FenwayDirtDog

No not saying you're wrong, just my opinion. Nobody knows for sure unless they are physically in the clubhouse themselves, but when you look at the facts, the history of the game, and everyday routine of the players, guys drinking beer does not seem like an issue. I don't think banning beer from the clubhouse is a smart move. I think the guys who did drink during games just simply need to...not do that. Is this deal even going to go through? Seems like both clubs are spinning their tires in the mud now...

I agree with chinmusic, the beer thing isn't the main issue. 28 of 30 MLB teams have beer supplied in the clubhouse. It's a part of baseball. It's just a big issue with Boston right now because 3 elite starters were drinking it during games, mixed with the fact the Sox didn't make the postseason and the fact that the media is just loving the attention it's drawn.

So, I do not condone drinking and eating chicken on the bench during games at all. A team is a team, as Lester was quoted "We fall together and rise above it together", I think you're missing the "together" aspect there, Jon. There is no reason for anybody to be in the clubhouse sitting down watching the game, with a few exceptions obviously (injuries, checking videos...). From the first pitch until the last out, 25 guys should be in that dugout. With that being said, I do think the "beer and chicken" thing is being blown out of proportion a bit, in my opinion. The part where he mentioned none of this stuff would have been an issue if they had made the playoffs, I believe that. I don't believe that had much to do with the September collapse. Like he said, they had been doing that all season long, right from Spring Training. And for a majority of the year, the Sox were the best team in baseball. They F'd up as a team, offence and defence. Players (Pedey and Pap included) go out and drink all throughout the season. If the next day is an off-day, you can constantly find them in bars having a little more than a beer or two. Babe Ruth was DRUNK for several of his games, and we know how good he was haha. While I do find it unacceptable to be doing that DURING a game, I don't think it's a huge issue that needs an entire team overhaul. I just think you guys need to stop drinking during games, dummies. Wait til after.

Still not getting it huh? Okay... Seeing as within half an hour, my love for the team has been judged on how old my hat is...I think that one speaks for itself... "They are usually the most "fun". You "dislike them as much as any other fan" yet you criticize this forum for disliking this team?" That doesn't even make sense. Yes, I dislike pinkhats, and I dislike people who think they can run this team better than management. I have nothing against the forum, I think it's great for Red Sox and baseball fans to express themselves. No, losing isn't fun, it sucks. But instead of being classy about it, people have to rant on about how horrible the team is, how management sucks, how the team isn't what it used to be, how the fans are horrible. Is this how you want Boston fans to be known for? I don't know about you, but I'm horribly disappointed, that team is my biggest passion, but I don't go on and on about the negatives, I look forward to next season, looking forward to getting better, and correcting the mistakes they made in 2011. I don't know if you've ever stepped foot in Fenway Park, but everybody sings that song regardless of the score. Sure it's recent history, but it is a part of the team now, and will be for a long time. I don't know what your issue with that song is, it's just something fun and it's an incredible scene watching every person stand up and sing it together. Even the players love it. I'm sure when they're down coming into the bottom of the eight, they wouldn't want everyone to be sitting down booing. It's really not an issue whatsoever. As for the ticket prices, sure you may not be able to afford box seats regularly, but it's not that horrible...I don't know about you but I can watch a game and still be able to pay my bills. I wasn't going to comment on your last rebuttal, but I just have to. I actually a little amazed you posted that. It is unbelievably immature and childish. It was heartbreaking, that's how much I love the Red Sox. They are a huge passion of mine. Read my quote again, dummy, before you get all high and mighty on me. "ON PACE to win near-100 games" before a slumping September. And yes, a huge disappointment. This is why I think people like you aren't true fans. Instead of shrugging your shoulders, giving them a pat on the back, and looking forward to the Spring, you break them down, tear them apart, say their awful, when in reality, it was an incredible and highly talented group of guys that fell apart down the stretch. That's baseball.

Right on, a fascist cop. I'm gonna charge you with being a f***ing idiot then. And walk in there off-duty, and say your little opinion about the Sox and we'll see who will be leaving the bar sooner. Half of your argument was awful. Quirky little assumptions, like a "new aged" hat. Not even going to address those because that's being desperate for a comeback. I'm no pinkhat, boy. I dislike them just as much as any other fan out there, but hey, at least they're out there cheering for the Sox, having fun, soaking it all in, and not frumping in their seats trying to play boss man in the offseason. And guess what, yeah I want to stand up and sing Sweet Caroline. If any of you guys had it your way, you'd take all the fun out of the game completely anytime a team is on a losing streak. s***, while we're at it, let's take out the in-between inning activities, the walk-up music, the seventh-inning stretch. Let's even ban cheering. That sounds reasonable right? I'm sure people being happy and singing a song means that they don't care their team is losing, that must be what it means. What you need to understand is how the game works. Yes, it's horrible and upsetting what happened this past month. I was heartbroken. And yes, like every year, changes have to be made. But bashing a team that was on pace to win a near-100 games this season, that's ridiculous. The team fell apart, everybody did. That's baseball. That's how the game is. I've seen the game evolve for many years, and what some people are saying on here is just ridiculous. When you go to a game, HAVE FUN. Just because people are singing, doesn't make them "non-fans". It means they are human. I'm beginning to think some of the people who made some of these comments are the same people who support building a new park because "the seats are too small."

I'll be wearing my dirty old Sox hat I've had since 1999. And I will sing Sweet Caroline, along with 39,000 other people, having fun, while you post on internet forums about how you should be the owner of one of the most successful teams of the decade. You have a lot to learn about baseball, friend.

3 posts in and I'm done. I'm not going to sit here and read bitter gripes from people claiming to be Red Sox fans. I know people are going to try to prove me wrong, tell me that the team and fans are terrible, big changes need to happen, the organization is going down the tube. Everyone just needs to sit back and relax. I've been there more years you can imagine, since half of you were still s***ing your diapers. Let the front office do its work. That's why they get paid the big bucks, and why they don't come on Talksox.com for opinions. We need fans to be fans, because when it comes down to it, nobody remembers who won this when, how then won it blah blah blah. Sure they're incredible memories and fun times, and who doesn't love to watch the Sox be the last of 30 teams still standing in late October/early November. But it's more than that, I promise you. I think a few of you still have to figure that part out. If you're a fan, I'll see you at Fenway Park in April.

If you have ever been to Boston and interact with real-life people, not people on forums, you will come to see that he is actually not right. I'm tired of hearing this argument. Every team is run like the Yankees. Every team has a payroll, and every team uses up that payroll on player salaries. Every team signs all the veterans and all-stars they possibly can. Only difference between the Pirates, Rays, Royals, and the Yankees, Red Sox, and Cubs, is the latter 3 have more money. Management's approach to signing players is the same throughout all 30 MLB clubs, and always has been. So when people argue "The Red Sox are turning into the Yankees" it's only because they actually have money in their pockets now. So no, it's not true. And don't even get me started on "overpaid, under performing" because if the Sox had been the AL Wild Card Champs this year, nobody would be saying that. That's just bitterness. These guys work their asses off to get to the point they are now, and yes, to get the salaries they are making. If you're one of the top 10 best baseball players in the world, I don't think you're evil for earning, and I use the word "earning", 10-15 million dollars a year.

And one more thing, to whoever this guy is, instead of hiding behind a computer screen typing away your adorable thoughts on a safe little forum, I think you should come down to the Lansdowne Pub next season and announce that to a room full of hundreds of Sox fans. I'm sure myself and the rest of the room would love to give our opinion back to you.

So, I've read over every single post in this thread, and I truly am trying so hard to respect the opinions of everyone in here, but some people are making it extremely difficult for me to do so. I have been a Red Sox fan my entire life. I have more than likely been to more games at Fenway Park than everybody on here. I've been there for the good, the bad, and the ugly, and there has been a lot of ugly. There's something first that you "real fans" need to learn about this organization before you criticize the entire integrity of the ballclub. The game of baseball is changing, as it always has. The steroid/home run era is on its way out, if not completely relinquished. In these tough times with the economy, baseball clubs are doing everything they can to attract fans to games, which accounts for the players salaries. Baseball isn't just about winning. It isn't about verbally abusing your beloved team until they win 100 games a year. It isn't about turning your backs on them because they aren't performing to their potential level. Baseball is more than that to a lot of people. I don't know who is talking about "getting rid of Sweet Caroline" and all this nonsense, but you sir claim to be a "true fan" when really, I've encountered hundreds of "fans" like you in the past and I can assure you, that is not the recipe for success. Just to pick on the Sweet Caroline point for a second, that is a key example of what the Red Sox are about, what the City of Boston is about, and all of New England. Down 6-1 coming into the bottom of the 8th? So what? Let's have a beer and sing some goofy fun song. It's a family game. It's our National Pastime. It's not about angry middle aged men chirping off to players because they went 0-5 that day. It's more than that. The energy in Fenway Park is still there, more alive than ever. I don't know if you have been to Fenway in the last 5 years or so, but I can assure you nothing has changed since as long as I can remember. Every day is a playoff atmosphere. Trust me, these players do want it. They want it more than anything in the world. They have heart. Perhaps they don't have the chemistry previous teams do? Possibly. But you don't know. I don't know., Nobody knows except the players, the staff, and management. That's it. But I do know as a former professional baseball player (not MLB, don't get excited) that those guys battle their asses off, day in, day out. As for the meltdown this year, guess what, that's baseball. That's not "no-heart", or lack of passion, that's baseball. It hurts like hell to watch, but that's the way it is. Nobody can sit here and tell me that Ted Williams wanted that ring any more than Papi, Dusty, 'Tek, Pap, Lester. That's just the way the game is. This is what separates us from New York fans, and anybody who has been to Yankee Stadium, new or old, will know what I mean. They have the same mentality as what this man here was going on about. Boo the team, harder media, hit their noses with a newspaper. Boston fans aren't like that. Sure, we'll let them know when they're having a bad night at the dish, of course. But in general, that's not what it's about. Next time you're sitting at Fenway, have a look around. Better yet, look around when they're losing. You won't see miserable frumps yelling and cursing at the team that has made the playoffs almost every single year this decade, including 2 World Championships, you will see faithful fans having a fun time at the ballpark, with their kids, with their girlfriends, wives, parents, friends. If "real fans" were any way as the way you described they should be, it would be a sad day for the City of Boston, and all of New England. Go Red Sox!