September 18th @Toronto

[redsoxrules]

Il give it another shot

Lester VS Burnett


The Boston Red Sox's AL East lead once appeared insurmountable. With two weeks left in the regular season, it doesn't seem that way anymore.

The Red Sox look to strengthen their grip on first place when they continue a three-game series on Tuesday night against the Toronto Blue Jays.
After losing two of three at home to the New York Yankees over the weekend, the Red Sox were unable to contain Frank Thomas in Monday's series opener. Thomas hit three home runs for the second time in his career - both against Boston - in Toronto's 6-1 victory.

"It was one of those days everything clicked," said Thomas, who hit his first two home runs off Tim Wakefield and the last off Kyle Snyder.

His other three-homer game came on Sept. 15, 1996 at Fenway Park, where all three home runs came against Wakefield.

"I remember it like it was yesterday," Wakefield said. "There's a reason he's got 512 homers. If you make mistakes to him, they leave the yard pretty quick."

Thomas now is tied with Ernie Banks and Eddie Matthews for 18th on the career list. His 40 home runs against Boston also are the most among active players.

The Red Sox (90-61) had their lead in the East cut to 3 1/2 games over the Yankees, who beat Baltimore 8-5. That is Boston's smallest division margin since it led Toronto by three games on April 26.

Injuries have also become a concern for the Red Sox.

Manny Ramirez missed his 19th straight game with a strained left oblique, and isn't likely to play in this series. Manager Terry Francona said Ramirez must prove he is mentally ready to play before returning.

"He's got to know inside that he can play the game and not hurt himself," said Francona, whose team is 10-9 without the 11-time All-Star.

The Red Sox also were without first baseman Kevin Youkilis, who was held out of the starting lineup for the second straight game due to a swollen right wrist suffered when he was hit by a pitch from the Yankees' Chien-Ming Wang on Saturday. Francona also said designated hitter David Ortiz is battling a sore knee and center fielder Coco Crisp has a stiff back.

"We're going to have to fight through here for a few days," Francona said.

Boston hopes Jon Lester (4-0, 4.86 ERA) can help get it back in the win column. The left-hander, though, lasted only 3 2-3 innings Wednesday against Tampa Bay, but didn't receive a decision after allowing four runs and eight hits. The Red Sox rallied to win that game 5-4 and Lester extended his unbeaten streak to 12 games despite the poor outing, going 6-0 in that span.

Lester, who's never faced Toronto, is 4-0 with a 5.40 ERA in seven road starts dating to last season

Monday's victory only was the third in 10 games for the Blue Jays (75-75), who are hoping to finish with a winning record in back-to-back seasons for the first time since 1999-2000.

Toronto's A.J. Burnett (8-7, 3.42) takes the mound as one of the league's hottest pitchers. The right-hander has gone 3-1 with a 1.78 ERA in his last seven starts. During that span, he has allowed 25 hits in 50 2-3 innings, walked 18 and struck out 46.

Burnett was stellar again in Toronto's 2-1 victory over the Yankees on Thursday, yielding one run and four hits with eight strikeouts and two walks in eight innings.

He is 2-0 with a 2.25 ERA in three career starts - all last season - against the Red Sox

[redsoxrules]

lineup


1. J Ellsbury, CF
2. D Pedroia, 2B
3. D Ortiz, DH
4. M Lowell, 3B
5. J Drew, RF
6. E Hinske, 1B
7. J Varitek, C
8. B Moss, LF
9. J Lugo, SS

[riverside sluggers]

Jon Lester (1 game vs Toronto, 1.45 ERA---Career at Rogers Centre in 1 game, 1.45 ERA)
Vernon Wells, 0 for 2, Walk
Reed Johnson, 0 for 3, K
Alex Rios, 1 for 2 (.500 avg) Double, RBI, Walk
Frank Thomas, 2 for 5 (.400 avg) Walk
Aaron Hill, 0 for 3, K
Matt Stairs, 0 for 2, Walk
Gregg Zaun, 1 for 3 (.333 avg) 2 Ks
Hector Luna, 0 for 4, Walk, K
Ray Olmedo, 0 for 3
//
Sal Fasano, 0 for 2, K


A.J. Burnett (4 games vs Boston, 3-0 with a 2.25 ERA---Career at Rogers Centre in 21 games, 12-4 with a 2.94 ERA)
Jacoby Ellsbury, 1 for 4 (.250 avg) 2 Ks, SB
Dustin Pedroia, 3 for 7 (.429 avg) HR, RBI, Walk
David Ortiz, 2 for 9 (.222 avg) Double, HR, 3 RBIs, 5 Ks
Mike Lowell, 3 for 11 (.273 avg) Walk, K
J.D. Drew, 5 for 17 (.294 avg) Double, RBI, 3 Walks, 4 Ks, 2 SBs
Eric Hinske, 1 for 9 (.111 avg) Walk, 3 Ks
Jason Varitek, 2 for 7 (.286 avg) Double, 2 RBIs, Walk, 2 Ks
Brandon Moss, 0 for 2, Walk
Julio Lugo, 2 for 16 (.125 avg) 2 Walks, K, 2 SBs
///
Kevin Cash, 0 for 2, K
Royce Clayton, 4 for 13 (.308 avg) Triple, 3 RBIs, Walk, K
Alex Cora, 0 for 14, 5 Ks, SB
Coco Crisp, 0 for 6, K
Manny Ramirez, 1 for 2 (.500 avg) HR, RBI, Walk, K
Kevin Youkilis, 1 for 10 (.100 avg) 3 Ks

Lester this season on the road in 6 games, 3-0 with with a 4.73 ERA

Burnett this season at home in 11 games, 6-2 with a 2.56 ERA

[redsoxrules]

holy shit its dead here tonight

[redsoxrules]

YEAH VTEK .. tie game 1-1

[yankees228]

holy shit its dead here tonight

Haha, yeah. Nobody is here. I was going to post in the Yankee's Game Thread, but I decided against it because I would be basically talking to myself.

[Coco's Disciples]

I'M HERE! HEY GUYS!

[yankees228]

I'M HERE! HEY GUYS!

lol, how's it going?

[redsoxrules]

I see the yanks are kicking the shit out of the O's , so it would be nice for the sox to win tonight so the yanks dont gain anymore ground

[Coco's Disciples]

Pretty swell. Had pork and yams tonight. Pretty tasty.

[yankees228]

Pretty swell. Had pork and yams tonight. Pretty tasty.

Sounds pretty good.

[yankees228]

I see the yanks are kicking the shit out of the O's , so it would be nice for the sox to win tonight so the yanks dont gain anymore ground

Well, the Yankees don't have Rivera, Farnsworth, Vizcaino, or Chamberlain tonight, so they need a blowout. Moose is pitching well, but that could fall apart at any moment. However, the best part about tonight's Yankee game is that they're not on pace for another four hour contest.

[VA Sox Fan]

Love Dustin the Dirt Dog!

PAPI!!!!!!!!!!! 2-1!!!!!!!

[redsoxrules]

PAPI 2-1 keep it comming

[VA Sox Fan]

Jeezus JD.....:rolleyes:

[redsoxrules]

Jeezus JD.....:rolleyes:

he's been on base twice so far

[VA Sox Fan]

he's been on base twice so far


I know. I've laid off him ALL season. Like earlier threads have "mentioned" boo Theo, not him. I just want him to break out so badly (like we ALL do) b/c he's has the ability to do it.

Nice/lucky play Lester! Sweet!

Nice 1-2-3 for Johnny L!

[Gom]

Lester is pitching really well, but he had two very hard hit balls off of him in the last inning. I don't think he has much left at this point. I hope Tito keeps him in.

[VA Sox Fan]

Come on Manny D!!!!!!!!

[Coco's Disciples]

Please do not allow a run Eric Gagne.

[Coco's Disciples]

Well played by Hinske.

[ACL BoSox]

:/

[Mr Crunchy]

leave the canuck in tito
what can happen eh

[VA Sox Fan]

FAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKK!

[ACL BoSox]

3 walks :?(

this inning has disaster written all over it

[ORS]

Gagne est le suc. Croissant eating bitch.

[riverside sluggers]

Paging Francoma

[Mr Crunchy]

allo tito
WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU WAITING FOR

[Thumper]

If the job of a reliever was to walk batters into a tied game, Gagne would be an ace.

Sadly his a pathetic piece of shit right now. And just blew another lead.

[Mr Crunchy]

IS HE IN A FUCKING COMA

[Taliesin]

I don't pay that much attention. How's Dye been doing?

[riverside sluggers]

Fuck you Tito this loss is all on you

[Gom]

GAGNE=Yankees MVP

[Thumper]

GAGNE! YOU'RE SO AWESOME AT SUCKING!

[ACL BoSox]

Gagne comes back just in time to screw us over again.

[KeepTheFaith1229]

Wow.

[riverside sluggers]

With Tek, Moss, Lugo batting in the 9th, most likely still against Burnett... sory guys Im pegging this one as a loss

Losing 4 out of the last 5 games, 2 of which is on the bullpen

[Thumper]

I bet the Rangers are sitting back having a nice laugh at our expense.

[ACL BoSox]

the worst part is, gagne had stairs 0-2 and walked him, that's a killer

lets hope we can get some hits against their closer

EDIT: looks like their leaving burnett in

[riverside sluggers]

Great to hear from Don

Tito said he wanted to experiment with Gagne. Yea 3.5 games up (soon to be 2.5) in the pennant race is the perfect time to experiment with a struggling reliever

[Thumper]

Yankees 12, Orioles 0.

Fucking gap is closing.

[ACL BoSox]

where is manny BTW?

any time table for his return?

[mosox]

I'm wondering why Tek called so many fastballs when he couldn't get it over the plate.

[ACL BoSox]

lugo, ellsbury, and pedroia get on, papi hits a granny and sox win 6-4

ok

well back in reality looks like the sox will be dropping another game to the yanks, i was hoping for 4-2 on the road trip, but it looks like toronto is enjoying playing spoiler

[jacksonianmarch]

wow. Once Gagne walked the sacks full, I expected 'coma to take him out. Instead he leaves him in for 2 more spectacular batters. Wow.

[Thumper]

Lugo? Home Run clutch? The FUCK? I'll drink to that.

[riverside sluggers]

where is manny BTW?

any time table for his return?

Tito said that the doctors have given him the OK. But now its all up to Manny on when he wants to come back. If he doesnt, I'll lose all respect for him if he actually bails out on the team in a tightening pennant race

EDIT: Speaking of which....

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070917&content_id=2213925&vkey=news_bos&fext=.jsp&c_id=bos

Manny's the Red Sox representative for the Hank Aaron award. Huh? Ortiz and Lowell easily trump the disappointing season Manny has turned out

[Coco's Disciples]

This is yank your hair out bad right now. Holy faaaaack.

[riverside sluggers]

wow. Once Gagne walked the sacks full, I expected 'coma to take him out. Instead he leaves him in for 2 more spectacular batters. Wow.

Yeaa perfect time to try and stick with him to "build confidence".... wouldnt you say?

[Coco's Disciples]

2.5. Epic suck.

[a700hitter]

If the Red Sox miss the division by 3 or less games, it's directly attributable to the 3 meltdowns from Gag-me. He has added absolutely nothing. What a bust of an acquisition. Our once strong bullpen isn't looking so good right now.

[ACL BoSox]

well if it's any consolation, detroit is losing too, and our magic number for a playoff spot should at least go down

[fenwayfrank]

Memo to the Owners of Red Sox:

Fire FUCKING TITO at the end of the Season or somebody else will.

[Coco's Disciples]

KTF's sig said:

Fresh off the plane, konichiwa, bitches.

Kanye?

[VA Sox Fan]

SHIT FUCK HELL

[Thumper]

Amazing.....

However, it's not over yet. So I'd advise anyone with their finger on the panic button to back away. Still have some games to play that we can break out on.

[mosox]

Tito and Gagne's loss.

[ACL BoSox]

If the Red Sox miss the division by 3 or less games, it's directly attributable to the 3 meltdowns from Gag-me. He has added absolutely nothing. What a bust of an acquisition. Our once strong bullpen isn't looking so good right now.

it's looking like it has wear and tear...

Jima looks worn out, gagne can't find the plate, even papelbon looked shaky in his last start.

Enough is enough, Francona has given Gagne plenty of chances, he can not be put in a big spot anymore.

[a700hitter]

Gagne's three meltdowns have been absolutely awful. He's looked like a rookie shitting his pants under pressure. I have a hard time believing that this guy was ever a big time closer. He was missing his spots by a foot in every direction.

[riverside sluggers]

Im not worried about Papelbon whatsoever. IMO if Tito actually went to Paps in the 8th with 2 outs, he wouldve reverted to his old self

[Gom]

I can't believe there is a worse manager when it comes to the bullpen than Torre, but it just may be Tito. Is Steinbrenner paying him under the table?

[fenwayfrank]

I blame pretty-boy Epstein for that Gag-ME frigging acquisition. What a FUCKING OVERPAID FAT-ASS PIECE OF SHIT he is.

But, is that really how I feel.

[Mr Crunchy]

BRUTAL JUST FUKIN BRUTAL
growing up with auerbach and his proteges we always had that edge as celts fans
its been passed on to belichek who is the best 1 game coach i have ever witnessed and across town we go to the fens where terry francona just fucked the pooch bareback
ya 2004 ya ya i know

i also remember curtis leskanic with the ball in game 4 down 0-3 to ny
if his legacy is the world series win just remember the season and his defining moment was in the hands of curtis leskanic when the chips were down and we were all in with a 5.00 chip left to play

[KeepTheFaith1229]

Kanye?

yesh

it really seems like weve had more of these games in september than we have all year. unbelievable

[riverside sluggers]

Eric Gagne was allowed to blow Boston's one-run lead and give up three runs in the eighth Tuesday to take a loss to the Blue Jays.

Terry Francona: good manager of people, lousy manager of baseball games. It's simply ridiculous to bring Gagne into a one-run game in the eighth and not have anyone up behind him. With two outs, Gagne walked Frank Thomas and then gave up a hard grounder for a single. Two more walks followed, the second pushing in the tying run. Even then, Gagne was allowed to stay in, and he allowed a two-run double to Russ Adams. He only got out of the inning because the third runner was thrown out at the plate. Gagne threw just 13 of his 32 pitches for strikes. Meanwhile, Manny Delcarmen, he of the 2.37 ERA, has been asked to get two outs in six days. Jonathan Papelbon has pitched once in six days. Hideki Okajima hasn't pitched in four days. Francona has played a large role in blowing two of the last four games, and his bullpen management has gone from good to abysmal since the day Gagne was acquired.

[fenwayfrank]

Apparently Tito didn't strap his set on tonight when he made the AWFUL decision to bring in that panty-waste of a man, GAG-FRIGGING-ME!!!

FUCKIN-A!!!!

I'm going to tip a few more back. . .I've had it!!!

[Mr Crunchy]

i dont understand the mindset here unless he played toronto
is pete rose in the area??
unreal
we get a cancer survivor to spin his best career effort when needed the most and this cockmuch fucks him in the face like a blind uncle
i will be puking in my sleep,that hot bile puke,not a lot of volume but a lot of fire that a clip of rolaids and a gallon of maalox wont be able to handle
pitiful effort by tito and gagne and 1 i wont forget soon
lets hope our guys have a shorter memory than i do

[riverside sluggers]

Facing Jesse Leech tomorrow with the kid Bucholz taking the ball, positive about tomorrow. Ok now Theo we all know you want to make a case that the move for Gagne was a good one. Cut the shit, he cant get any more chances when the Sox have a slim lead. The setup men should be Delcarmen/Timlin/Okajima

[a700hitter]

Facing Jesse Leech tomorrow with the kid Bucholz taking the ball, positive about tomorrow. Ok now Theo we all know you want to make a case that the move for Gagne was a good one. Cut the shit, he cant get any more chances when the Sox have a slim lead. The setup men should be Delcarmen/Timlin/OkajimaI'd only be confident going to Timlin right now.

[a700hitter]

Why is a Rookie like Moss getting PT? Is kielty still hurt?

[a700hitter]

Once the bases were loaded, Papelbon should have been in the game for a 4 out save. WTF was Francona thinking?

[riverside sluggers]

Once the bases were loaded, Papelbon should have been in the game for a 4 out save. WTF was Francona thinking?

I was thinking yank him when there were 2 runners on. Its weird it showed papelbon lightly tossing when the bases were loaded. Once he walked in the tying run, Bryan Corey started warming up.

Tito's comments-- The strike zone was hard on him. I stayed with him because we need him for the rest of the season and playoffs. We wont quit on him.

Yay more chances to justify Theo's trade :thumbsup:

[Mr Crunchy]

bunny kim and jeff suppan were left off the 03 playoff roster if i recall
this is where the bond of gm and manager is an anchor
jimy williams gave steve avery the ball at the end of the year when that start ignited an automatic year extension after avery sucked all year
it was against duquette and the owners wishes but jimy did what he thought was proper

i cant believe tito watched that meltdown and was thinking about gagne in october
no
he is marching to the beat of the front office and that isnt good baseball
or is he doing this on his own??

in any case it was horrible to watch

[TheKilo]

First off, Gagne was horrible.

Francona and Tek's pitch selections were worse.

Yeah he gets squeezed on the Thomas AB, and I do think Gagne had a legit beef there. The basehit to Hill should have been the end of his night, because Papelbon should have been up if needed. Of course, he wasn't.

The AB to Stairs might have been the worst pitch calling sequence I've seen all year. Gagne has had recent success changing speeds and relying on his off speed stuff and spotting his fastball. When he struggled, it was the opposite. So what does he throw to Stairs?

Fastball - foul
Fastball - foul
Fastball - ball
Fastball - ball
Fastball - ball
Changeup - ball

Why wait til 3-2 to throw the fucking changeup? He fooled Rios badly earlier in the inning on a change then curve, but Gagne and Tek continued to pump fastballs in there. For all the praise Tek gets for calling a game its like he's never seen Gagne pitch before.

Francona takes Delcarmen out after three pitches. Awesome pen management.

I'm trying really hard to stay positive. It's getting increasingly difficult. I haven't read the gamethread but undoubtedly there will be some bashing of JD Drew for not catching that ball, but at least he's playing with a shredded shoulder unlike our favorite slugger, Manny Ramirez.

I'll be glad when we ship Manny out this offseason for $.50 on the dollar. I'll take Ellsbury in left over Manny right now anyways.

[ANiMAL]

I was thinking yank him when there were 2 runners on. Its weird it showed papelbon lightly tossing when the bases were loaded. Once he walked in the tying run, Bryan Corey started warming up.

Tito's comments-- The strike zone was hard on him. I stayed with him because we need him for the rest of the season and playoffs. We wont quit on him.

Yay more chances to justify Theo's trade :thumbsup:

We're going to lose our first division title chance in 12 years because ignorance and Eric Gagne. We won without him, we dont need him. DFA Gagne!

[a700hitter]

First off, Gagne was horrible.

Francona and Tek's pitch selections were worse.

Yeah he gets squeezed on the Thomas AB, and I do think Gagne had a legit beef there. The basehit to Hill should have been the end of his night, because Papelbon should have been up if needed. Of course, he wasn't.

The AB to Stairs might have been the worst pitch calling sequence I've seen all year. Gagne has had recent success changing speeds and relying on his off speed stuff and spotting his fastball. When he struggled, it was the opposite. So what does he throw to Stairs?

Fastball - foul
Fastball - foul
Fastball - ball
Fastball - ball
Fastball - ball
Changeup - ball

Why wait til 3-2 to throw the fucking changeup? He fooled Rios badly earlier in the inning on a change then curve, but Gagne and Tek continued to pump fastballs in there. For all the praise Tek gets for calling a game its like he's never seen Gagne pitch before.

Francona takes Delcarmen out after three pitches. Awesome pen management.

I'm trying really hard to stay positive. It's getting increasingly difficult. I haven't read the gamethread but undoubtedly there will be some bashing of JD Drew for not catching that ball, but at least he's playing with a shredded shoulder unlike our favorite slugger, Manny Ramirez.

I'll be glad when we ship Manny out this offseason for $.50 on the dollar. I'll take Ellsbury in left over Manny right now anyways.When a guy loses his release point so drastically on the fastball, isn't a good idea to call for a breaking pitch?

[Mr Crunchy]

we wont lose the division despite this shit
that isnt my worry
its the overall effort from guys that should be delivering that pisses me off
the homefield advantage we're gagging up pisses me off too

[riverside sluggers]

Ship Manny out or just planly buy out his contract for the 2008 season. Last year i let it slide that he ditched on the Sox for the last 6 weeks, because that team was going nowhere even with him in the lineup. Now to not step in with your team in a tightening pennant race is just wrong. Thats when the true gamers come out. "Yea Im hurt but Im in it to help my team win games down the strech." Free agent left fielders to be will be Adam Dunn (if Reds dont activate 08 option) and Kosuke Fukodome

[a700hitter]

we wont lose the division despite this shit
that isnt my worry
its the overall effort from guys that should be delivering that pisses me off
the homefield advantage we're gagging up pisses me off tooIt's better to find out now that we can't rely on Gagne in the playoffs. This could be a blessing in disguise. Maybe th FO and Francoma will open their eyes and realize that Bucholz could be a reliable late inning option for the playoffs-- similar to K-Rod in 2002.

[TheKilo]

When a guy loses his release point so drastically on the fastball, isn't a good idea to call for a breaking pitch?

On an 0-2 pitch to Matt Stairs, when he threw two good changeups and a good curve in a row to a better hitter in Rios earlier in the inning?

It's a no brainer. You have to at least try it on 0-2 or 1-2.

[TheKilo]

It's better to find out now that we can't rely on Gagne in the playoffs. This could be a blessing in disguise. Maybe th FO and Francoma will open their eyes and realize that Bucholz could be a reliable late inning option for the playoffs-- similar to K-Rod in 2002.

With Wake consistently shitting the bed don't be shocked if Buchholz is the #4 starter.

Hell, I'd start him in game 3.

[Mr Crunchy]

the team has been on cruise for a while
they dLd beckett for a blister
they gave schill forever to come back,timlin and lester too
their patience with manny is now shelved IF he can swing the bat
nixon,the tuffest prick this team had for years,missed months with this same injury

its not ez defending manny but we arent winning shit without his bat

[a700hitter]

With Wake consistently shitting the bed don't be shocked if Buchholz is the #4 starter.

Hell, I'd start him in game 3.That's a possibility. I hope Tito doesn't get a case of MacNamara Veteran-itis. This is coming from a guy who favors experienced players over inexperienced. I hate the inconsistency of the knuckleball. I also hate chokers like Gagne. You would think that getting the first two out would have given him some confidence.

[Mr Crunchy]

wake was on fire till he missed that 1 start
you just dont know what he will bring and he dont either
maalox on my cornflakes isnt cutting thru the fire

christ
i hate losing on stupidity

[a700hitter]

We are going to the playoffs one way or another. The extra home game is nice, but right now it is a toss up who we would play in the first round whether or not we win the division. Cleveland has a better a record than LA right now by 1/2 game. If we win the division we would draw LA. I am really on the fence about who I'd rather face. Sabathia is very tough on us as is Carmona. That could really silence our offense in a 5 game series. We do much better against Lackey and the LA starters. The Yankees match up better against Cleveland. What do you think?

[Mr Crunchy]

i think the angels own ny and ny is the team to beat now

[Banned in Boston]

I think if the Sox lose the division because of Gagne and then don't win the pennant THeo should be fired. And with him Francona will probably go.

Winning the division has been paramount to me all year because of what it means. Losing the division to them at this point is about as miserable as I can imagine. Maybe it's because I live in NYC and have to listen to them.

Losing the division is not only a mental shock but it just seems so wrong. RIght now this is a mini-slump-4 of 5. But the idea that the Sox could play relatively consistently all season long and still lose to them just boggles my mind.

[riverside sluggers]

Quote of the Day: "He had two quick outs," Francona said. "That's his inning to get out of."

[Gom]

i think the angels own ny and ny is the team to beat now

You know, I don't buy that stuff as much as I used to. We used to own you guys too. In fact, we have, with the exception of 2004, but that is quite a big exception.

We split the season series with Anaheim, and they really don't scare me like they used to. The Angels play in a weaker division, so their record is a little inflated, and the Yankees weakness is lefty pitching, and they don't even have a lefty on their 25 man roster. The Indians with their deeper pen, and Sabathia and Carmona, scare me a lot more than the Angels do.

We did sweep the series from the Indians, but I don't care for our chances in a five game series with Carmona and Sabathia. Scary. Let you guys handle them. As long as we play Mientkiewicz at first, Molina behind the plate, and Posada as the DH, I think we can crush the Angels.

[yankees228]

Gom, the Yanks were 3-6 against the Angels this year.

EDIT: Wait a second. You want Posada to DH? What exactly do you want the lineup to be?

[Behind the Bag]

If the Red Sox miss the division by 3 or less games, it's directly attributable to the 3 meltdowns from Gag-me. He has added absolutely nothing. What a bust of an acquisition. Our once strong bullpen isn't looking so good right now.

Be careful, a moderator might think your post is "irrational"

[jacksonianmarch]

Ship Manny out or just planly buy out his contract for the 2008 season. Last year i let it slide that he ditched on the Sox for the last 6 weeks, because that team was going nowhere even with him in the lineup. Now to not step in with your team in a tightening pennant race is just wrong. Thats when the true gamers come out. "Yea Im hurt but Im in it to help my team win games down the strech." Free agent left fielders to be will be Adam Dunn (if Reds dont activate 08 option) and Kosuke Fukodome

Oh man, I am absolutely loving the panic in the sox nation. Couple things....

1. Manny has an injury that is extremely easy to re-aggravate. And while everyone in sox nation is dying for their first division title in over a decade, having Manny come back when he isnt 100% could hurt your chances for a second WS title in 4 seasons. You will make the playoffs without Manny. You will not win the world series without Manny. That much is clear.

2. I will finally relinquish my claim of Joe Torre being the worst BP manager in all of baseball. I was sitting there, watching the game, and saw Gagne load the bases. At that point, I saw Paps warming, figured, well in comes Paps, lights out, game over. BUT HE LET HIM WALK IN THE TYING RUN. I was elated, figuring, well, at least the sox will have to earn this win. AND THEN HE LEFT HIM IN! SHEER ELATION! Once Gagne was left in to face Adams, the game was sealed.

3. Hell of a job by Lester last night, I really like this kid. Still dont think he translates to more than a back end pitcher, but I am really happy that this kid showed the balls to come back in less than a yr from cancer. Kudos.

4. The division race is back on, but the most crucial series is the one over the weekend. You guys have 2 off days surrounding 3 in Tampa while we have an off day then right to a 4 game tilt at home vs Toronto's 4 horseman. We will see if the division race holds up at that point, since after that, we have 3 in Tampa and finish with 3 in Baltimore, while you guys get 2 home vs Oakland and finish with 4 home vs Minny while missing Santana.

[Gom]

We are 3-6? Shows you that I need to stop drinking, lol.

The problem with the Angels is their running game. Mientkiewicz at first can make the throw to second. Posada is as good a catcher in every aspect of the game there is, except for one. He is absolutely HORRIBLE at framing pitches. Watch Posada catch a game. He never, I mean never, tries to frame a pitch. If he would do that one simple thing, he would be a first ballot Hall of Famer. Then watch Molina. The guy freezes every pitch. Posada is great at hitting, throwing, blocking, a switch hitter...incredible. Framing pitches? I'm better.

Lineup....would be as follows

Damon
Jeter
Abreu
Arod
Posada
Cano
Mienkiewicz
Cabrera
Molina

With Matsui, and Giambi, you have some serious pinch hitting options. You can even take Molina out of the game and let the pitcher hit late in the game, you got three pinch hitters. You're only really in trouble if the game goes mroe than 12 innings.

Matsui hasn't been hitting all that well, so losing his bat is not a huge deal. Either that, or sit Melky.

[BudLight]

We are 3-6? Shows you that I need to stop drinking, lol.

The problem with the Angels is their running game. Mientkiewicz at first can make the throw to second. Posada is as good a catcher in every aspect of the game there is, except for one. He is absolutely HORRIBLE at framing pitches. Watch Posada catch a game. He never, I mean never, tries to frame a pitch. If he would do that one simple thing, he would be a first ballot Hall of Famer. Then watch Molina. The guy freezes every pitch. Posada is great at hitting, throwing, blocking, a switch hitter...incredible. Framing pitches? I'm better.

Lineup....would be as follows

Damon
Jeter
Abreu
Arod
Posada
Cano
Mienkiewicz
Cabrera
Molina

With Matsui, and Giambi, you have some serious pinch hitting options. You can even take Molina out of the game and let the pitcher hit late in the game, you got three pinch hitters. You're only really in trouble if the game goes mroe than 12 innings.

Matsui hasn't been hitting all that well, so losing his bat is not a huge deal. Either that, or sit Melky.


Mienky defensively is, without question, the best option for the Yankees down the stretch, however, benching Matsui to get Molina in the line-up, I don't think so. Posada is the catcher, day in and day out, hands down, no comparison. Benching Melky - who plays centerfield, Damon? Cabrera has 14 assists this year, covers much more ground and has twice the arm of Damon. Again no comparison.

[Ray10]

The Sox would have won the game last night if Eric Gagne hadn't have pitched. Anyone else in that pen and we would have taken that game. Like I said use Gagne when the Sox have a 12 run lead and that's it.

[schillingouttheks]

Be careful, a moderator might think your post is "irrational"

No, I only call posts irrational when they're completely out of left field. Yeah, that night sucked, but it was one fucking game and we still had a 4.5-game lead when all was said and done.

Maybe you should understand the point of my post before you completely twist its message, idiot.

[He Hate Me]

Be careful, a moderator might think your post is "irrational"

How old are you? 5?

[schillingouttheks]

Oh man, I am absolutely loving the panic in the sox nation. Couple things....

I don't agree with shipping him out or anything, obviously. HOWEVER, Manny needs to grow a fucking ball sack.

[He Hate Me]

I don't agree with shipping him out or anything, obviously. HOWEVER, Manny needs to grow a fucking ball sack.

he'd probbaly sell it on ebay with his neighbor's bbq grill

[riverside sluggers]

Oh man, I am absolutely loving the panic in the sox nation. Couple things...

Nope sorry thats not panic, its realization that the time is coming to an end for Manny in Boston. Would this team be better off in 2008 with a 36 year old version of Manny Ramirez at $20 million, or a 28 year old Adam Dunn with 1 year away from free agency?

[jacksonianmarch]

Manny's production has made him irreplaceable in Boston and his antics have made him unloadable to other teams. Sufficed to say, it is an ugly marriage that seems to have worked out to this point.

[riverside sluggers]

So when do you see his last season as a Red Sox? 2008? Sox activating his $20 million per option years?

[jacksonianmarch]

he stays next season with another offseason drama fest. Will he, wont he, will he, wont he. He'll stay, not talk to the media, and enjoy another rather productive season. Then he will sign in Queens and continue his garbage for another world class organization.

[TheKilo]

Manny Ramirez is worth his -40 in the field when he's hitting, because i think the wall in left takes away his defensive effectiveness.

There comes a time when you question if Ellsbury, who would be a far superior defensive player, could be worth letting Manny go.

What I'm trying to say here, is the run differentials between the two are not as great as you think.