Herald: Boston no longer option for A-Rod

[Cityofchampions33]

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=1002329&format=&page=2

In summary, this guy, while making very good points about the further troubles the Yankees face when this season draws to a close, also makes point that the Sox should re-new Lowell's contract at 07's end, filling the void A-Rod might fill if he opted out of his contract. I, personally would love to have A-Rod hitting behind Manny if it ever became an option, and though Lowell has been great so far this year, I am still behind Theo if he dangles him mid-season to another team. But who would you guys rather have? The future all-time leader in home runs? Or a getting-up-there-in-age guy in Lowell. By taking A-Rod, and watching the Yanks take the possible hits next off-season, we would be the new Yankees, no doubt about it, and the new Evil Empire, whereas if we took Lowell, we would be passing on 275 HRs and perhaps the greatest 3-4-5 of all-time.

[yeszir]

Honestly, at this point, I don't want A-Rod, regardless of how many homers he hits.

I guess that makes me either an extremely good or an extremely bad fan.

[jacksonianmarch]

Right now they are making something out of nothing. The idea of changing anything with the sox is assinine as they are playing the best baseball overall that I have seen since the 98 yankees. More talk for talking's sake.

[ryanromine]

Right now they are making something out of nothing. The idea of changing anything with the sox is assinine as they are playing the best baseball overall that I have seen since the 98 yankees. More talk for talking's sake.
I would have to agree with jacko on this one! Yeah A-Rod is a good hitter, but he doesn't handle the pressure of playing in a big market! I wouldn't want him . We didn't need him in 2004 and we don't need him ever.

[jacksonianmarch]

It doesnt really make a whole lot of sense for us to allow him to opt out anway. Texas is on the hook for 40+mil of the remaining 3 seasons, so we have a 40 mil head start on anyone who is considering signing him. I hope Cashman does bend though. When he is hot, he can carry a team for a month. Without his april, we are 15 games out.

[BSN07]

If AROD ends up in Boston, Manny will be gone, plan and very simple. I'm ot sure how id feel about it tho, I wouldn't blame them for doing it because it is an improvement all beit an expensive one. But if Manny, Schill, Wake and who ever else is off the books then they will have money to spend. Boston maybe CHC are the only two other big market teams that if he won a WS his awful OCT in NY would be forgotten. Another thing to consider if you give him a 6 yr deal and contimues his numbers the way he is now he might be chasing down the HR record towards the end of the deal.

Of course id like to see a 2-5 of Drew( would move from the 5th spot), Papi, Manny, AROD, but I dont see them keeping Manny if AROD comes to town.

[ORS]

Of course id like to see a 2-5 of Drew( would move from the 5th spot), Papi, Manny, AROD, but I dont see them keeping Manny if AROD comes to town.
I actually think it's a possibility. Curt, Lowell, and Timlin equate to $24.8M off the books. I'm starting to think Curt's time in the sun is waning. He's looked awful in his last two starts. This doesn't mean I think he won't still throw some very good games the remainder of this year, but I'm not sure bringing him back will be attractive at the end of the year. ARod could be the one FA pickup and the lineup becomes....

Ellsbury
Drew
Tiz
Manny
ARod
Youk
Tek
Pedroia
Lugo

Bench: Hinske, Cora, Belli/Kottaras, Crisp, WMP

Nasty, and the LT goes up next year, so they could either go FA or with a kid to replace Curt. Lester or Gabbard will replace JT by the end of the year. Buchholz, if he continues to dominate and hits AAA in time to make 10+ starts with good results, will be hard to ignore.

Rotation: Beckett, Dice, Wake, Lester/Gabbard, Buchholz/FA
Pen: Papelbon, Jima.....the rest will be some of the same, some turnover, some kids

[jacksonianmarch]

Hey ORS, how ya been.

I think the sox would certainly take a shot at him if he did opt out. They would be stupid not to, not only do you hurt your biggest rival, but you help yourself too. I just dont think Cashman would be that stupid, to let it come to that.

[ORS]

I'm good. Congrats on finishing school.

There's no doubt, this won't be a money issue. The Yankees will meet or beat any offer. This comes down to how he feels, IMO.

[ryanromine]

I don't the Yanks FO are gonna let A-Rod go!

[elsrbueno]

The Yankees don't have a choice in the matter.

If A-Rod decides to opt out he decides to opt out. It's similar to JD Drew last year. The Dodgers didn't let him go, he saw the market potential and got a big raise because of it.

Of course, IF he opts out the Yankees have the same chance as everyone else to sign him. I'm a big Lowell fan, but if A-Rod opts out the Red Sox would be foolish not to make an offer to him. Lowell and A-Rod aren't in the same class talent wise.

[jacksonianmarch]

The Yankees don't have a choice in the matter.

If A-Rod decides to opt out he decides to opt out. It's similar to JD Drew last year. The Dodgers didn't let him go, he saw the market potential and got a big raise because of it.

Of course, IF he opts out the Yankees have the same chance as everyone else to sign him. I'm a big Lowell fan, but if A-Rod opts out the Red Sox would be foolish not to make an offer to him. Lowell and A-Rod aren't in the same class talent wise.

not really true. Boras knew that he couldnt get more $$$ out of the dodgers, so he checked around to make sure he was doing what was financially good for him. Boras knows he can squeeze an extension out of Cashman if he plays the cards right. And no matter how good of a season he has, he wont make more than the 27 mil he has coming to him the next 3 seasons. I think this one is played very differently, UNLESS ORS is right and ARod just wants to get the hell out of NY. If that is the case, then he will opt out regardless.

[TedWilliams101]

How about resigning Lowell for 3rd, then signing Arod for SS. Get rid of Lugo and his stupid contract, possibly for a 5th starter.

[jacksonianmarch]

How about resigning Lowell for 3rd, then signing Arod for SS. Get rid of Lugo and his stupid contract, possibly for a 5th starter.

you wont get rid of Lugo unless you eat half his salary. Or, if he plays better, there will be no need to get rid of him. Right now, you should ride this out. Who knows how long you will be able to keep this pace up, and if you can for the rest of the season, then why would you add ARod?

[TedWilliams101]

Because he would make our lineup better and we would be taking him away from the Yankees.

[ksushi]

Hell, I would try to sign Lowell and A-rod. A-rod is a shortstop! He plays a pretty bad 3rd base, but a great SS. Lugo at second, A-rod at SS and Lowell at 3rd? Best infield in red sox history defensively as Lugo is supposedly a very nice 2nd basemen. Most of his errors come on throws, and being that much closer at 2nd makes him really valuable in the field.

EDIT - this will never happen, and A-rods nerves of foam don't exactly excite me, but I think if he opts out its due diligence to at least inquire.

[TedWilliams101]

I'd take a chance with Arod. He is a great hitter who could end up with the all-time HR record someday. Even if he isn't the most clutch hitter, he still would be the best SS option. I wouldn't mind moving Lugo to 2nd, but what then do you do with Pedroia? I would probably rather having Pedroia and trade Lugo. Pedroia is younger and cheaper and will give you similar production.

[adam123]

Sounds very interesting A-rod back to short where he belongs .

[riverside sluggers]

My thought: if Arod doesnt stay with the yankees, he'll sign on with old buddy manager Pinella and the Cubs

[Ray10]

Don't want him right now anyways. Yeah he can hit 30+ homeruns in the regular season but when it comes to the playoffs the guy can't do anything. What good is he if he can't hit in the postseason. Yeah he can help carry your team into October but the goal is to win the World Series not make the playoffs then bomb out. Until he proves himself in the playoffs I'll pass on the guy can get someone who is more solid in the postseason anyways.

[TedWilliams101]

I have the same concerns, but It's not like we have to give up someone for him. If it means him or Manny, then yes, I would rather keep Manny. But if we can get him and add him to our lineup while keeping Ortiz and Manny, than I don't see how anyone can argue that he isn't clutch in october. Are there other 3B or SS options that are HOF calibre and Mr. October that I am unaware of? Thats what I thought.

[CrespoBlows]

My thought: if Arod doesnt stay with the yankees, he'll sign on with old buddy manager Pinella and the Cubs

They probably can't afford him.

[Teddyballgame10]

I dont get this seriously. Why would we want someone who can not hit in the postseason at all? why? someone explaine to me what good would he do? Yeszir i compltely agree with you, you are a GOOD fan for not wanting him. He is a disgrace, I dont want anyone on my team who will go for 1-17 when it counts. Anyone who is a prick in the club house and thinks he is better then everyone. This whole thread annoyoes me. A-Rod is the anti-red sox

[Ray10]

I have the same concerns, but It's not like we have to give up someone for him. If it means him or Manny, then yes, I would rather keep Manny. But if we can get him and add him to our lineup while keeping Ortiz and Manny, than I don't see how anyone can argue that he isn't clutch in october. Are there other 3B or SS options that are HOF calibre and Mr. October that I am unaware of? Thats what I thought.

I see where you are coming from I just think with the solid lineup that we have A-Rod would just be a waste because of how horrible he is come October. For the kind of money that guy is making he should be hitting well in October too not from April-September then sucking come playoffs. I dunno maybe it's just me who thinks he is a collosal waste of cash. I want an all around player not a seasonal player.

[TheKilo]

:lol: :lol:

ANTICLUTCH!!11!!!!!!

[CrespoBlows]

I see where you are coming from I just think with the solid lineup that we have A-Rod would just be a waste because of how horrible he is come October. For the kind of money that guy is making he should be hitting well in October too not from April-September then sucking come playoffs. I dunno maybe it's just me who thinks he is a collosal waste of cash. I want an all around player not a seasonal player.

LOL CLUTZH HITTIN HE DID IT BEFORE IN SEATTLE N HAS HAD A GREAT SERIES N NEW YURK BE4 BUT HE CAN NEVER B CLUTCH AGAIN CUZ HE LOOKS AT THE PITCHER N SAYS FUK U IM GOING TO GET OUT FUK U O WAYT THATS JETER LOL

[TedWilliams101]

If the only thing against a player is that he isn't "clutch" in the playoffs, that says a whole lot about the player.... HE"S GOOD. And the truth is, he isn't anti-clutch either. He had 2 bad series, the last 2 playoffs. In 35 games in the playoffs, he has hit .280 with 6 HR and 16 RBI, including his 2 bad series last season. In all the previous playoff games, he was "clutch". So the whole idea of Arod not being "Clutch" in october isn't all that true.
Comparing Arod to Manram in the playoffs, Manny has a much lower BA at .257, a lower OBP, just barely a higher Slugging, and had 11 more RBI than Arod's equivalent. Yes, he might have had a few more actual "clutch" hits, but come on.

Thats not a good argument agaist a 5-tool HOF player. He can perform in the playoffs, people just tend to remember the last 2 series he has had in the playoffs. Big picture, and the big picture say's he will make anyteam better, in the regular season AND playoffs.

[TheKilo]

If the only thing against a player is that he isn't "clutch" in the playoffs, that says a whole lot about the player.... HE"S GOOD. And the truth is, he isn't anti-clutch either. He had 2 bad series, the last 2 playoffs. In 35 games in the playoffs, he has hit .280 with 6 HR and 16 RBI, including his 2 bad series last season. In all the previous playoff games, he was "clutch". So the whole idea of Arod not being "Clutch" in october isn't all that true.
Comparing Arod to Manram in the playoffs, Manny has a much lower BA at .257, a lower OBP, just barely a higher Slugging, and had 11 more RBI than Arod's equivalent. Yes, he might have had a few more actual "clutch" hits, but come on.

Thats not a good argument agaist a 5-tool HOF player. He can perform in the playoffs, people just tend to remember the last 2 series he has had in the playoffs. Big picture, and the big picture say's he will make anyteam better, in the regular season AND playoffs.

I think this may be the best post you've ever written.

[ksushi]

Who can guess the least clutch player of all time?

Oh and according to clutch stats by prospectus, Bill Mueller was in the top 15 least clutch players of all time.

[TedWilliams101]

I would say Manny is one of the most clutch hitter of all time, but if you look closely at Arod's stats, he has done his job. In his career, Arod is hitting .304 with RISP, 115HR, .554 slug, and .398 OBP. Not to shabby. For HR, Arod has hit 7 walk-offs, 165 Go-ahead, and 41 gametying. In 71 more games, Manny has hit 3 walk-offs, 145 go-ahead, and 43 game tying. Arod sounds pretty damned good, huh.

Sample size guys. Sample size. Don't judge a player on a handful of games he has played, judge him on his career. Through Arod's career, he has been one of the best players in the game, a great situational hitter, and has done pretty good overall in the playoffs. Thats the facts. Also, there is a great article on the truth behind "clutch". Read:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=betweenthenumbers/ortiz/060405

[ksushi]

The most clutch hitter ever was mark grace... go figure.

[TedWilliams101]

And guess what, Arod has done better in the playoffs than EVERYONE on our team other than Ortiz and Manny. Yep, thats right. Lugo has been terrible in 2 series. Drew has been horrible, i mean, really bad, through 39 playoff games. Youk hasn't really played in the playoffs, Lowell has been horrible, Tek has done as well as Arod, and everyone else doesn't have playoff experience. There goes that argument. So what is the real answer why people don't want to see Arod on the Red Sox... because they can't get past the fact that he's a Yankee, an unhappy one at that, and because of all the shit RS fans have put against him. Thats the root.

[CrespoBlows]

Well done, Ted.

You get my official two thumbs up. An honor not often bestowed on people.

[Taliesin]

Well done, Ted.

You get my official two thumbs up. An honor not often bestowed on people.


I'm not sure which one of you is the bigger fool. I will bestow the duel idiot prize for the evening...otherwise known as the 5/23 I've had 3 Vodka Tonics and 4 beers moron of the night award (and it is prestigious) to either one of you. You decide where you pick it up. I'm more concerned I'm arguing w/ 13 y/o's.

[CrespoBlows]

I'm not sure which one of you is the bigger fool. I will bestow the duel idiot prize for the evening...otherwise known as the 5/23 I've had 3 Vodka Tonics and 4 beers moron of the night award (and it is prestigious) to either one of you. You decide where you pick it up. I'm more concerned I'm arguing w/ 13 y/o's.

http://www.moderndrunkardmagazine.com/issues/05_03/images/12-questions-hdr.jpg

You must be, if you think you've scored any points so far.

Go on. State your point of view. Then we'll decide who is granted the title of drunk poster.

[adam123]

We could use him to bat 4th ? Looks like JD pushing to hard .

[TGov]

I was a big fan of A-Rod's before he was a Yankees and everyone knows how it goes with a yankee, well atleast Red Sox fans know... but in past years, I've been see more cheap shots A-Rod takes (EX: Slap to Arroyo, Elbow to Pedroia, there's more but those I know) I wouldn't want a player like that... Love him when he's good, hate him when he's bad... He's not a team player and he (IMO) doesn't do anything with team chemistry... I think team chemistry is one of the most important things you can have in a team... A-Rod is a star, he should go somewhere other than NY and Boston and play SS again... Go to the Cubs and back with Pinella...

[BoSox21]

everyone talks about chemistry but that means nothing in baseball, camaraderie is the word you're looking for. Chemistry is John Stockton knowing where Karl Malone was on the court, the only chemistry formed in baseball that matters is the catcher developing a chemistry with the pitcher. A team with good camaraderie is a collection of guys who enjoy being in the clubhouse with each other each day and having fun on the field and in the dugout

[TGov]

everyone talks about chemistry but that means nothing in baseball, camaraderie is the word you're looking for. Chemistry is John Stockton knowing where Karl Malone was on the court, the only chemistry formed in baseball that matters is the catcher developing a chemistry with the pitcher. A team with good camaraderie is a collection of guys who enjoy being in the clubhouse with each other each day and having fun on the field and in the dugout

alright, maybe that's the word I was looking for, but you knew what I meant...

[a700hitter]

Why would we want a guy who should end up with every record in the book? Why would we want that?:rolleyes:

[castigs850]

i dont see why this thread says he is no longer an option. has anyone on the sox said they dont want him if he is available? not that i've heard of. IMO he is still very much an option, and a real good one at that

[TedWilliams101]

I think Sox fans are overreacting to the Arod elbow thing. If you actual thought about it rationally, Pedroia did try and take out Cano during a DP situation earlier in the game. Pedroia was so far off the bag it is questionably whether he could have touched the bag, as is the rule. Arod simply did a similar thing to Pedroia in a sort of retaliation, basically saying that they saw that. And Arod was ON the bag and did nothing more than try and put his body infront of Pedroia to break up the DP. Pedroia was feet from the bag heading right at Cano to try and break up the DP. Bais?...

Just because Arod isn't a Kevin Millar type doesn't mean that he wouldnt "fit" with the team. Remember, there are many great professional, quiet players who have played on the Sox (Lowell, Loretta, etc etc) who have done well and added to the team. You don't have to be a Red Sox Idiot to "make" the team. All you have to do is play together.

Go on guys, keeping reaching for a reason to hate Arod.

[TheKilo]

The hard slide is not the issue. Throwing an elbow with Pedroia in the air is.

[riverside sluggers]

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=1003059&format=text

Not concerning Arod, moreso about the seemingly never ending revolving door of players switching sides. Ortiz made me literally almost throw up with his quote in Time magazine saying he'll never rule out signing with the Yankees. While yes comforting to know hes signed thru 2011, I dont want to get that image ever in my head of him donning pinstripes

[TheKilo]

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=1003059&format=text

Not concerning Arod, moreso about the seemingly never ending revolving door of players switching sides. Ortiz made me literally almost throw up with his quote in Time magazine saying he'll never rule out signing with the Yankees. While yes comforting to know hes signed thru 2011, I dont want to get that image ever in my head of him donning pinstripes

Why? At least he's not feigning being genuine like Damon or Clemens.

I bet if the Yankees pay Schilling $15 mil for next year he wouldn't rule out going there.

Root for the laundry.

[a700hitter]

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=1003059&format=text

Not concerning Arod, moreso about the seemingly never ending revolving door of players switching sides. Ortiz made me literally almost throw up with his quote in Time magazine saying he'll never rule out signing with the Yankees. While yes comforting to know hes signed thru 2011, I dont want to get that image ever in my head of him donning pinstripesHe's one of the most genuine guys in the Sport. He's doesn't dish the usual BS for fan and media consumption. He just tells the truth. It's a business, and it could happen. I am sick of the "team disrespected me" crap from the players, and "the [new team] made me feel more wanted." I am sick of the FO saying that they "made a good faith offer" or that they didn't get a chance to counter offer. Let's get it out in the open. Our guys would stay if the Sox made competitve offers, and the team will not make competitive offers to those guys that they really don't want to keep. That's the whole truth.