers last year were as good as they were in 1999, when he admittedly used (Same OPS as in 1999, .975, in 2005. .971 in 2006).

 

How come every other player has some form of a power lapse when they supposedly stop steroids? Is Giambi some sort of freak of nature, where he's as good, if not BETTER without steroids? Is this guy really just Babe Ruth, and without the steroids we would be talking hall of fame? I don't think so.

 

I'm not willing to give the guy chance after chance after chance. He used, he quite, he sucked, then he suddenly got good again.

 

Does he look smaller to you? Does he look like many of the notable players who appeared to come off of steroids? I don't think so. I think he looks like the exact same beefcake that he was in 1999 or 2002. He looks like Mark MacGwire, with the buldging neck and veins.

 

Why do you guys insist on sweeping this s*** under the rug? Why do you pretend to take the moral high road by not guessing, when, in fact, the person we're talking about is a KNOWN steroid user for his ENTIRE career?

 

Do you think the writers who didn't talk about steroids in the 90's were taking the moral high ground, or were they shirking their intellectual/professional responsibility? I think they were conveniently overlooking something that would have been a tarnish on the game, and I think you're overlooking something that would be a tarnish on your team (jacksonian) or on the game itself (Crunchy).

[Mr Crunchy]

How come every other player has some form of a power lapse when they supposedly stop steroids? Is Giambi some sort of freak of nature, where he's as good, if not BETTER without steroids? Is this guy really just Babe Ruth, and without the steroids we would be talking hall of fame? I don't think so.

 

anyone who can turn on a 95mph heater is a freak of nature

 

im not sweeping anything under the rug

we had a f***ing congressional investigation in the middle of a f***ing war to determine if millionaires took performance enhancing drugs

we spent more money investigation steroids than we did prosecuting criminals for 9-11

 

i think its a waste of time

and i want my congressman focuesed on issues that matter to me most

jobs healthcare educating our kids,ending the war in iraq,keeping the chicanos in chicanoland etc...

 

i dont give a f***

but again

 

i dont think giambi is using roids right now

you sir have no proof,none at all

despite what your eyes and everyone who called weei's whiner line say

no one has proven s***

i for 1 would like to hear something original in regards to his supposed recent use of roids

 

as far as his #s go

ny had the best lineup in history over the last 2 years

he plays in the shortest park for a left handed hitter in the game

the only question i have is why hasnt he hit 60

 

nothing would make me happier than see jason giambi disgraced in front of the entire baseball world

nothing

i just dont think the guy is that stupid to hang himself out there for that kind of ridicule but ive been wrong before

 

as far as tarnishing the game goes

it survived ty cobb the black sox kennesaw landis 100 years of segregation and tim mccarver

this too shall pass

[jacksonianmarch]

I almost spit out my soda when I read McCarver.

[HeadOfSoxNation]

 

I dunno. Giambi's admission while nobody else admitted is a big step for me. Then his half assed apology was still an apology. It is guys like McGwire, Sosa and Palmeiro that make me sick, because we know what they did, they just keep refusing to acknowledge it.

 

Ridiculous...I'm sick of Yankee fans kissing Giambi's ass for his "admission"...and his "apology". They make it sound like Giambi figured out that this was becoming an epidemic in baseball, decided to draw the line in the sand, and come clean. TOTALLY not true. Giambi got f***ing CAUGHT using PEDs, and then tried to save face with a teary ******** apology which he never even specified what for. He looked like a barefoot kid running up an icy hill in that footage. He hardly deserves to be praised and, as far as I'm concerned, is in that same group with McG, Sosa, Palmiero, and all the rest.

[jacksonianmarch]

While I by no means gloss over what he did, he admitted under oath to what he did.

[example1]

While I by no means gloss over what he did' date=' he admitted under oath to what he did.[/quote']

 

And his reward is that people like you and Mr Crunchy will continue to believe that, for some reason, he's clean now.

[TheKilo]

While I by no means gloss over what he did' date=' he admitted under oath to what he did.[/quote']

 

And that's why he shouldn't be playing baseball right now.

[CrespoBlows]

And that's why he shouldn't be playing baseball right now.

 

Might as well toss out 50% of baseball.

[Ray10]

Even if he does come back he's going to suck the guy hasn't played in while and he is getting up there in age so he most likley won't do much when he comes back, that is if he even lasts. I see him either being released or in the minors all year.

[seabeachfred]

Speak for yourself Seano. I wouldn't want that corked-bat' date=' "I all of a sudden can't speak English" roid using tool on the Red Sox.[/quote']

 

VA, that was a pretty sad performance by Sosa during those congressional hearings a year ago, but the guy who really bugged me in the long run was Rafael Palmiero. I had to be naive as hell but I really believed the guy when he said he never took the roids. Imagine my stupidity and anger when I found out that he was juicing up with the best of them. The writers have a tough job when it comes to making decisions on who to admit and who to keep out. McGwuire's name is coming up again, and then there will be Palmiero, Sosa, and eventually Bonds. My gut feeling is to keep these guys out but, then again, what they did was not illegal at the time they took those drugs. Some of you might be able to say yes or no without a doubt but there are questions about the hypocrisy of keeping them out for something that was not illegal when it was done.

[TheKilo]

Might as well toss out 50% of baseball.

 

If they admit to/test positive, yes.

[example1]

If they admit to/test positive' date=' yes.[/quote']

 

I don't go that far, but if they test positive there should be an automatic kicker clause that reduces salary or allows teams to demote players to the minors or something.