Jacoby_Ellsbury

If by 'decent' you mean exactly where the Rockets are now, then no I don't want any part of that. Neither does any sane person.

What a reasoned, insightful rebuttal.

And neither do you (what a shock). Why should LeBron be blamed for putting up 30 and 9, when Wade had an inefficient 19 points, and Bosh had 10 points on terrible shooting and worse shot selection? The guy put up three shots from downtown for god knows what reason. Why should LeBron be blamed for his team s***ing the bed? God you are a dolt of such unbelievable proportions. I don't know whether to laugh at you or feel sorry for you.

Don't really care. I just proved is that you can find all-NBA caliber players in the 4-10 range (though the higher up the better). Especially with a deep, strong draft in 2013. 2006 and 2007 were terrible drafts, depth wise. Um, yeah. You have to be bad before you can get good. I already said that. I'd much rather be bad for 2-4 years than mediocre-teetering-on-bad for 5 plus. Well if he's that good, we might have something. How's that any different from trying to build around Rondo. And none of these improvements you're talking about will amount to a damn thing. These revenue streams you're talking about will plummet anyway if we try to build around Rondo and end up making sporadic playoff appearances as the 8 seed, before ownership decides to blow it up anyway. 'In all fairness', cap space is far from a given.

When did I say stats don't define a player? Why do you keep throwing out blatant strawmen? Awards are fine if they're based on tangible evidence, because that would mean that player indisputably earned it. I don't give a s*** about other people's opinions. Only sheep like you buy into that. Michael Jordan's pathetic job as an executive in Washington and Charlotte single-handedly undermine any faith one should have in what HOF players think. Prove it. Small sample size. Oh, assists. A stat that is entirely contingent on your teammates hitting their shots. Brilliant. So he's a poor man's Jason Kidd, who barely qualified as a franchise player in his prime. Yay. *You're

It's sad how being realistic in this day and age just causes people to cry and call you a hater.

No, that's the kind of thing a rabid Boston homer like you would do. Because he's a deeply flawed player who won't work as the cornerstone of a franchise. Well let's see... option A may or may not amount to nothing, and option B most definitely will amount to nothing. I vote option A. So now you're trying to make your point based on 'awards' he was given based on the opinions of other people. http://i53.tinypic.com/284f82.gif You are a joke.

Yeah, because the habits of a multi-millionaire basketball player with questionable work ethic will so easily and magically change after six years in the pros with just about everyone in the media riding his dick like a cracked-out porn star. Wow, how could I not have seen it.

And there are no second-tier centers on the market. Except for Tim Duncan, who has said he's not signing elsewhere, and Roy Hibbert, who's a restricted free agent and the only way he leaves Indiana is if someone gratuitously overpays him. Dirk Nowitzki, Paul Pierce, Amare Stoudemire, Vince Carter, Chris Bosh, Dwyane Wade, Chris Paul, Brandon Roy, Kevin Love, Russell Westbrook. Want to tell me what they all have in common, aside from the all-NBA selections? Either way we can easily get a couple of top 3 picks. Oh lottery conspiracy theories... Then why don't they? In at least half the drafts in the new millenium, someone has whiffed on a top 3 pick. So you want to count on luck, but at the same time do nothing to better our odds. That doesn't make sense. If you're waiting for a gold nugget to fall out of your ass, why not take some laxatives to help the process along? And throwing away millions of dollars? If you're talking about attendance, ever since the early 90s attendance has been remarkably stable, despite it being the worst stretch in Celtic history up until the KG era. Plenty of cellar dwellers, but also more than a few mediocre fringe playoff teams similar to the one we'd turn into if Rondo became our centerpiece. We've only dropped below 20th in the league once (24th in 2004-05, a year where we were comfortably in the playoffs), and on the average hover right around 17ish. Even in the KG era we were only above 9th in the league just once (4th this year). And those figures are actually underrated if anything, since the rankings were based on total attendance, not percentage, and it's well known that the Garden is one of the smaller venues in the league. Boston shows up for the Celtics. It's been proven. It's documented. Given how much we'll save on salaries if we do blow it up I don't know what you're so worried for the owners about. I don't think you people understand this - you have to get bad to get good, unless you're the Lakers and everyone always wants to play for you. Boston has a stable situation, competent management, and a good coach, so we're not comparable to perennial lottery shitshows like Golden State, Charlotte, and Toronto, among others, who explicitly lack stability and direction.

The only way we get a top 3 pick for Rondo is if we deal him on draft day this year. That's not happening unless the GM we're dealing with is as dumb as tardsburyforMVP. And that's fine. The main idea is getting rid of Rondo so he doesn't lock us into mediocrity for years. It's better than the alternatives. I don't know what you people see in a team whose ceiling is a quick first round playoff exit with no hope to improve. Danny Ainge is a good drafter, he's trustworthy with these selections. No, I'm a Celtics fan who actually wants to see us back to contention sooner rather than later. All building around Rondo will do is cause us to be 8th in the conference every year and wind up with the 16th pick of the draft. Good luck improving when that's all you have. You questioning my fanship when I'm the one who wants us to be title contenders and you're the one happy with being middle of the pack is amusing though.

Playoff triple doubles? THAT's your argument? If you try to build around him, the only big 'gms' we'll be playing are whenever the NBA decides to throw us a national TV bone.

We don't. I'm trying to avoid becoming the Suns. They've been stuck in the middle of the pack for a while and couldn't do anything with their picks. Exactly what we'll turn into with Rondo leading with the team.

The team should blown up and rebuilt from the ground up. We're well past the point of 'filling the void left by player x'.

It's amazing that you think I care. By your logic, Michael Jordan must be the best basketball mind and talent evaluator out there. His managing jobs in Washington and Charlotte certainly speak for themselves, don't they? s*** is literally leaking out from around the edges your posts. That's how full of it you are. So? He's actually worse from 10-15 ft, while his percentages have gone up from 16-22, but his attempts are a lot lower. Rondo's still far from reliable, six years deep into his career. Your skill set is what it is at that point. He's never going to be a reliable outside shooter, and he sure as hell will not develop into one with the big 3 gone/shot and spare parts being dumped around him.

Oh my f***ing god. Rondo is not a franchise player, and he never will be. If he was ever going to develop a decent outside shot, he probably would have done so already at some point during his six year NBA career. But he can't. He's not a shooter. He plateaued in 2010 and has not gotten any better. He is what he is. A rich man's Andre Miller. The only logical thing to do is cash in on his over-inflated trade value. Maybe you're okay with a string of .500 seasons and slipping into NBA purgatory, but I sure as hell am not. Boston homers are f***ing annoying anyway, but this Rondo ballwashing is by far the most irritating thing you guys do. That's what's we're looking at for a while if we attempt to build a team around Rondo. My plan skips this step. Unless we bomb the selections, but as I said, it's coming one way or the other. Tough.

The majority of Boston fans are idiots and don't know what they want. You have to rebuild sometime, it's unavoidable. A few years of being awful or a decade plus of mediocrity? I know how that's a tough call. And no, our draft picks this year aren't high, but there's nothing we can do about that. Maybe we can snake #10 from New Orleans in exchange for salary relief and one of our lower first rounders. 2013 is the draft class I have my eyes on, and the one the Celtics should be... 'gearing themselves' for. The Lakers and Celtics are two different animals. Once Kobe kicks the bucket, you can still build around Bynum, who has no flaws in his game and is a MUCH better building block than Rondo. He's been acting like a fool this past season but that's largely due to Mike Brown's lack of testicles in dealing with his players. He makes Terry Francona look like vintage Tom Coughlin, to put it in perspective for you. I don't know what happened between ownership and Phil Jackson, but they'd be well advised to patch it up and bring him back if Phil's serious about wanting to coach again. You are deeply insane if you think Indiana's letting Hibbert walk. Eric Gordon is going to demand max money, and any team that ponies that up for him is retarded. He's the next Jamal Crawford/Ben Gordon, in terms of impact. OJ Mayo stinks. Barring a miracle Dwight Howard trade, there is nothing available to us that will make us contenders in the near future. They only got as far as they did because of Derrick Rose's injury. Jeff Green is far from a sure thing with his heart trouble. And even when he's right, he's just a decent guy to bring off the bench. You can't patch the holes with spare parts. That never works. What you and the others are suggesting will make the Celtics a 45 win team for the forseeable future. Not contenders.

Best thing Garnett could do, from the team's perspective, is retire this summer. If you let him walk in free agency you'll probably irritate the fanbase. If you re-sign him for a year you're just delaying the inevitable and f***ing yourself in a strong draft year. If he retires then he forces Boston's hand, and that provides some built-in sympathy the team can surf on for a couple of years so they can rebuild without backlash. Bradley's never going to be anything more than a role player. I already went over why Rondo has to go, he'll keep the team just good enough to where we won't get high draft picks, which will just delay the rebuild and keep us in limbo. Don't know about you but I'd much rather stink for a few years while building through the draft than be mediocre-bad for a decade. I'm not demanding that we trade Pierce, I said that I would hate to part with him at this point, but if someone offers up something good, you gotta do it.

Because he's not a franchise player you can build around, unless you're satisfied with being a 35 win team every year (at best). If we keep him not only will he keep us just good enough to where we can't get a great draft pick, but his trade value will tumble. Right now his stock is as high it'll ever be on the heels on these playoff triple-doubles. Cash him in and start over.

KG's a free agent and word is its Celtics or bust for him. I think he retires. Here's my course of action: Blow it up. Go for a high pick in 2013 (strong draft class), and use what trade assets we do have to gather more picks. -The only guys under contract next season are Rondo, Bradley, and Pierce, plus Brandon Bass has a player option. Everyone else is a free agent. I say let them all walk (or retire), except for Steimsma. He can be a good defensive big man for a while. -Trade Rondo to some team in possession of another team's high draft pick (can't do it with a team dealing their own pick, since he'll keep them just good enough to make the pick relatively worthless). Utah's a good option, they're a playoff caliber team on the way up, they need a point guard, and they have Golden State's 2013 pick, top six protected then and in 2014. The Warriors aren't gonna be good for a while but their roster isn't bottom six bad either. Getting Derrick Favors in the deal would be cool too. The Bobcats (with Portland's pick, albeit heavily protected until 2016) are another possibility, depending on what Portland does with their two picks this year. -Maybe Chicago would want Pierce for the Charlotte pick (also heavily protected till 2016)? It would kill me to trade Pierce at this point though. If he's still on the roster come October, let him play till MLK day, then inform that he has a debilitating leg injury and should probably take a three month vacation to the Bahamas to nurse it. -Not sure what to do with this year's first rounders (#21 and #22), or what their value is. Would one of them plus Bradley be enough to make a meaningful move up? If we end up keeping them it wouldn't be the end of the world though, since it is a fairly deep draft. Just don't miss.

KG's a free agent and word is its Celtics or bust for him. I think he retires. Here's my course of action: Blow it up. Go for a high pick in 2013 (strong draft class), and use what trade assets we do have to gather more picks. -The only guys under contract next season are Rondo, Bradley, and Pierce, plus Brandon Bass has a player option. Everyone else is a free agent. I say let them all walk (or retire), except for Steimsma. He can be a good defensive big man for a while. -Trade Rondo to some team in possession of another team's high draft pick (can't do it with a team dealing their own pick, since he'll keep them just good enough to make the pick relatively worthless). Utah's a good option, they're a playoff caliber team on the way up, they need a point guard, and they have Golden State's 2013 pick, top six protected then and in 2014. The Warriors aren't gonna be good for a while but their roster isn't bottom six bad either. Might be able to snag some extra goodies in that deal too, like one of their bigs. The Bobcats (with Portland's pick, albeit heavily protected until 2016) are another possibility, depending on what Portland does with their two picks this year. -Maybe Chicago would want Pierce for the Charlotte pick (also heavily protected till 2016)? It would kill me to trade Pierce at this point though. If he's still on the roster come October, let him play till MLK day, then inform that he has a debilitating leg injury and should probably take a three month vacation to the Bahamas to nurse it. -Not sure what to do with this year's first rounders (#21 and #22), or what their value is. Would one of them plus Bradley be enough to make a meaningful move up? If we end up keeping them it wouldn't be the end of the world though, since it is a fairly deep draft. Just don't miss.

Boston Celtics - rebounding optional.

Absolutely pathetic.

Thanks again Danny Ainge, for not getting any f***ing rebounders. For the 3rd straight season.

Classy showing by the fans here, chanting let's go Celtics anyway for game 7.