Yankeesin05

No need to get all worked up? Jezze, you try not to when a bunch of people are yappin about wrong stuff and wont let anyone get there 2 cents in. Now leave??.....some admin

Wow, I just realized that this is the worst board i have ever been to. Since you cant argue any more that there were better Pitchers then Pedro, you have to talk about spelling, now in any other baseball board, im sure they dont bring up spelling. Your comments are rediculas and patronizing. The only good thing about Talksox.com is the Sim League. This board blows.

Tell me why numbers has to do with everything, and the way you play has to do s*** with Baseball?

Why is it that your analyzing my spelling when we are talking about baseball?

OMG, baseball is not all about numbers. Its about how you play the game. Get it through your heads.....Pedro is not the best of all-time, even a die hard Red Sox fans that is a Baseball fan as well, will tell you that.

Sorry, that was the Wrong List....my bad guys. Here is the correct list. 1. Sandy Koufax I’ve never seen anyone dominate the way Sandy did on a consistent basis. Best fastball in the game couple with the best curveball. That was it, and since the hitters couldn’t hit either of those, there was no need for another pitch. Every time he pitched baseballs fans’ senses were alerted to the fact, that something astounding might happen. A great clutch pitcher, as evidenced by his World Series feats. It’s a shame his career was curtailed by injury but like I used to say for years; he was the Beatles while Spahn was the Stones; short term brilliance vs. longevity marked by excellence. I went with the former in this case as it left the deepest indelible impression. 2. Bob Gibson The black, right-handed Koufax? Was there ever a tougher pitcher to step on a mound? How many pitchers can have a line drive hit him in his leg, breaking it, yet pitch the rest of the game, a World Series shutout? Can you imagine a year where a pitcher throws a dozen complete game shutouts and finished with an ERA of 1.12? Bob took your breath away with his fastball and tenacity added to being the game’s greatest competitor. 3. Roger Clemens Love him or hate him, you have to bow to the extraordinary mastery of his craft. Six times a Cy Young Award winner, he’s still throwing bullets at age 41. 4. Greg Maddux Maybe the most knowledgeable pitcher in the history of the game. Four consecutive Cy Young Awards as the leader of the greatest trio to ever pitch together on one team. Go to your dictionary and look up the word “control.” When you get past all those pictures of historical dictators, you just might find a photo of Greg. And, like Clemens and a few others, he did it all in the midst of an offensive explosion never before witnessed in baseball. 5. Warren Spahn A legend who now passes on to being an icon of the game. He won twenty games in 13 different seasons and finished with 363, the most of any lefty in history. This, after not winning his first one until he was 26 years old. An unforgettable windup which led many experts to believe prevented him from being affected by any kind of arm trouble, but also allowed him to pitch into his 40’s. 6. Juan Marichal The “Dominican Dandy” had a high kick in his delivery similar to that of Spahn. Juan had an assortment of pitches, all of them mastered to perfection. 7. Steve Carlton In the book I wrote, “Dem Braves,” I rated Carlton as the greatest lefty ever, above Koufax and Spahn. That shows you how volatile these ratings are. “Lefty” combined brilliance with longevity and racked up awesome numbers on a consistent basis. 8. Randy Johnson He was nothing for a significant time but then was dealt to Seattle where he blossomed. He’s a scary sight on the mound, 6’ 10” of a gangly body, whipping 100 MPH fastballs by you (ask John Kruk what that’s like) and he might move up these lists if he can come back from injuries at age 40. 9. Pedro Martinez Some, especially in New York, truly despise this pitcher. Pedro himself can come off like a selfish jerk. However, he’s also one of the greatest pitchers to step up and all you need to do is check one category: ERA, and then take into consideration that he’s done it when batters have gone steroid crazy and racking up artificial numbers that eclipse anything done before. 10. Tom Seaver Like Maddux, a pitcher with super intelligence about the art of pitching. He used to explain his super exploits on Mets post game shows and it was a learning process for many, though boring to others. Dumbest move ever when the Mets traded him to Cincinnati. 11. Nolan Ryan He holds a whole gaggle of significant records and would rank much higher if had a better won-lost record. He was blessed from above with an arm never seen before and seemed to get better and better as he aged, without losing any velocity off his fastball. Oh, and all those no-hitters! 12. Jim Palmer A stylish hard thrower who was always one of my very favorites. I remember when he shut out the Dodgers in the ’65 Series at the tender age of 20. He went on to additional greatness. 13. Dwight Gooden I remember, as a Braves fan, watching this youngster make his debut with the New York Mets and saying, “Oy vey!” Everyone agreed we were watching the beginning of a brilliant career. He was scary good and resulted, like Daryl Strawberry, as examples of what drugs and drink can do to your career. He now seems rehabilitated and much credit can be given to Yankee owner George Steinbrenner, a side to this despised man that most people ignore. 14. Robin Roberts All Robin knew was how to pitch complete games and wins, not a bad combination. For many years he was considered the righty version of Warren Spahn as their great years seemed to coincide. 15. Whitey Ford The Yankees “Chairman of the Board” who was was one of the greatest clutch pitchers in the history of the game. Purely a pressure pitcher with ice in his veins. 16. Herb Score I can clearly remember the day in 1956 when Yankee infielder hit a line drive right into the eye of Herb, the brilliant young lefty of the Guardians. It ruined what portended to be a huge, forthcoming career. One of baseball’s great tragedies. 17. Jim "Catfish" Hunter A great “money pitcher” for both the A’s and Yankees. “Catfish” was brilliant and had as much command as any pitcher I’ve ever seen. A great tragedy in that died young, suffering from Lou Gehrig’s Disease. 18. Denny McLain The last pitcher to win 30 games in a single season. What a brilliant pitcher who turned into such a pathetic felon. 19. James Rodney Richard 6’ 8” and a blazing fastball, this was a pitcher that was in the process of rewriting record books when he was struck down by a stroke in mid season at the age of 29. He’d already established himself as a 20 game-winner with 300+ annual strikeouts when he was cut short and became one of the greatest tragedies in the history of the game. 20. Ferguson Jenkins Tall, lanky and with the best control possible. He could hit spots all day driving batters whacky. A complete pitcher. 21. Dennis Eckersley A fine starter who became, simply, the greatest reliever in the history of the game. Dennis control was unheard of and the rock the Athletics counted on for many years. 22. Don Drysdale The righty complement to Sandy Koufax who was great in his own right. He and Koufax shocked the sports world one spring by linking themselves to each other in contract negotiations with the Dodgers, and won. 23. Tom Glavine One has to hope he doesn’t ruin his high status by pitching for the Mets. A two-time Cy Young Award winner who taught us all the value of a pitcher being stubborn. Still has an outside shot at 300 career wins which would clinch his Hall of Fame spot. 24. Ron Guidry “Louisiana Lightning” was the pitching ace of those great Reggie Jackson-Thurman Munson teams in the late 80’s. Wicked stuff that, at times, seemed impossible to hit. 25. John Smoltz One of the gutsiest pitchers in baseball history and the heir apparent to Bob Gibson in the area of competitiveness. John has also fashioned his career after that of Dennis Eckersley, beginning as a great starter and then changing into a top reliever. My biggest regret was when Smoltzie got hurt near the end of the 2003 season because, at that time, he a shade better than eventual Cy Young Award winner, Eric Gagne. If Smoltz would have won he would have been the first pitcher in history to win Cy Young Awards both as a starter and reliever, a sure ticket into the Hall of Fame. 26. Phil Niekro A workhorse and winner, year after year. 27. Jim Bunning I was there when he threw his perfect game. Tough pitcher. 28. Rollie Fingers A great reliever who saved a great team and dynasty. 29. Jim Maloney Many never heard of him but he was one of the fastest ever. 30. Vida Blue Busted into the league like he was going to be the best ever. 31. Gaylord Perry Did he, or didn’t he? Who cares? He was one of the best. 32. Kevin Brown People today don’t realize how great he really is. 33. Bret Saberhagen A pair of Cy Youngs and a bad wing. 34. David Cone A famous gun for hire with great stuff. 35. Orel Hershisher A great pitcher or “Revenge of the Nerds?” 36. Dave Stewart A truly great postseason hurler 37. Dave McNally An ace of a brilliant Orioles staff. 38. Jim Lonborg Yaz did the hitting; Jim did the pitching. 39. Mike Scott Had years as an Astro where he was absolutely unhittable. 40. Luis Tiant Dazzled batters with an assortment of pitches a’la Marichal 41. Curt Schilling Another workhorse who improved with age. 42. Early Wynn A 300 game-winner known for exceptional meanness. 43. Mickey Lolich Great money pitcher always overshadowed by McLain 44. Frank Viola Stylish lefty Twins ace who starred in money games 45. Jack Morris Famed clutch pitcher who led Tigers and Twins. 46. Sam McDowell Big guy, scary to bat against. 47. Mike Cuellar Great screwball confounded major league hitters. 48. Vernon Law Pittsburgh Pirates ace who led team to championship. 49. Camilo Pascual I will never forget his curveball which fell off the table. 50. Dean Chance Teamed with Bo Belinsky with Dean being better.

Hey, guess who was involved with this list dumb ass Bill James Errr, Retard

Get bent, you know s*** about baseball. Your the one thats f***ing retarded, You are bias, and hypricritable. By the way, i found the book i was talking about, People that actually know baseball, they anylise it for a living, came up with this list....I'll give you a head start.....Pedro isn't one... The Top 100 Pitchers of all-time Walter Johnson Lefty Grove Cy Young Christy Mathewson Greg Maddux Pete Alexander Roger Clemens Kid Nichols Tom Seaver Sandy Koufax Bob Gibson Mordecai Brown Jim Palmer Hal Newhouser Al Spalding Carl Hubbell John Clarkson Steve Carlton Warren Spahn Ed Walsh Randy Johnson Tim Keefe Robin Roberts Pedro Martinez Ted Lyons Tom Glavine Bucky Walters Stan Coveleski Bob Lemon Burleigh Grimes Amos Rusie Eppa Rixey Dazzy Vance Charley Radbourn Eddie Cicotte Rube Waddell Carl Mays Juan Marichal Tommy Bond Hoyt Wilhelm Jim McCormick Whitey Ford Bob Feller Addie Joss Don Drysdale Orel Hershiser Lefty Gomez Wes Ferrell Mel Parnell Babe Adams Hippo Vaughn Dan Quisenberry Billy Pierce Bob Caruthers Tommy Bridges Guy Hecker Candy Cummings Mike Marshall Jim Bunning Vic Willis Mel Harder Gary Peters Tony Mullane Phil Niekro Gaylord Perry John Ward Dizzy Trout Joe Wood Claude Passeau Bruce Sutter Bret Saberhagen Bobby Mathews Ferguson Jenkins Dennis Eckersley Don Newcombe Nolan Ryan Early Wynn Frank Viola Wilbur Cooper Will White Silver King Bert Blyleven Red Ruffing Dizzy Dean Joe McGinnity Kevin Brown Dolph Luque Ewell Blackwell Charlie Buffinton Rich Gossage Sal Maglie Red Faber Curt Simmons Sam McDowell Jack Stivetts Spud Chandler David Cone Wilbur Wood Mort Cooper Jim Hunter

O great, now they are gonna go on about how Jeter is soooo over rated.......

Uhh, no Why would you say that we dont care about Stats?

How can you not admit that there was not ONE single Pitcher, in the history of Baseball, that was better then Pedro? Jeeze. No there aren't many, but there are some.

You guys are being bias right now.

If you knew something about Koufax, his Pitching coach, Arnie Wells was teaching him to do all the wrong stuff, he wanted to throw submarine for God sakes. Plus he had no cartlage in his Left index Finger. You should know why Koufax was good fpr 5 years.

LOL. Tell that to somebody that knows baseball, tell that to "zenny".

Koufax dominated the game with only 2 Pitches. Hitters always knew what was comming, they still couldnt hit it. How is pedro better when his ERA was nearly 4 last year? PEDRO IS A GREAT PITCHER!!!!!! Just not the best.

Koufax is rated the BEST Pitcher Stuff wise of all time. I swear to god i read it in a Pitching anylist book.

OMG!! Do you know anything about baseball?! last 5 seasons Koufax 111-34 1.96 ERA 291 SO/YR Martinez 75-26 2.53 ERA 221 SO/YR Who is better?

I cant believe that you actually think that Pedro Martinez is better then Nolan Ryan....For the love of god he is not! Do you think Pedro was better then Koufax? How about Clemens? Or maby Randy Johnson Why do you think Ryan got the most total H.O.F. votes received with 491? Ryan also has the 1900's single season record with 383 SO, With Koufax on his tail with 382. Pedro wont even win 300 games.

Do you think Pedro could throw 99 mph at the age of 44? Pshh

Why did you send me this??

Nolan Ryan was on a lot worse teams during his career then Pedro. C'mon man, there is still no was you can compare Pedro Martinez to Nolan Ryan. Do you think Pedro could last 27 seasons!! He will barely get through 18 seasons. Ryan was a Horse, Pedro is anything but.

Pedro's ERA is way under 3.00 lifetime at Shea Stadium. Who knows, Pedro might even return to normal form(doubltfull though).

Shea didn't change while Doc Gooden was pitching.

No. Pedro's ERA wont be that high. 17-6 2.91 ERA 255 SO 219 INN Those are my predictions for Pedro in 2005. Especially if the Mets can land Delgado and Varitek.

What do you mean?