Clemens

[schillingouttheks]

heres my justification on why clemens would come to boston, and this would only happen if we were not able to grab randy johnson, and yes hear me out, i know he most likely wouldnt come because of his family, but truthfully...im not so sure about that:

1. he sees how good the sox are doing, which of late, is a very true statement to make, the astros lose sight of the wild card, and he waives his no trade clause.

2. baseball is a business...THE MONEY WE OFFER. please, any pitcher would take a lot of money to play in boston. the players go where the money is.

3. because he still has respect and connections to boston

4. because everyone would like to be on the redsox team that finally wins the world series before the so called "curse" expires, the redsox "reverse the curse" team that is, and he would love to be a part of it, as he was one of the best pitchers the redsox ever had, and dont talk about pedro please, hes the best pitcher htat may have ever walked the earth, and yes pedro is great and one of a kind, but for his time, clemens is the best.

5. BECAUSE BOSTON WOULD LOVE HIM BACK AND HIS FAMILY WOULD LOVE TO SEE HIM WIN A WORLD SERIES THERE!!! are u telling me that his family wouldnt want to see him win a world series where he began his stellar perfect career?

if RJ doesnt come here, u can bet clemens is a possibility. and also, how cool would it be to see RJ vs Clemens in game 7 of the ALCS?? doesnt matter which team either pitches for, but how cool would that be.

[Zenny]

He doesn't want to move away from his family. He wants to spend time with his kids, see them play ball and take them to school. He can't do that 2,000 miles away. That's the whole reason he came out of retirement.

[schillingouttheks]

with clemens u never know...his kids would love to see him win another ring, even if its not in houston...if it were my dad moving to houston, sure it would be hard, but i would love it if he won another ring.

[Ortiz34]

Clemens is not going to come back to Boston. That is final. Hes not going to pack up and move back again after he just settled in houston. Besides, i dont want him back with boston. Im not denying he was a great pitcher, and he was a good part of the redsox team. However, how old is he now? I think hes 43 or 42, and there is no way he can carry on pitching well. He is going to blow his arm out, and the redsox will waste their money. Only person ever to keep pitching at such an old age was Nolan Ryan. On the Nolan Ryan scale, I wouldn't even rate roger as high as a 7.

[schillingouttheks]

u never know, randy johnson is pretty old too and he doesnt seem to be slowing donw.

[Ortiz34]

But Johnson had a perfect game, that takes skill. Maybe Roger is getting some luck?

[schillingouttheks]

roger is still one of the best and greatest pitchers on the mound today. randy johnson is still great sure. but u cant say luck doesnt play a factor in perfect games.

[Ortiz34]

it always seems we are arguing.

[Tek04]

Originally posted by Zenny@Jul 11 2004, 08:28 PM
He doesn't want to move away from his family. He wants to spend time with his kids, see them play ball and take them to school. He can't do that 2,000 miles away. That's the whole reason he came out of retirement.
Yea I think this would only be for the rest of the season tho...he probally will retire for good next season

[elsrbueno]

Nomah,
If Roger was going to go to the place that would offer the most money....he'd be back in New York as a Yankee...

He went to Houston to be with his family, and I seriously doubt he'd leave that opportunity. He already has a ring....

[CrespoBlows]

forget it, he will never leave Houston. This is Clemens last year, his contract clauses with the Astros are too good for him to go somewhere else.

[Sizzlin22]

This was a stupid Rumor started out of absouloute no where by Tim Kurkin or how ever you spell it on baseball tonight it's the dumbest thing ive ever heard and it's never going to happen.

[schillingouttheks]

lol thanks for reviving a dead thread...

[schillingouttheks]

OK...NEVER DOUBT ME ON SOMETHING LIKE THIS AGAIN...WE WERE SO DAMN CLOSE.

i was just watching channel 4 and bob lobell said that we have claimed clemens off of waivers, but houston pulled him back.

ok...i almost called it..gimme some props for that...i started this godforsaken thread.

[empirestrikesback26]

i thought all those were today, i was confused beyond belief. Yanks would have blocked him anyway.

[Zenny]

Let me clarify a couple things here. First off, the Yankees couldn't have blocked the Sox. The Sox have a worse record and those teams get to claim him first. If claimed, a team with a better record does not get to claim him or block him; that's not how it works. Second, of course the Astros were going to pull him back, they just weren't going to give him up for free. They pulled him back to discuss a trade with the Sox. I'm not positive on that point, correct me if I'm wrong.

[YanksHater213]

alright, my input...

i think that if we got him, we would be set. albeit a long shot, but this would be one of the bets things to happen to the Sox in a long while

[schillingouttheks]

no ones given me my props for calling this thing yet...and u all doubted that we would have anything to do with him... :angry:

[CalvnHobs6]

schillingouttheks - props.

God I hope we get Clemens back.

[empirestrikesback26]

Originally posted by Zenny@Aug 20 2004, 02:35 AM
Let me clarify a couple things here. First off, the Yankees couldn't have blocked the Sox. The Sox have a worse record and those teams get to claim him first. If claimed, a team with a better record does not get to claim him or block him; that's not how it works. Second, of course the Astros were going to pull him back, they just weren't going to give him up for free. They pulled him back to discuss a trade with the Sox. I'm not positive on that point, correct me if I'm wrong.
it doesnt matter who has the better record, you already used your pick to get myers, putting you at the bottom next to the yanks. Now if the yanks were to do something, then yes, record applies.

[yeszir]

Players (good players) get put on waivers to judge interest. That is why Clemens was put on, its kind of like putting a player on the trading block.
I doubt the sox will get him, and I shudder to think what we might have to give in return.

[CalvnHobs6]

According to the Boston Globe, the deal is dead. I'll find the article.

[CalvnHobs6]

From
http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/reds..._is_waived_off/ (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2004/08/20/clemens_deal_is_waived_off/)


Clemens deal is waived off
By Bob Hohler, Globe Staff | August 20, 2004

CHICAGO -- The Red Sox were ready to welcome Roger Clemens back to Boston. His uniform number (21) was available. Pedro Martinez, who has expressed the utmost respect for Clemens, almost certainly would have made some room for the Rocket near the locker Clemens long used and Martinez now occupies. Curt Schilling would have been thrilled to pitch with his onetime mentor. Tim Wakefield would have been tickled to work again with his friend and former teammate. And the Sox would readily acknowledge they could do far worse than finding a slot for the future Hall of Famer in their rotation.

To that end, the Sox recently entered a claim on Clemens when the Houston Astros tried to pass him through waivers. The prospect was tantalizing, Clemens returning to the scene of some of his greatest glories and taking another shot at leading the Sox to a championship. And the Rocket no longer would need to work with former general manager Dan Duquette, who angered Clemens in his final season with the Sox by suggesting he was in "the twilight of his career."

Trouble was, the Sox lost any possible shot at Clemens when the Astros pulled him off the waiver wire. It's also very likely that teams lower than the Red Sox in the standings would also have put in a claim for the ace, with so much need for pitching out there and Clemens being a bargain with just the remaining portion of a one-year, $5 million deal. If that were the case, the Sox would not have been able to even discuss a trade with Houston.

Teams generally place many players on waivers after the July 31 deadline for non-waiver trades, in part to gauge the market. And once a team pulls a player back from waivers, it must wait at least 30 days before placing him on waivers again. That means Clemens is highly unlikely to land anywhere else this season.

As for the Sox, given the opportunity, they gladly would have tried to work out a reasonable deal for Clemens, who has been disappointed after coming out of retirement by the Astros' subpar season. But Boston's waiver claim was aimed as much at blocking a potential bid by the Yankees to acquire Clemens as it was to express their own interest in the Rocket. The last thing the Sox wanted to do as the postseason approaches was allow the Yankees to shore up their struggling rotation with a big-game pitcher of the Rocket's caliber.

[empirestrikesback26]

Was ever really that much of a deal anyway? I mean I highly doubt he would leave his family to go back to the east coast.

[schillingouttheks]

i dont think he has that much input at this..and by the looks of the article and how records play into it...i think this means the red sox blocked the yankees!!!! :lol:

[empirestrikesback26]

impossible the red sox are below the yankees, unless the yanks made a move then they re back on top.

[schillingouttheks]

doesnt mattterrrr..i heard it on news today we blocked yankees form making anything happen so thats what i go by...we blocked the yanks hahahahahah :lol: . i wont be forgetting this for a long time. we blocked the rocket from goin back to NY. although it woulda been nice to have pedro AND schilling AND the rocket.

[empirestrikesback26]

Originally posted by schillingouttheks@Aug 20 2004, 10:28 PM
doesnt mattterrrr..i heard it on news today we blocked yankees form making anything happen so thats what i go by...we blocked the yanks hahahahahah :lol: . i wont be forgetting this for a long time. we blocked the rocket from goin back to NY. although it woulda been nice to have pedro AND schilling AND the rocket.
I dont want that jackass traiter anyway. We gave him a hummer and everything for his retirement. I have lost all respect for that guy. Isn't he injured anyway? Still the we 've blocked you guys from a lot of players of the years. I'll get over it.

[schillingouttheks]

lol...welcome to the club of the roger clemens traitor

[empirestrikesback26]

Big club.

[yeszir]

Originally posted by schillingouttheks@Aug 20 2004, 10:48 PM
lol...welcome to the club of the roger clemens traitor
I was going to say welcome to the club of Red Sox Nation. We've had many more traitors than Clemens.

[schillingouttheks]

true.

[CrespoBlows]

Would he even waive his no trade clause?

[empirestrikesback26]

If he has one, why are we even having this discussion? There's no way he would wave it.

[elsrbueno]

I knew the Roger Clemens thing would get a rise out of RSN.

Tons of players get put on waivers without a deal in place. Many teams that want to shed payroll, guage interest in a player, make roster moves, etc put players on waivers and NEVER intend on trading them.

In fact, it is often speculated that players are put on waivers in mass quanities in order to mask a potential deal. They'll just pull a player back who gets claimed.

What does this news mean? According to the article I posted a while ago, this means that Roger Clemens (if traded) can ONLY be traded to Boston. Theo probably put the claim in because they knew the Astros wouldn't just let Boston take Roger for free, and they wanted to prevent the Yankees from having a shot at him.

Will Roger return to Boston? Probably not.

[schillingouttheks]

wait but what youre saying is that if a deal for roger was going to happen...it could ONLY be with the sox? and youre 100% sure?

thats kickass :)

[elsrbueno]

Originally posted by schillingouttheks@Aug 24 2004, 12:36 PM
wait but what youre saying is that if a deal for roger was going to happen...it could ONLY be with the sox? and youre 100% sure?

thats kickass :)
With the MLB rules, I'm not usually 100% sure.

This is quoting the article I posted a while ago:


If a player is claimed, but only by one team, the player can be traded only to the team that claims him.

If a player is claimed by more than one team, the club with the worst record in that player's league gets priority -- and the player can be traded only to that team.

If a player is claimed only by teams in the other league, the club with the worst record in the other league gets priority -- and the player can be traded just to that team.

So I am officially correcting myself here. IF the Red Sox are the ONLY team to have claimed Roger, than that makes them the only team who can trade for him.

IF another team (in the AL) with a worse record than Boston did claim him, he can only be traded to THAT team.

So the appropriate question is: Did anyone besides the Red Sox put a claim on Clemens?

The one thing that I am 100% sure of is that Roger CANNOT be traded to the Yankees before September 1st (and if he were traded after September 1st, he couldn't play for them in the playoffs anyway)

[empirestrikesback26]

He is staying in Houston, I'm 100% sure.

[elsrbueno]

Originally posted by empirestrikesback26@Aug 24 2004, 03:11 PM
He is staying in Houston, I'm 100% sure.
Mark this day in history, because it may never happen again.

I agree with Empirestrikesback26 about something.

I don't believe Clemens will be traded from Houston. Why?

Clemens has fan power. He's a home town hero in Houston, and when you're not winning, you need SOMEthing to bring the fans to the park. Clemens gives Houston that. People come out to the park to see Clemens play, even if Houston's out of the race. That means something.

Would Clemens really want to come back to Boston? Probably not. I think all his problems with Boston were related to Duquette, who is long gone, but look at it this way:

Clemens has already won a ring. He has nothing to prove. If he wanted to play in the north east and be on a contender, he would have re-signed with the Yankees.

The bottom line is: Clemens wants to pitch at home, he wants to be with his family.

Houston wants him to stay, Clemens wants to stay. Where's the motivation for a deal?

[yeszir]

Originally posted by elsrbueno@Aug 24 2004, 04:24 PM
Houston wants him to stay, Clemens wants to stay. Where's the motivation for a deal?
$$$$$. But I see your point, and agree with you.

[schillingouttheks]

right but if clemens came to boston and won the world series here, which is quite possible...he would have a roster spot on the "reverse the curse" team. even though theres no such thing...

[empirestrikesback26]

I don't think there is anything that could get him out of houston.

[ahhchon]

Originally posted by Ortiz34@Jul 11 2004, 08:02 PM
Clemens is not going to come back to Boston. That is final. Hes not going to pack up and move back again after he just settled in houston. Besides, i dont want him back with boston. Im not denying he was a great pitcher, and he was a good part of the redsox team. However, how old is he now? I think hes 43 or 42, and there is no way he can carry on pitching well. He is going to blow his arm out, and the redsox will waste their money. Only person ever to keep pitching at such an old age was Nolan Ryan. On the Nolan Ryan scale, I wouldn't even rate roger as high as a 7.
i'm sorry ortiz but you are totally wrong. remember what happened the last time the red sox said clemens was too old? remember what happened the last time the red sox said clemens would blow out his arm?

what did he do? just pitch TWO 20 win seasons (i believe, too lazy to look up) for toronto before being traded to the yanks where he goes to win a world series, get his 300th win, pitch another 20 win season and get 4K strikeouts for his career.

clemens might be old but he sure doesn't look like he's slowing down. he's a pretty big guy and seems to know how to take care of his body. i bet he has 2-3 more good years left.

either way, if he comes to the sox and wins the series here he'll definately retire for good. who needs to play baseball after helping the sox win the series? i'de do nothing for the rest of my life.

john

[schillingouttheks]

ahhchon,

first of all, he said this about 2 months ago before this whole ordeal about clemens coming to boston started with the waiver stuff.

second, the thread was kinda dead...

[ahhchon]

:-/ wasn't really paying any attention to the dates. just browsing around and thought this was a heated topic. BOOO me.

john

[schillingouttheks]

lol...

just noticing a dead topic on an alive thread. but that was a good post.

[yankeehater]

maybe nexy year we wil get him somebody should put him in a red sox uni like the yankee fans do :P :P :P :P

[empirestrikesback26]

no, it makes more sense when the yankee fans do it because, vitually anyone is possible to get.

[yankeehater]

wow u guys sure do wish alot, i betcha u guys wont get any1 big, and also how do u change uniforms in photoshop??

[empirestrikesback26]

I don't know.

[yankeehater]

then how do u get urs?

[empirestrikesback26]

Originally posted by yankeehater@Sep 19 2004, 08:53 AM
then how do u get urs?
I stole it.

[yankeehater]

o interesting :thumbdown:

[schillingouttheks]

yankeehater...ive been noticing how u dig up almost month old dead threads and when u do, nothing u post is realistic in any scenario whatsoever, and then u go off running your hole about sometihng completely irrelevant to the topic of the thread. so do us all a favor and...

SHUT THE FUCK UP.

[2090]

why would he disgrace himself?

[CalvnHobs6]

This thread is 2.5 months old. Go kill yourself.

[schillingouttheks]

lol, yet more of calvns numerous posts as more stupid people join the board...

when u said that i laughed hard...thanks for that.

[CalvnHobs6]

Anytime.

[papi4prez]

that was random and awesome