moonslav59

3 more years after this, so basically 4 playoff cycles. Quintana has 5, so I think I'd rather have him, but the more I think about it, the more I realize these types of chances don't come along that often. I'm still against trading a package headed by Moncada for him, but I'm more willing to trade a large package of our next best prospects. Benintendi, Swihart and Devers? ERod, Swihart and Devers? Swihart, Devers, Kopech and Lakins? ERod, Swihart, Devers and Kopech? I'm not sure any of these will get the CWS to say yes, and I'm not even sure I'd offer all of these combinations, but it's close. If we offer Moncada, I wouldn't like it, and I'd hope we wouldn't give much of anything else... I guess maybe Moncada, Lakins and Owens wouldn't get me too upset.

You gotta kick the tires and kick 'em hard on a guy like Sale (or Quintana).

Cause he's better than Owens, and he's not hurt.

1) Past "over-ratings" do not mean current ones will follow the same path. 2) Name one nationally highly ranked Sox prospect that has failed during Henry's tenure? As far as I know, our highest ranked prospects have been ... Baseball America Top 20 Sox prospects over the years Dice-K #1 2007 Bogey; #2 in 2014/#8 2013 Betts- never ranked in the top 20. Moncada #3 2016 Buchholz #4 2008 HanRam #10 2005/ #19 2003 Ellsbury #13 2008 Benintendi #15 2016 Swihart #17 2015 Anderson #17 2009 Devers #18 2016 Espinoza #19 2016 I guess, if you want, you can call Dice-K a prospect flop, but I don't really view him as a prospect, he wasn't a total bust. Lars Anderson never reached top 15 status, but was clearly a bust. I just am not buying the attitude that our "prospects are over-rated". Not every top Sox prospect makes the top 20 national list. Only a select few have made the top 15 list. If Beni ends up as good as Ellsbury (buy healthier) and Moncada turns out as good as Bogey, I'm all for keeping them.

I've mentioned not trading Moncada many times, not so much over the money already invested in him, but because of his extreme upside potential and years of teaam control.

We could also use an upgrade in the BP, but there is a great demand for similar talent by most of the contending clubs. The price for SP and BP help may not be worth the return. We already gave up Margot, Guerra, Allen Asuaje, de la Rosa and Webster (via Miley) for Kimbrel & Carson Smith. We have since traded Basabe for Zeigler to try and fill an injury gap. I think we'll have to wait out the injuries to Uehara and Kimbrel as far as the pen is concerned. The off season is the best time to stock up the pen. Last winter, there were numerous other options. Many failed- many did okay. Kimbrel was doing okay, until his injury. Smith got hurt early, and that set our pen back a lot. The extra work forced on Uehara and Tazawa may have been a factor in their struggles and injuries. Here is the list of every RP'er who qualified with IP and who has changed teams over the last 1.6 years: (WHIP k-BB%) Chapman 0.83/32% Kimbrel 1.09/26% KRod 1.01/18% K Giles 1.30/25% Papelbon 1.47/12% Clippard 1.30/20% J Benoit 1.44/10% Rodney 0.94/19% J Soria 1.44/12% Madson 1.30/12% N Feliz 0.97/22% Storen 1.64/13% J Wilson 1.13/26% J Broxton 1.19/8% S Cishek 1.02/23% Otero 1.04/17% Ad. Reed 0.84/27% Diekman 0.90/18% Others... M Lowe L Hendriks S Dyson B Hand C Torres M Montgomery JJohnson J Axford B Boyer Bastardo Mattheus J Marinez Y Petit D Hernandez Wilhelmsen C Fien C Ramos Villanueva F Abad N Cotts J Machi

Why would he opt out? He's fallen off a cliff and can't get up! No thanks. Now, if the CWS would greatly reduce the return in prospects, if we took on Jamie's contract, I'd listen... maybe Swihart, Devers, Johnson, Owens, Lakins and Castillo (to balance part of the Shields' contract) for Quintana and Shields

Buenas tardes Redrojo. Bienvenidos!

Lucroy has just 1.3 years of team control. The overpay is not worth it.

The Yanks are toast. They know it. We know it. Let's talk about the real competition: The O's and Jays.

I think I've already answered. 1) I'd prefer Quintana and his extra year over Sale. 2) I'd give up Beni and Devers plus Owens and Johnson, but I seriously doubt I'd trade Beni, Devers and Swihart or Beni, Devers and Kopech. I doubt even the latter deals get us Sale or Quintana, but if they did, I wouldn't be strongly against those 3 player deals. 3) I'd love to have Quintana for 4.3 years or Sale for 3.3 years, and I do think our "window" looks best this year and maybe over the next 3-4 years, but I also like to look beyond 3 years. 4) I am usually the one begging for us to acquire these two types of pitchers. They are young, inexpensive and under team control for 3+ years. Acquiring either of these two would be great for several reasons. Either one would bump Price to #2, Porcello to #3, Wright to #4 and Pomeranz to #5, as well as allowing ERod to be our insurance policy both this year and going forward through the next 3-4 years. I want one of these guys, but there's just no way I'd give up 5-7 years of Moncada and 5-7 years of Benintendi for 3+ or 4+ years of a great SP'er. I think that's what it will take to get one. They may settle for just Moncada, but then they'd want ERod, Swihart and Devers too. I'm fine with an overpay, but not a gross overpay.

Why can't we ever get guys like Melancon?!?!

I wouldn't give up Beni or Swihart + Devers for Lucroy. The only way getting Lucroy makes sense, is if we already have a trade line-up netting us a very good SP'er for Swihart and Devers. Although Lucroy would be a nice addition to our line-up, the catcher position is nearly the least of our worries. I like trying to improve by upgrading our weakest links.

There's not a solution to every problem. Yes, we can fix this one current problem and greatly increase our chances at winning this year, but then several other problems are created down the road. This whole idea that future problems can be fixed by throwing money at it does not convince me of future success. Look at the Dodgers. Look at the Yanks of just a few short years ago. Look at our recent big ticket signings. Look at the majority of big ticket signings over the past 10-15 years. I'm not for making panic moves. We should have made one more big splash (or a different one than Kimbrel) last winter, but just because we didn't, doesn't mean we have to grossly overpay at the deadline. We picked up Pomeranz, Zeigler and Hill. We should have Kimbrel, Uehara, Young and Swihart back before the playoffs. I'm not saying we must stand pat, and I'm open to listening to anyone with an ace available, but that doesn't mean I'll give up everything to get an ace. If we could get Quintana for Beni, Devers, Owens and Johnson, I'd probably say yes. Or maybe Swihart, Devers & Kopech. Maybe Erod & Devers or Poemeranz, Devers and Travis, but I doubt any of these offers get us what I wish we had gotten last winter, so sometimes, you just have to stick your tail between your legs and walk away meekly. (BTW, I still think we have a good shot at winning this year, if our injury situation clears up. We went from having the 2nd or 3rd best bullpen to a bottom 10 pen almost overnight. That can change quite a bit, if we can get back to top 3 again shortly. When Young comes back, our LF situation will greatly improve. .

I've been against almost all of our trades and signings recently, but not out of fear of trading away some or many of our best prospects. I've made a slew of suggestions and realize some might have been more "pie-in-the-sky" than realistic suggestions, but the fact is, we've already traded away a lot of talent (for the wrong guys, IMO) to boost our staff. We have traded away Margot, Espinoza, de la Rosa, Webster, Guerra, Basabe, Allen and more to build up what everybody assumed would be a top 3 bullpen, if not best overall. Injuries to Kimbrel, Smith, Uehara and Tazawa have made our pen a top 10 or 15 one, so it's hard to blame our current woes on any lack of trying. We went out and signed perhaps the best FA SP'er (on paper) in several years in Price. Even to those of us who were against the signing, nobody expected to get near mediocrity from him in his first year. Now, the drum beat continues to keep repeating the failed methodology of our recent past. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for acquiring a top of rotation SP'er and overpaying to get one. I don't want to go back and beat a dead horse about squandering so much young talent for pen arms and not starting pitchers (except for Pomeranz), but losing all that young talent has squeezed us into a corner. To me, we still have great talent on the farm, but to further deplete it willy nilly would be a grave mistake. I know that nobody here is saying we should just hand away our best young prospects for peanuts or rentals (although there has been some rumblings about getting Hill), but we need to be careful. Gone are the days we could nab top talent in the lower first round by being able to outspend cheaper teams. Gone are the days of signing any international free agents for at least a year anyway. Gone are the days of getting two top 7 draft picks in 3 years. Gone are the days, and actually those days never existed, of relying on big FA signings to fill crucial gaps in our 25 man roster. It's not going to be easy for us to keep our farm well stocked going forward. That was one reason I was against trading away a long-away prospect like Espinoza, even if it was for a SP'er with 2.4 years of team control. Had we not traded away so much youth already, I think we'd be all in for Sale or Quintana right now, but because we have already given up so much, I think the scales would be tipped too much by offering a large package that includes Moncada or maybe even Benintendi. I'd have been happy trading Swihart, Espi, Devers and Margot for an ace, because we'd still have Moncada, Beni, Travis, Kopech and Groome, but now, I'm not so sure we can get the type of SP'er I want without the future being too much affected. It's sad, but I just don't see a deal out there that makes sense for us right now. What can we get for Swihart, Devers, Johnson and Owens? Certainly not Sale or Quinatana. Maybe someone better than Pomeranz, but probably not a pitcher that will give us a feeling that we have just become a major contender for the next 2-3 years.

Moon keeps talking about how we're going to "replace" Papi. We're not. It's going to be up to the entire team to step up and get a few more hits at crucial times. I never meant to even imply that one single player can or will be able to replace what Papi has brought to this team's winning ways over the years, especially in the playoffs. My point was that some one is going to be our next DH. The drop off is going to have to be recouped elsewhere, and it doesn't necessarily have to be on offense. We can find new ways to win besides relying on one beast to carry us through several playoff series. I have been against the idea of spending a big portion of our financial winter allocation on Encarnacion, because I think we need to make room for Moncada and Benintendi in next year's line-up. LF is already pretty much open, but filling the DH slot with Encarnacion, instead of Ramirez/Shaw or Moncada is not a big enough bang for the buck as spending on pitching upgrades and replacements for Uehara, Zeigler and Tazawa. I've come around to starting to like the idea of signing Encarnacion more than I did before, but I worry about the luxury budget restrictions going forward, our banning from IFA signings and our probable lower draft picks over the next few years with changes made to how much you can spend on picks. I totally agree that it will take a team effort to "replace" Papi, and I understand replacing him is impossible. The point was that I believe this team can win going forward without Papi. I also think we will need plenty of young, inexpensive contributions from some of our players like Moncaada, Benintendi, Kopech, Travis, Groome and others to make it happen. Spending little on them can allow us to spend in areas we lack (pitching), and hopefully we will eventually get a FA pitcher or trade pitcher or two choice right. Even with Papi, this team has serious flaws. I think we are still pretty competitive and have a chance at winning a ring, but we are currently not a top 3 or 4 contender. I understand the position of some posters who are willing to gamble away the possible futures of our top prospects for the here and now. Papi's window is closing fast. I get it. I'm fine with making deals for players that will help us now, but I am not for acquiring rentals at a high cost. Trading for Quintana or sale would be a 4 or 3 year window opening, so I'm willing to make big offers for either of them, but I think giving Beni and Moncada is too much of a sacrifice. I know their values are speculative, and maybe I'm being influenced by the recent successes of Betts & Bogey, but these two prospects are very highly regarded by many scouts and ranking services who have very high success rates on players with their rankings. The amount of years of team control at such bargain prices on these two is a great value that should not be squandered out of panic or the emotions over the Ortiz window closing without one more ring. We could trade for Sale, Quintana and Bruce and still not win a ring this year. I'm all about improving the top of our rotation almost constantly, but prices are usually way too high this time of year. I realize guys like Sale and Quintana are not made available too often, so certainly we need to kick the tires by offering an "overpay", but I'm not for the gross overpay it will probably take to get one of these guys.

I remember softy the clown used to always say things like that. He really meant it- I think.

MLB OPS against leaders: 1) .475 Kershaw 2) .566 Arrieta 3) .571 Stasburg ... 6) .596 Pomeranz ... 15) .619 Wright ... 30) .679 Porcello ... 55) .734 Price (out of 94 qualifiers)

I loved the Cespy for Porcello trade and supported the extension due to his age and the fact that all his contract years were within prime-something that rarely happens with 4 or more year deals on this scale. He had a rough year in 2015, but the extension started this year. I'm sure glad we have him now. He is clearly our ace. He's been very good to excellent all year... OPS against by month Month Porc Wri Price April .625 .545 .709 May .777 .578 .722 June .706 .607 .768 July .684* .747 .728 Total .699* .619 .734 * not counting tonight game. Nice game Rick. You're our stopper now!

Maybe someday.... "The Killer B's" 1) Benintendi LF 2) Bogaerts SS 3) Betts RF 4) Bradley CF 5) Ben Carnacion DH 6) Bustin' Pedroia 2B 7) Bone Moncada 3B 8) Bam Bam Ram 1B 9) Bandy Bee-On C

Before tonight, Mookie has gotten on base at a .395 rate over the last 28 days. Bogey .371 Pedey .367 If he continues to struggle in April and may, we may want to have him only lead off once the warm weather arrives.

It always cracks me up when people say things like, "Management needs to tell that guy to concentrate more and stop striking out."

A couple ruptured aortas too!

Our goal should be to put ourselves in a good position to compete for a ring for the nest 6-8 years.

I'd try for Quintana and his extra year of team control. I would not give up Moncada. I'd try to get Quintana or Sale for Swihart, Devers, Kopech & Dubon, but they'd probably say no. Benintendi and Devers would be tempting.