ORS

Unbelievable, what a cop out.

The part where you provide an alternative primary motivation for the WBC? I've yet to see you actually stand behind a motivation and call it the primary. Stop trying to weasel out of this by calling me names and misrepresenting what I've posted. Have some balls and take a stand by some other motivation if you think I'm wrong, or tell me I'm right. Again, I concede there are secondary motivations for doing this thing, but #1 in my book is money. Provide an alternative, or STFU.

The point has been made in crystal clear fashion, and I've invited you to suggest an alternative primary motivation. You've only created a strawman and avoided the actual discussion. You are free to join at any time.

I agree, it won't happen, but it's what should happen given his ST looks exactly like his horrible year last year.

What is...the location of your brain? Oh wait, this isn't Jeopardy.

You know what will really make Varitek's numbers better? No Varitek. I vote to keep them both.

Primary does not mean one, in fact it implies multiple as it identifies the most important. You don't have most with one, you have only. Well done English major. In trying to nuance and parse again, you just stuck your foot further in your mouth when a simple, "you are right", would have sufficed. But, that would have been too painful, wouldn't it?

No team, ever, is a lock to have a top-anything bullpen, not with the amount of volatility in reliver performance from year to year.

If the primary goal isn't expansion of the audience, then what is it? If you can't answer that, then if the primary goal of expanding the audience isn't an expanded market (ie financial gain), then what is the goal of audience expansion?

I feel like we should hold hands a sing Kumbaya when I read that post. No, seriously, the benefit you are talking about is right in line with the financial goal. Those families didn't watch baseball before the WBC probably, so now they have their kids playing. Wash, rinse, repeat every 4 years, then move 10, 20, 30 years into the future. There are now Dutch players in MLB, meaning there are more Dutch fans tuning in, which means more $. This is the goal. Don't be fooled by being in love with the results if they are the means to the ends that MLB is seeking. This isn't to say the goal is a bad one, but it is what it is, let's not call it something different. Jacko brought up China to which a700 brought up Sadaharu Oh. His father was Chinese, but his mother was Japanese, and he was born and raised in Japan. I don't know how much they would identify with him, particulary when Oh played in the decades following WWII and how closed China was to the outside world relative to how it is there now. Plus, the Chinese don't have a lot of fondness for Japan. A better and more contemporary example would be Yao Ming.

So, the underlying motivation for the creation of the WBC was national pride? Tell me that you didn't take the time to figure out what we were talking about, please, you'll look better.

Agreed, you have, but I don't think you appreciate the ginormity of the financials. Tell you what, identify a non-financial motivation, and I swear to God, if you f***ing say "expanding the game, dirka, dirka!", as that has been established as a financial motivation, I'll snap, and I'll leave you alone on the issue. The thing is, I don't think you can.

The better question is why do you keep treating it like the proverbial pink elephant? It's right there in front of you, but you continue to ignore it.

It's got nothing to do with being in America vs. being in some other place. It's got everything to do with being realistic about this and recognizing how each of the motivations you list also has a significant financial benefit as well. For example, why do you think they want the talent pool increased? The DR used to be a cheap source of very talented baseball players, but the market has become established there and players who turn out to be mediocre minor league talents are signing for what some of the best prospects from Taiwan and Australia are signing for. Increasing the talent pool is about finding those gems in unestablished markets for pennies on the dollar compared to the established markets. Furthermore, suppose these other places become established markets in the future. There is still the benefit of increased talent supply vs. a fixed demand (30 teams).

No, I get what you meant, but I think you are fooling yourself in that being the problem, becuase there are few examples of position players who fit that bill. Meanwhile you are counting down the clock on when the players I mentioned come off your roster to make room for the next guy who will be coming it at the same age they did. You don't see this, because you are fine with it, but it's not the change you are trying to sell it as.

It is the be all / end all. It always was, is, and will continue to be. You say it's about more, it's about expanding the audience and then compare it to the posting fee. That posting fee is, if it is what you say it was for, an investment made to improve their relations with future cheaper talent. Cheaper means money. That is the core motivation. What is the core motivation to expanding the audience? Here's a hint, it starts with an "M" and sounds like "honey". There is only so much that can be made in the American market. I think they are close to tapping that out in terms of $$/audience member. EDIT: On another note, do you realize how quickly you contradicted yourself there, BSN07? You said it's not all about money, and in your example of other sources of motivation you explain how the benefit of doing something has resulted in, well, better money results. Use that internal filter.

Oh, so you'll sell Bay on a 3 year deal? No, what will really happen is that because he's at the tail end of his prime, he'll sell himself for more years, say 5 or 6, and at the tail end of that, you end up with a 35+ y/o overpaid superstar, just like Damon, Matsui, etc. These guys were signed when they were in their young 30's. EDIT: This is why I don't care if he walks. They've already got Drew as the aging COF, and he's here for 3 more years. No need for two of them. Bring on Reddick.

Everyone except Gom should be able to follow this. Unfortunately for him, this is far too complicated. Let's look at how this compares to Hamels and estimated arbitration awards / settlements for a top pitcher in his first, second, and third arb years (values are in millions, and the PreArb year is their last pre-arbitration year). [table]Year|Hamels|Lester PreArb|$0.5|$1.0 Arb-1|$4.35|$3.75 Arb-2|$6.65|$5.75 Arb-3|$9.5|$7.625 FA-1|???|$11.625[/table] Hamels is a bit better, and he's getting paid like it, and Hamels didn't even really set the bar for a top of the line LH starter. Willis got $4.35 and $6.5 in his Arb1 and Arb2 years. However, Willis went year to year, and Hamels sold his arb years all at once, thus he set the current market. The latest deal always does. Like you said, some of the more talented pitchers who have yet to turn their talent into greatness will be expecting Burnett money in the coming years. So, for an extra $500K this year, they beat the market in the future years of this deal. Of course, this is contigent upon him continuing to pitch well.

What does 24 have to do with anything? He was drafted in '06, so he's protected for 3 more years under the new rules, and if he continues to show progress, he'll easily get a 40 man spot given his natural talent after the 3 years are up. He's easily got 4 or 5 years to get his s*** together, not that I think it's going to take that long. So, like I said, you are going to have to make some time transforms using the equations of special relativity to turn the amount of time he has into a short enough period to say that his "time is running out".

Running out of time? I think you'd need a little Special Relativity to sell that one.

I thought the best part was how it was centered. So important if you want the story to be compelling and rich.

Oh please, he hurt it in warmups. This could have happened anywhere. And, FWIW, Pedroia's opinion and guesstimate are of little worth to me. I agree with a700, this tournament doesn't draw much interest, at least not from me, and I think it's destined to ultimate failure. This has no bearing on assigning blame for this injury to the tournament.

Wily Mo Pop-up, 'nuf ced.

Jesus Christ people, read the article to at least see if it fits into a rational argument against the tournament. Do pinches in your side only occur in warmups if it's an international tournament?