moonslav59

As badly as we've been playing, we're still the a WC team right now. Toronto is the other. The Astros are trending upwards and are only 1/2 game behind. The Royals are also a 1/2 game behind, so any team behind those 4 teams has to beat 3 out of the four to make the WC. That's not impossible, but it's not easy either. The Yanks also have Detroit, Chicago and Seattle ahead of them. The Yanks also have to face Baltimore, Toronto and Boston much more often than Detroit has to face CLE & KCR or SEA has to face TEX & HOU. Is there any indication that the Yanks have the team on paper to mount a serious challenge for the WC? Their pitching has been very good, so I guess there's always a chance. They have the highest team pitching WAR in the AL right now, so I'm not writing them off, but certainly buy July 31st, they may be sellers. Some already view them as such right now as there is a lot of talk about trading Chapman and Miller.

If we don't sign him, don't we get an equal pick next year? Wouldn't that, in theory, give us another chance to draft a guy like Groome then? Who knows, the way we are playing riaght now, we may have two high picks in the next draft. Isn't next year's draft supposed to be better & deeper?

Great points. I also think that Devers is far enough away from the bigs, that Moncada will have an ample chance to establish himself as our 3bman before a choice needs to be made between him and Devers. By then, maybe Devers or Moncada might be considered as our next long term 1Bman or LF'er.,

The Sox are certainly possible buyers, but the deadline is still far away. Much can change by then, and losing two of 3 to the Rays since my post on available players has not helped anyone's belief that we should be buyers. Look, I'm sorry if I ruffled your panties by suggesting the Yanks will be sellers in July, but the Yankee trade talk is all over baseball media, MLBTRs and other sites. I don't see much chatter on Sox players being available, but that could change at any minute. It's not all about records and games behind. There have been sellers in MLB that some felt were not "out of it". There has also been buyers that many felt were all but out of it.It sucks being sellers at the deadline, and Sox fans know all about that, so maybe Yankeee fans don't. Get used to it. The Yanks will "PROBABLY" be sellers for a few more years.

Until this year, Hanigan was a pretty big plus on offense vs LHPs. With the amount of catchers going on the DL these days, even deep depth has value. I'm a huge Vaz fan, and don't care as much about offense from the catching position as most here do, but I see no harm in sending Vaz to AAA to work on his offense, and hten see how things shake out. Catchers are sometimes in high need at the deadline, so I'm all for trading one, if the price is right, but I'm no for getting rid of a catcher just to keep a sub .600 catcher on the 25 man roster. We need to keep as many catching options available for as long as possible. I still think Swihart will be our best choice blue chip trade piece this summer or winter, so having three catchers left over is just about right. What if Vaz takes another year to get his offense on track? Having Hanigan and Leon as our two catchers in 2017 may not look too sexy, but with Vaz at AAA in case one gets hurt, wouldn't be such a bad set up.

If we're out of it, we should sell Uehara and Tazawa, and if anyone wants Buch, Kelly or Hanigan, then sell them too. I'm not saying hand these guys away, and if we think we want Tazawa back next year, maybe trading him would hurt those chances, but there are several tazawa type RP'ers in the FA market every winter. We could get something pretty good for our two RP'ers. That's better than nothing. Even if we just get decent prospects, maybe we can flip those prospects this winter as part of a bigger package to land a quality pitcher. I'm not proclaiming us sellers just yet, but if we keep playing like this we might be.

And, by the way, 3.5 games at the deadline could be the difference between being "still in it" or "pretty much out of it". There's talk the Pirates are considering being sellers too. It's not always about your record. Sometimes it's about how many teams you have to leap frog, and how your team seems to be trending. Also, how much management still has faith in the current roster construction. You think the Yanks have faith in Tex, CC and ARod catching fire and leading the Yanks to the playoffs? Is there a better chance HanRam, Price and Porcello turns things around for the Sox? Maybe- maybe not. It's not really about what we think anyways, it's what upper management thinks to trigger the "sell" mode.

I meant to say "probably out of it" and merely listed the players that we might want or need on the losing-most teams in MLB at the time. I have stated a few times that I think the Sox may be sellers in July as well, so stop inventing positions I do not hold. Even if the Sox are out of it, I wouldn't mind us trying to acquire a decent pitcher under team control for 3+ seasons, but that is unlikely at deadline costs. It's very rare for a team to be a buyer and seller at the same deadline. The way things are going now, the Yanks and Sox may both be sellers at the deadline.

So, when management chose wisely, it was all luck then.

I've already mentioned the Sox may be sellers. Many reports are out on the Yanks being sellers this July. I'm not so sure you do "got it".

Yikes! I guess that would mean wait till next year.

I meant sell vets: free agents to be Uehara & Tazawa and last options Buchholz & Hanigan. Maybe Young or Kelly. I didn't mean sell the farm, unless we're talking Owens & Johnson. I'm done with those two, even though one could argue we're selling low.

We have 4 catchers right now, and if Swihart wasn't on the DL, we'd be talking what to do with him. I do not see catcher as being even close to our highest need area. Unless Milwaukee will take Hanigan (with a prospect) to help offset Lucroy's contract, I doubt we'd even consider trading for him. We need pitching first, pitching second, pitching third, then maybe LF... not catching. Plus, Lucroy will be very costly. Milwaukee will not want overpayed players in return (like Hanigan). I guess they may take Leon and prospects, but I still don't see the Sox looking at him for an offensive boost.

I'm not sure I agree that we rushed Betts. The kid was killing every level he moved up to from day one. Plus, we called him up in 2014 when we were already out of it, so what was the need "rush"? His .812 OPS in MLB those 2 months in 2014 is not evidence of being rushed. On Leon, I wouldn't be so quick to say his offense has "obviously gotten better" based on just a tiny sample size of 35 PAs. I'm not saying he can't be improving. Of course, he can be. It's natural for players to slowly improve over time, especially at, before and around the age that Leon currently is (27). Leon has been in professional baseball since age 18. That's 10 years! I'm sorry, but I'm not buying the idea that suddenly, 10 years into his career, he suddenly found the magic potion. Sure, I'm fine with slower growth, and there are cases where players have seemingly vastly improved almost overnight without apparent PED use, but more times than not, what we are seeing from Leon recently, turns out to be no more than a "flash in the pan". The odds are Leon will return to numbers much closer to his career norms (.580 MLB OPS in 270 PAs/.654 minor league OPS). One reason I am not a believer just yet, is that Leon had a .655 OPS at AAA this year in 115 PAs. This was nearly identical to his minor league career OPS, so one could argue he showed no signs of improvement prior to his call-up. However, I would argue he has shown improvement in recent years, but just not on the scale of these 35 PAs. Leon was first called up to AAA briefly in 2012 after a very lack-luster .614 OPS at the AA level in 510 PAs. Here are his AAA numbers since 2012: 2012 1.026 in 64 PAs (2013: he was returned to A- and AA ball with a .542 OPS at AA) 2014: .692 in 193 PAs/ .447 in MLB (70 PAs with the NATs) 2015: .676 in 111 PAs/.439 in 128 PAs with BOS 2016: .655 in 130 PAs at Pawtucket He's consistently been over his AA OPS every year at AAA, so I do see strong signs of improvement, but nothing massive. I think Leon projects at about .650-.675 in the bigs, and that may be generous. Can he do much better? Yes, of course he can, but I wouldn't bet on it.

What's the latest on signing our 1st round pick?

From what I've heard, Moncada has the tools to be a plus defender but is still far from plus at 2B, the position he has played for quite a while. How long would it take him to pass Shaw or Devers on defense at 3B? (Maybe too long.) It's not like plus skills in LF are wasted either.

Did you forget Uehara?

SP'er WAR: 8.8 CLE 7.8 CWS 7.2 NYY 7.1 HOU 6.9 TBR 6.5 SEA 6.4 BOS 5.9 TEX 5.9 DET 5.4 TOR 5.3 OAK 5.2 MIN 4.6 BAL 4.3 KCR 3.4 LAA RP'er 3.9 NYY 2.1 BOS 2.0 BAL 2.0 HOU 1.6 CLE 1.6 KCR 1.6 CWS 1.6 TOR 1.3 TEX 1.3 OAK 0.9 DET 0.8 SEA 0.8 LAA 0.6 MIN 0.5 TBR Pitching Total WAR 11.4 NYY 11.1 CLE 10.4 CWS 9.4 HOU 8.5 BOS 7.4 TBR 7.2 TEX 7.2 SEA 6.9 TOR 6.8 DET 6.6 OAK 6.6 BAL 5.9 KCR 5.9 MIN 4.7 LAA Do these numbers shows it's all smoke and mirrors with BAL or good coaching can make a difference?

I'm starting to entertain the idea of us becoming sellers this July. The thing is, the guys I'd put on the block are either on the DL (Holy & Swihart), severely overpaid (Ramirez), booted off the 40 man roster (Castillo & Craig), just plain unwanted (Buchholz, Brentz, Kelly, Owens & Johnson) or a combination of these situations (Sandoval).

How about Kelly, Craig and Castillo for Sabathia? Just kidding.

The Pirates mat become sellers, and Liriano may be available, although he's having a rough stretch.

I'm not saying Gray's stock has not dipped this year, but I think sometimes posters overestimate how much a player's stock rises or falls dues to a short-term injury or short period of struggles. One example I like to use is JBJ. Many Sox fans all but wrote him off, and I will admit his sample size of weak hitting was getting close to definitive, but when GMs called the Sox last winter, rumor has it they asked about JBJ. GMs are not as fickle as fans. The haul of prospects needed to get Gary may be more in July than it would have taken in January, due to the desperation of so many ball clubs today.

True, only if they are high salaried or over payed. Maybe an older pitcher on a team looking to get younger.

I could see Moncada in LF and Devers at 3B in 2-4 years, but we could also see Moncada or Devers at 1B. How well Benintendi does may force that hand.

Possible trade partners- teams that are out of it: ATL- Tehera (25) & RP Vizcaino (25) [1B- Freddie Freeman (26)] PHI- Nola (23), Eickoff (25), Velasquez (24), Hellickson (29), RP J Gomez (28) & H Neris TBR- Archer (27), Smyly (27), Odorizzi (26), Moore (27), Andriese (26) SDP- Pomeranz (27), T Ross (on DL), RP F Rodney (39) & R Buchter (29) [1B/OF W Myers (25), and salary dumps: M Kemp (31) & M Upton (31) OAK- S Gray (26), R Hill (36), RP R Dull (26), Doolittle (29) [OF Reddick (29)] AZ- RP B Ziegler (36), T Clippard (31), D Hudson (29), [1B Goldschmidt, 3B Jake Lamb (25), OF Y Tomas (25)] CIN- B Finnegan (23), D Straily (27) [J Votto (32), OF J Bruce (29), A Duvall (27)] MIL- Z Davies, J Guerra (31), RP T Thornburg (27), [OF R Braun (32)] NYY- Sabathia (35), RP Miller (31) & Chapman (28) [OF C Beltran (39)] COL- RP B Logan (31) [OF Carlos Gonzalez (30) & C Blackmon (29), 3B N Arendo (25) Then there's salary dump Verlander f the Tigers.