moonslav59

It's no secret I've never been Vaz's biggest supporter, but I have never called for his removal as our primary catcher. I think he has been a net plus, over the years, despite some down offensive seasons, here and there. I know many of you feel CERA-related data is hocus pocos, and that's fine, but I feel it needs to be pointed out after hearing all the Oooing and fawning over what a great player and clubhouse leader Vaz has been. I wish he was still on the team, but I think we got better after the deadline- both in 2022 and going forward. Bash away, if you must. It's become a habit for you. The thing I find funny, is how you, and others, bash away at so many Sox players, the manager and the GM then seem so thinned-skinned when someone criticizes just one aspect of a player you hold in esteem.

People just looked at Vaz being traded and lept to the conclusion we were giving up. In many ways, we were "buyers and sellers," something I suggested was a real possibility. In a rather remarkable way, the Sox seemed to get better for 2022 and beyond, at the same time. Catcher: looks like they got worse for 2 months of 2022 but better or deeper for 2023 and 2024. Giving up Diekman, alone, was a plus, by itself. 1B: They improved immensely in 2022, at no financial cost. They improved in 2023 and 2024, at least in 1B depth and choices. They gave up Groome, so the future might have taken a hit, if he amounts to anything. OF: Pham was certainly an improvement for 2022, and he has an option for 2023: win-win. Who the PTBNL is might hurt the long term. Farm: We lost Groome, who might not have been protected, next year, anyway and the PTBNL for Pham. We added Valdez, Abreu and Almonte- all doing very well, this year: Enmauel Valdez 1.017 OPS in 2022 1.043 AAA WOR (29 AB) .907 AAA Sugar Land (159 AB) 1.112 AA (168 ABs) 25 HRs and 89 RBI in just 458 ABs Wilyer Abreu .842 in '22 .858 AA CC (329 ABs) .648 AA POR (27 ABs) 15 HRs and 56 RBI in 356 ABs Abraham Almonte .942 in '22 .1.037 AAA WOR (56) .913 AAA NAS (184) I'd say the future looks much brighter, while the here and now is, at worst, the same. For this, not surprisingly, Bloom has taken a lot of criticism, mostly from fans who have bashed this team as being losers almost from day one. Again, not surprisingly.

It was actually the most unproductive hits I've ever seen. Only the Sox can fail to score from 3B on a single. (That has to be rarer than a no-hitter.)

I think they figured returning pitchers from the IL were like team additions. Of course, the Sale injury occurred beofre the deadline. BTW, I thought, when we signed Paxton, he was due back in July or August.

I forgot the date, I said that your team would begin a pitching slump. My guess is, I got lucky and your team has a significantly worse ERA and FIP after that date that took on a life of its own on this discussion board.

Are you sure it's not just a "pitching slump?"

It looks like the Astros are alternating catchers, and if anything, Vaz is their back-up, so far. How is that working out for them?

He probably has a big hand on deciding who is called up to replace injured players, too., in other words, is part of roster construction decisions, I would not be surprised, if Bloom or any other top brass person tells Cora who to play and where. I'm not even sure they give many forceful suggestions. I'm sure they have discussions about choices, but Cora is the manager.

Interesting negotiation tactic.

Makes me wonder, if he's done it before, and that was part of the reason he started out so well.

Enmauel Valdez 1.017 OPS in 2022 1.043 AAA WOR (29 AB) .907 AAA Sugar Land (159 AB) 1.112 AA (168 ABs) 25 HRs and 89 RBI in just 458 ABs Wilyer Abreu .842 in '22 .858 AA CC (329 ABs) .648 AA POR (27 ABs) 15 HRs and 56 RBI in 356 ABs Abraham Almonte .942 in '22 .1.037 AAA WOR (56) .913 AAA NAS (184) Pham .784 BOS (44) .694 CIN (340) Hosmer .686 BOS (19) .727 SDP (335) McGuire .967 BOS (15) .546 SDP (151)

DD extended Bogey. I think he jumps at this chance to bring him to Philly. Correa goes to NYY, after the get eliminated in the playoffs. Turner stays in LA. The Sox end up with Swanson. 2020-2022 Defensive Numbers: UZR/150 4. Story 3.8 8. Bogey 3.2 9. Correa 2.5 16. Turner 1.0 17. Swanson 0.6 21. Gregorius -1.1 23. T Anderson -3.3 DRS 1. Correa 29 7. Story 15 10. Swanson 6 18. Anderson -2 23. Turner -7 24. Bogey -9 26. Gregorius -18 fWAR 20-22 1. T Turner 13.8 4. Swanson 10.5 5. Bogey 10.5 7. Anderson 9.3 8. Correa 9.2 14. Story 6.9 OPS 2. Turner .903 4. Bogey .852 6. Anderson .799 7. Correa .799 10. Story .792 11. Swanson .787 24. Gregorius .670

Maybe we should have kept Dalbec at 3B and traded Devers.

Kavadas got his walk, but made the last out.

4 down with 48 to go. Here's what we have left: 2 more v NYY (Monday off) then a 6 game road trip ( 3 v PIT/ 3 v BAL- big chance to make serious gains) day off then a 6 game homestand (3 v TOR/ 3 V TBR- another big chance.) squeeze a 3 game road series v MIN (another team ahead of us) no days off back home to start SEP (no days off) for 4 v TEX (still no day off) 3 at TBR, ending a 16 day streak day off 3 at BAL day off 2 v NYY at BOS day off 3 v KCR at home day off (4th day off in 12 days!) Finish well rested... @ CIN 3 @NYY 3 BAL 4 @ TOR 3 TBR 3

Just 4 down from the last WC game with 48 to play! These guys Bloom picked up are playing like Schwarber, Iggy and Shaw!

...and all we got was some guy who made 2 outs in 6 PAs and failed to hit an HR in 4 of the 6 PAs, tonight, plus some other guy with an OPS b elow .900.

Oh, MY!

It's called a pitching slump. Ask jacko about them.

McGuinn and McGuire couldn't get no higher But that's what they were aimin' at And no one's gettin' fat except Mama Cass

You've lost the best record to the Astros. These games matter. You traded away some of your future- not the big prospect guns, but some good ones, for the here and now. If you come up short, what next? Do you guys go all in in 2023? Do you take the plunge with Judge and sign another big FA and trade a big SS prospect for a pitcher and or SS, or do you get stuck in the never-never tweener land you always caution the Sox about getting sucked into?

Here is the final report on Vaz, as compared to other Sox catchers and how well our pitchers did with him or others catching them. Call it CERA. Call it staff-handling. Call it whatever you want, but almost all of these numbers point in one direction: other catchers got more from our pitchers than Vaz did. This doesn't mean the others were better, overall, or that Vaz did not deserve to start or that he sucked as a catcher. It just shows one aspect of a catchers job and how Vaz compares to other on the Sox. I listed all Sox catchers who had sample sizes larger than 40 IP. One can argue 40-80 or 100 IP sample sizes are too small, and it's a good point, but when they almost all point in the same direction, and the samples with 100+ IP each all show the same thing, I think the numbers speak for themselves. Total IP as a Sox Pitcher CERA Pitcher (IP with catcher) 6 Highest IP Starting Pitchers: 964 Porcello 3.95 Hanigan (55) 4.19 Leon (576) 4.93 Swihart (112) 4.96 Vaz (211) 5.38 Holaday (82) 857 ERod 3.78 Hanigan (50) 4.05 Leon (118) 4.18 Vaz (614) 4.44 Swihart (75) 588 Price 2.96 Leon (204) 4.27 Vaz (360) 568 Sale 2.51 AJ Pier (226) 2.79 Leon (436) 4.08 Vaz (132) 446 Eovaldi 3.40 Plawecki (177) 4.53 Leon (44) 4.64 Vaz (176) 423 Buccholz 2.83 VMart (241) 3.01 Leon (155) 3.95 Salty (207) 4.44 Vaz (118) 5.63 AJ Pier. (62) Summary: Vaz 0.80 to 1.00 higher than Leon & Hanigan with Porcello (Significantly higher) Vaz 0.40 to 0.15 higher than Leon & Hanigan with ERod (Very close) Vaz 1.30 higher than Leon with Price (Way higher) Vaz 1.30 to 1.50 higher than Leon & AJ P with Sale(Way higher) Vaz 0.10 higher than Leon, but 1.25 higher than Plawecki with Eovaldi(Higher) Vaz 0.50 to 1.60 higher than Leon, Salty & VMart with Buchholz(Much higher) All 6 did better with others- 4 by a lot, 1 by kinda a lot and 1 close (ERod) The next tier Starters (some as SP & RP): 359 Kelly 3.23 Vaz (98) 4.48 Swi (74) 4.63 Leon (56) 4.83 Hanigan (91) 334 Wright 2.94 Hanigan (95) 3.49 Vaz (95) 4.06 Swihart (71) 5.83 Leon (59) 316 Pomeranz 3.32 Holaday (41) 3.92 Vaz (198) 6.02 Leon (46) 295 Pivetta 3.41 Plawecki (63) 4.55 Vaz (221) Summary:' Vaz much better with Kelly Vaz about in the middle with Wright & Pom Vaz worse with Pivetta Looks about dead even, here Relief Pitchers: 412 Barnes 3.83 Leon (99) 3.96 Vaz (216) 4.50 Swi (42) 266 Workman 3.04 Vaz (136) 3.83 Leon (54) 4.03 AJ Pier, (45) 258 Hembree 3.42 Leon (92) 4.26 Vaz (106) 184 Kimbrel 1.94 Leon (79) 1.95 Vaz (88) Summary: Looks about even here, too. Overall, Vaz did about the same with the second tier SP'ers and the top RP'ers, but much worse with the top 6 SP'ers from 2014-2022. Take it for what it is. I still liked Vaz as a catcher, for us, but I think these numbers take away some of the shine.

Here are some interesting numbers: BB- K's 83-107 Kavadas (.468 OBP) 52-56 Hickey (.422) Northcut (.281 OBP/ .513 SLG) 28 HRs 42 XBHs 32 singles

Valdez is now 4 for 4, with 2 HRs and 6 RBI. Vaz, who???

Of course, he bears some responsibility. How much is what could be what the discussion is about. You brought up the payroll being high, but how much of that is on Bloom? 2020: Bloom's spending was less than what he was forced to dump. Should he have been expected to improve the team by spending less than what he had to trade away? 2021: He spent about $40M- almost all on 1 year deals: $10M Richards $8M Ottavino (trade that brought us German) $7M x 2 Kike $5M Perez (a year too early) $3M Renfroe (a spectacular signing made with money saved in Beni deal) $3M Marwin $2M Andriese $1.5M x 2 Sawamura and a bunch of min salary deals. Bloom carried over or added min salaries that included Pivetta, Whitlock, Verdugo, Arroyo and others Out of $180M on the opening day player payroll, over $130 was DD's & Ben's: 25.6 Sale (out all year) 22.0 JD 20.0 Bogey 17.0 Nate 16. Price 10.0 ERod 4.6 Devers 4.6 Vaz 4.5 Barnes 1.6 Plawecki 1.3 Brasier The rest were min salary leftover. 2020: This was where the budget became closer to 50-50: 50% Bloom guys and 50% DD & Ben. About $225M player salary. (2022 bWAR) 25.6 Sale (0.0) 22.0 JD (0.6) 20.0 Bogey (3.9) 17.0 Nate (0.7) 16.0 Price (0.0) 11.2 Devers (4.0) 7.0 Vaz (1.9 traded away) 2.3 Plawecki (-1.3) 1.4 Brasier (-0.5) 1.0 Taylor (Injured) min Houck (1.6 T 4th best) min Crawford (1.1 6th best) Others make the total near $112.5M, which is half. Bloom's guys: 23.3 Story (2.1 injured) 10.0 Paxton (0.0 more about 2023) 9.4 Barnes (extension) 7.0 Wacha (2.2 tops on team) 7.0 Kike (0.3 injured) 5.0 Hill (0.1) 3.5 Verdugo (-0.2) 3.5 Strahm (0.2) 3.0 Pivetta (2.1 second on team) 3.0 Diekman (traded away) 1.6 Sawamura (0.8) 1.2 Arroyo (0.4) Min Whitlock (1.6 4th on team) Schreiber (2.1 third on team) Refsnyder (0.6) Davis (0.3) Cordero (-0.5) I'm not seeing Bloom making the team worse. I'm seeing a slow turnover of contracts from bad to better, overall.